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      03-24-2011, 12:06 PM   #23
HondaGoneRogue
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Oh, I was talking regular 135i exhaust prices.
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2008 AW 135i, Whats a mod?
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      03-24-2011, 12:11 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by adrean8j View Post
If the price range is anything like the price range of their motorcycle exhausts then this thing will be EXPENSIVE (similar to Eisenmann prices)....but it WILL look and sound good..


Actually I was just about to pick up the Akrapovic slip-on for my Triumph Daytona 675...its only $640. Titanium, and Carbon Fiber....not bad IMO.
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      03-24-2011, 12:15 PM   #25
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http://www.capristoexhaust.us/Lambor...p/lp%20640.htm


look cheap, only $19,950.00 !!!!!

u gotta be freakin kidding.. insane .. even on a car like that..

well they do give you free shipping ... so i guess its worth it now.. LMAO
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      03-24-2011, 01:33 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Das Ein View Post
Actually I was just about to pick up the Akrapovic slip-on for my Triumph Daytona 675...its only $640. Titanium, and Carbon Fiber....not bad IMO.
Sweet you have a D675! I guess you DO have good taste. I have a StripleR w/Arrow twin-cans not the low boy. But back on topic Akra's are generally a bit more expensive (as are Arrow's) than other offerings even in the motocycle arena.
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SGM was God's color and has been recalled to heaven.
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      03-24-2011, 01:43 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by adrean8j View Post
Sweet you have a D675! I guess you DO have good taste. I have a StripleR w/Arrow twin-cans not the low boy. But back on topic Akra's are generally a bit more expensive (as are Arrow's) than other offerings even in the motocycle arena.

Thanks man! Love the Street Triple R's too! Trying to decide between the Arrow and Akra...


Just got my European Car mag in the mail and it has a big article on Akrapovic...got me all jazz'd up.
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      03-24-2011, 02:46 PM   #28
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Yeah Triumphs are the bomb. I will have to take your word for it because they don't have European Car Mag. here at the PX's...
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      03-24-2011, 04:07 PM   #29
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For 12 HP and a great sound I would drop $2000. That's about it. Consider the Porsche sport exhaust is $3500 and doesn't provide any HP bump at all.
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      03-24-2011, 06:19 PM   #30
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$6K is too aggressive of a guess, why would it actually cost more than the one for the M3, which is even more complicated, has more materials, etc.? And they would be pricing themselves out if the exhausts costs 15% of the car. We sre not talking about an exotic car here.

A lot will depend on the Euro conversion, which is not helping one bit, but I'd venture it has to be way less than $6K, prolly half that, if they want to have meaningful sales.
Why is it way too aggressive?
I would assume they are going to make a full titanium system, not a slip-on or steel one.
And a full titanium system, is $5000 for the 335i one, $5800 for the M3 one. Not to mention, there's no reason it would be less complicated or have less material (unless you're talking about the few inches less of pipe they need; but even then) than the M3 or 335i.
Not to mention, there are a lot more 335i's and M3's; which is why they'll most likely only make one system (full titanium), with the lack of potential customers. And with fewer potential units sold cause of the smaller market, they'll have to recoup that in a high price.
Even if it doesn't end up at $6000+(a small markup over the M3 model), it definitely won't be cheaper than the $5000 335i price point.
For what you want, half of $6000, you can just barely buy the slip-on titanium system for the 335i.
Don't mean to be the Debbie Downer here, but with so few of us, I doubt they'll make the 3 systems that M3 and 335i owners are offered, and they definitely wont price whatever they release at a price point under their M3 and 335i counterparts.
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      03-24-2011, 06:50 PM   #31
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Why is it way too aggressive?
I would assume they are going to make a full titanium system, not a slip-on or steel one.
And a full titanium system, is $5000 for the 335i one, $5800 for the M3 one. Not to mention, there's no reason it would be less complicated or have less material (unless you're talking about the few inches less of pipe they need; but even then) than the M3 or 335i.
Not to mention, there are a lot more 335i's and M3's; which is why they'll most likely only make one system (full titanium), with the lack of potential customers. And with fewer potential units sold cause of the smaller market, they'll have to recoup that in a high price.
Even if it doesn't end up at $6000+(a small markup over the M3 model), it definitely won't be cheaper than the $5000 335i price point.
For what you want, half of $6000, you can just barely buy the slip-on titanium system for the 335i.
Don't mean to be the Debbie Downer here, but with so few of us, I doubt they'll make the 3 systems that M3 and 335i owners are offered, and they definitely wont price whatever they release at a price point under their M3 and 335i counterparts.
This is my opinion, and you don't have to agree with it. Why do I think $6K is too aggressive - very simple - the pricing is too aggressive relative to the value of the car. $6K on a $47K car is 13% of the value of the car. For what - a slightly exotic sound, that delivers a handful (if that) of real HP gains. Of course it will deliver intanglibles like aesthetics, looks, perhaps perceived status. And to each their own, to some maybe all that is worth it. Heck, as we know there are always label lovers that would buy it only so they can brag they have the most expensive exhaust made for the platform.

