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      09-12-2009, 11:00 AM   #1
arrutled
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M3 front suspension parts

Well the wishbones and tension rods are in
cost: $245 to install and align.
Results:
Toe:
before alignment = 2 degrees in
after = 1/16 in

Left camber -1.0 degree
Right Camber - 0.75 degree
Average camber from Larry's tool = - 0.6 degrees

feel:
Crisper? Definitely
cornering? Feels more planted
faster at autocross? Maybe not faster, but thats my own fault. The turning was greatly improved.

overall decision after a couple of twisty's: need more rear grip coming out of turns with foot on the gas. This was verified on the first lap of autocross. 360 baby!

Next: front sway. See below
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Last edited by arrutled; 09-24-2009 at 09:50 AM.
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      09-13-2009, 11:00 AM   #2
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Congrats! I'm really surprised that you didn't get a little more negative camber. I might be misremembering, but I thought reports were that with the M3 parts, you get to -1.5 deg, and the removal of the alignment pin would get to ~-2.3-2.4
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      09-13-2009, 11:08 AM   #3
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I did the front alignment pin removal and it only gave me -.2* of camber.

Congrats on the upgrade. Ionnotti and I will be smoking you next weekend after yesterday tho... lol
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      09-13-2009, 11:26 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bdh821 View Post
I did the front alignment pin removal and it only gave me -.2* of camber.

Congrats on the upgrade. Ionnotti and I will be smoking you next weekend after yesterday tho... lol
FACT
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      09-13-2009, 12:16 PM   #5
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Point of clarification.. it only ADDED -.2 deg (I had more than -.2 deg from the factory)? There are a few others here who wound up with -.6 deg total after alignment pin removal. I slotted mine an additional 3/16", and now have a total of -1.6 to -1.7 camber. I was banking on having -2.3 (or so) deg with the M3 parts.

Did you know that I have a pretty nice camber gauge in the Chapter AX van? It is under the passenger seat. We can do some comparos on Sunday!
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      09-13-2009, 10:05 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by and 1 View Post
FACT
I don't think Ive ever beat either one of you! But you give me added motivation!
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      09-13-2009, 10:09 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryn View Post
Congrats! I'm really surprised that you didn't get a little more negative camber. I might be misremembering, but I thought reports were that with the M3 parts, you get to -1.5 deg, and the removal of the alignment pin would get to ~-2.3-2.4
The M3 wishbones are supposed to give you an additional -.75 camber. Does anyone know the stock camber settings? Either way lets compare on sunday with your camber tool.

Also, dont your springs give you a bit additional camber?
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      09-13-2009, 10:31 PM   #8
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no idea...i'd guess pretty close to 0 though
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      09-14-2009, 08:11 AM   #9
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Yes, lowering gives you added negative camber, for sure. Former moderator 'mikeo' is not lowered, and we removed our alignment pins at about the same time. He got to -.6 deg with just the alignment pin removal, and sliding the strut over. At the same time, since I was lowered and with the additional slotting, I was at -1.6.

Front the factory, it is supposed to be -.2 to -.3 up front. So, I was wondering if WITH the M3 parts, arrutled is now at -.2 deg?? That means the M3 parts did little for arrutled, if that's where he's at right now.

I agree with ALL that it would be great to have some nice weather on Sunday, and we can grab the camber tool to see where we are all at. Because of the potential for not being level, we normally take a left and right reading, then average.
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      09-14-2009, 08:56 AM   #10
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If I read this correctly, the max negative camber from the factory is approximately -0.3 deg. Andy's car following the M3 part install was left at -1.0 deg (left, which should be at the limits with the alignment pin still installed) and -0.75 deg (right, providing a 0.25 deg difference left to right for drivability on a crowned road). Therefore, the M3 part install added somewhere in the ballpark of 0.6 to 0.7 deg of negative camber, which is right in line of what Larry was told by others that had done the M3 part install.
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      09-14-2009, 09:52 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larryn View Post
Front the factory, it is supposed to be -.2 to -.3 up front. So, I was wondering if WITH the M3 parts, arrutled is now at -.2 deg?? That means the M3 parts did little for arrutled, if that's where he's at right now.
Like mike said above.....I am at - 1.0 left and - 0.75 right.
The m3 parts did exactly what was expected of them.
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      09-14-2009, 10:07 AM   #12
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i have alot more negative camber up front since lowering my car
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      09-14-2009, 07:52 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arrutled View Post
Like mike said above.....I am at - 1.0 left and - 0.75 right.
The m3 parts did exactly what was expected of them.

DOH! Totally missed that one! Sorry.
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      09-15-2009, 05:30 PM   #14
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Don't mean to thread-jack, but...
How do you get more negative camber on the front wheels from factory? I assume the "pin" removal will allow just a small fraction of negative camber. Are there other ways to adjust/configure for more negative camber?


Edit: Never mind. I looked at the strut-top and realized they can be rotated for minor adjustments.

Last edited by sodara; 09-15-2009 at 07:13 PM.
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      09-17-2009, 11:34 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bdh821 View Post
I did the front alignment pin removal and it only gave me -.2* of camber.

Congrats on the upgrade. Ionnotti and I will be smoking you next weekend after yesterday tho... lol
How can i do to removal the front alignment pin? anydody have a grafic of this.
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      09-17-2009, 11:39 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitig View Post
How can i do to removal the front alignment pin? anydody have a grafic of this.
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...=alignment+pin
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      09-17-2009, 02:15 PM   #17
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Thanks sysfailur. my poor language dificult my search.
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      09-23-2009, 09:33 PM   #18
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OK, So Mike and I just installed the M3 front sway. As opposed to buying endlinks for 100 bucks I bought the 26.5 mm M3 sway for 205 bucks from HP autowerks. Installs easily and does not have the 19mm kink ours has. Weighs the same. The stock bar also does not have the washers to prevent the bushings from moving along the bar and the M3 bar does have these washers. The bushings it comes with are much better engineered and a stiffer rubber. Just install the new brackets facing the correct direction!!!! right mike? Ok, so the test drive you are wondering? Well, first off were some quick turns. I felt much more confident flooring it out of the turn (very noticeable on on ramps as well). At no point was I worried about too much torque oversteer which plagued me last autocross (1 complete 360 and saved another spin luckily both coming out of right sweepers). Secondly was some simulated slaloming. I got up to 50 MPH before I felt any loss of traction. We will see if this is in my head this weekend at autocross! Cheers. No loss in ride quality either!

BTW I have the sway Larry gave me and the bushings to go along with it. If you would like this sway im sure larry wouldnt mind if I passed it along.
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Last edited by arrutled; 09-24-2009 at 09:56 AM.
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      09-23-2009, 09:48 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Just install the new brackets facing the correct direction!!!! right mike?
I don't wanna talk about it.... Just be glad I didn't get the cutoff wheel out and just trim the tab down. And, yes, I did think about it.
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      09-24-2009, 09:59 AM   #20
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Quote:
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I don't wanna talk about it.... Just be glad I didn't get the cutoff wheel out and just trim the tab down. And, yes, I did think about it.
for anyone working with mike in the future and he yells mother f'er or G'Damn't (twice in two weeks) from under the car and won't tell you whats wrong don't worry because he knows how to fix stuff! Thanks for the excitement though mike!
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      09-24-2009, 10:45 AM   #21
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It wouldn't have been so bad if I hadn't taken the directional parts under the car with me to make sure I knew which direction the went.... and still put things together backwards. Actually, I think I put it together upside down, which turned out to be backwards once under the car.
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