The issue is not whether the manufacturer can justify the price, but can the buyer do so? Sure, based on your reference to the M3 and 335i, it sounds like the manufacturer can charge a ballpark figure near there on a the relative basis. But will buyers fork out that much for a mod which at the end of the day is largely sensory. Or would they rather spend that amount on upgrading the car in other ways (go-fast mods), or even spend it in a completely different way (e.g. pay down their mortgage).

The manufacturer I am sure will have his own internal profit metrics. They can decide to price it high and expect a handful of customers (i.e. boutique style approach). Or they can decide to price it lower and rely on higher volume. At the end of the day, it is totally their prerogative, and I can't blame them whichever way they decide to go. But they also will have to factor the cusomter's demand curve, and how price elastic it is. Given this is an 'entry level' ///M (absolutely no pun intended), I recon the demand curve of the average customer is very price sensitive/elastic.

But just saying $6K is not aggressive because that is what they charge for other cars bears no relevance. Compare to other companies out there (see my link to Capristo which by no means is less impressive than Akra). See their craftsmanship and product base, and then see what they are charging for pieces of art for cars that cost 8 times or more than the 1 ///M.
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      03-25-2011, 01:58 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by ///M1 View Post
This is my opinion, and you don't have to agree with it. Why do I think $6K is too aggressive - very simple - the pricing is too aggressive relative to the value of the car. $6K on a $47K car is 13% of the value of the car. For what - a slightly exotic sound, that delivers a handful (if that) of real HP gains. Of course it will deliver intanglibles like aesthetics, looks, perhaps perceived status. And to each their own, to some maybe all that is worth it. Heck, as we know there are always label lovers that would buy it only so they can brag they have the most expensive exhaust made for the platform.

The issue is not whether the manufacturer can justify the price, but can the buyer do so? Sure, based on your reference to the M3 and 335i, it sounds like the manufacturer can charge a ballpark figure near there on a the relative basis. But will buyers fork out that much for a mod which at the end of the day is largely sensory. Or would they rather spend that amount on upgrading the car in other ways (go-fast mods), or even spend it in a completely different way (e.g. pay down their mortgage).

The manufacturer I am sure will have his own internal profit metrics. They can decide to price it high and expect a handful of customers (i.e. boutique style approach). Or they can decide to price it lower and rely on higher volume. At the end of the day, it is totally their prerogative, and I can't blame them whichever way they decide to go. But they also will have to factor the cusomter's demand curve, and how price elastic it is. Given this is an 'entry level' ///M (absolutely no pun intended), I recon the demand curve of the average customer is very price sensitive/elastic.

But just saying $6K is not aggressive because that is what they charge for other cars bears no relevance. Compare to other companies out there (see my link to Capristo which by no means is less impressive than Akra). See their craftsmanship and product base, and then see what they are charging for pieces of art for cars that cost 8 times or more than the 1 ///M.

How is comparing to other companies relevant at all... the akra exhaust for M3 and 335i is 11% of the value of those respective cars, 13% for the 1M isn't so far from 11%; yet that's the price point they set. If buyers won't go for a 1M exhaust priced so high, why do M3 and 335i owners? What you're doing comparing Akra to Capristo is arguing that Akra is overpriced. The fact that other companies offer comparable products at a lower price point has no bearing on how much the Akra exhaust for the 1M will be since it had no bearing on how much Akra priced their exhausts for the M3 and 335i!
Also, why d'you think the demand curve for the average 1M will be very price sensitive/elastic? "Entry Level" is just a name, the 1M is MORE expensive than a 335i (who's exhaust is priced at $5000). If anything, 1M owners are also going to be more willing to blow money on their car than 335i owners since most of us have committed to a car thats had 0 reviews.

Whether it's $6000 or $5000, its still too expensive for me; but that's the price points they've set for the M3 and 335i. I don't see how the fact that buyers won't go for it, and that other companies offer exhausts for cheaper will make Akra price the 1M exhaust cheaper than how they price the M3 and 335i exhausts.
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      03-25-2011, 02:52 AM   #33
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My 2 cents worth (sorry Aussie dollars here).

We are expecting a full Akra to be AU$10k here (noting $AU is about the same as the US dollar nowadays) and that is less than 10% of the purchase price of the car here. I won't pay that much for an exhaust system.

Another thing to remember is that there are only ~700 (allegedly) 1Ms going to the US out of the total ~2700 world wide production. NO OTHER COUNTRY buys the car at the same relative (doing a US$ conversion to other currencies) price as the US so you are in the minority for getting the car cheaper and hence an exhaust that Akra is offering globally is not worth as much relatively to the cars purchase price anywhere else. I mean, if I brought a full system for the price you guys are talking, circa $6k, and a 1m costs $110k here then relatively all is good, so would the price at that amount.

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A full Porsche GT3 Akra is $25k over here , mind you the car cost $340k here............
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      03-25-2011, 09:09 AM   #34
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My 2 cents worth (sorry Aussie dollars here).

We are expecting a full Akra to be AU$10k here (noting $AU is about the same as the US dollar nowadays) and that is less than 10% of the purchase price of the car here. I won't pay that much for an exhaust system.

Another thing to remember is that there are only ~700 (allegedly) 1Ms going to the US out of the total ~2700 world wide production. NO OTHER COUNTRY buys the car at the same relative (doing a US$ conversion to other currencies) price as the US so you are in the minority for getting the car cheaper and hence an exhaust that Akra is offering globally is not worth as much relatively to the cars purchase price anywhere else. I mean, if I brought a full system for the price you guys are talking, circa $6k, and a 1m costs $110k here then relatively all is good, so would the price at that amount.

FYI
A full Porsche GT3 Akra is $25k over here , mind you the car cost $340k here............
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      04-03-2011, 01:15 PM   #35
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How is comparing to other companies relevant at all... the akra exhaust for M3 and 335i is 11% of the value of those respective cars, 13% for the 1M isn't so far from 11%; yet that's the price point they set. If buyers won't go for a 1M exhaust priced so high, why do M3 and 335i owners? What you're doing comparing Akra to Capristo is arguing that Akra is overpriced. The fact that other companies offer comparable products at a lower price point has no bearing on how much the Akra exhaust for the 1M will be since it had no bearing on how much Akra priced their exhausts for the M3 and 335i!
Also, why d'you think the demand curve for the average 1M will be very price sensitive/elastic? "Entry Level" is just a name, the 1M is MORE expensive than a 335i (who's exhaust is priced at $5000). If anything, 1M owners are also going to be more willing to blow money on their car than 335i owners since most of us have committed to a car thats had 0 reviews.

Whether it's $6000 or $5000, its still too expensive for me; but that's the price points they've set for the M3 and 335i. I don't see how the fact that buyers won't go for it, and that other companies offer exhausts for cheaper will make Akra price the 1M exhaust cheaper than how they price the M3 and 335i exhausts.
OK, I am speaking from the point of view of someone that has actually paid over $5K for an exhaust for my car, which I still have (Milltek Sport full exhaust: Downpipes, Cross Pipe, Deresonated, Power Valved, Titanium tipped header-back exhaust). http://www.stratmosphere.com/milltek_rs4_exhaust.htm So in principle, if I paid $5K for an exhaust on one car, I should easily be willing to pay for one again on a different car, right?

Well depends, because you have to put things in perspective. The Milltek (which BTW sadly cannot even touch Akra in terms of quality of materials and build) makes a huge difference in the case of the RS4 platform. It is able to extract over 25AWHP/30AWTQ as a bolt on (basing it on my own dyno results). Combine that with a tune, and you are at close to 40AWTQ gain (or 55 crank considering the massive drivetrain parasitic losses of quattro), which keep in mind, on a AWD naturally aspirated, 100hp-per-liter car is gynormous. And at the end of the day it is also a full exhaust, preserving the S-button feature (flaps open at a touch of a button at the steering wheel). So when you factor all that in: sound, performance, looks, weight reduction, etc. etc. all of a sudden $5K begins to make sense.

With Akra, we can only speculate at this stage because those guys have yet to release a formal product, but my guess is it would be the axle back portion. It will no doubt be a piece of art to look at (and make you wonder is it not better placed in your living room), and I am sure will sound wicked, but I doubt it will have any performance effect other than single digits at best. Now, if they release a full exhaust, DPs, mid pipe, quad cans, i.e. the full Monty, and gains are noticeable, then the price of $5-$6K is more than reasonable in my book. But if the price for just the rear cans is $6K, on a $50K car, with little to no performance gains, I just think a lot of people will have a hard time justifying it (although of course there will be some, as the saying goes: "for each train there are passengers"). Juxtipose that to a $5K exhaust on an $80K NA car gaining 35 HP/TQ.

So let's see, little point to speculate at this stage, as no Akra exhaust has been formally released, nor price, nor performance claims. Time will tell whether the 1///M customer base will absorb a $5-6K exhaust proposition.
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      04-03-2011, 05:47 PM   #36
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Why should the Akra exhaust system not fit on a normal 1-series BMW? I don't see any reason Akrapovic will focus on the 1M only, so there are plenty of customers.

Bad thing though: A 135i and a 1M will sound the same with the same exhaust.
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      04-03-2011, 06:13 PM   #37
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I would not spend anything more than $1200 for a exhaust; and beside, it sounds about the same as other 135 after market exhaust sound clips (like Berk, AA, and my aFe).
Exactly. I spent $1600 shipped for my exhaust that's on my STI, but this was when the car was first hitting the market. Sure, the exhaust for the 1M will be pricey, but if we have a little patience I'm sure competition will give us some better prices.

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You either have too much free cash or are lacking in the common sense department to spend 6k on an exhaust system on a ~50k car.
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      04-04-2011, 04:43 AM   #38
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Why should the Akra exhaust system not fit on a normal 1-series BMW?
The suspension & LSD rear axle on the 1M are not the same as the normal 1 series - the path the exhaust has to take past these components may have to be different?
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