BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)
 





 

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      05-03-2011, 09:54 PM   #1
tarmacrapist
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Variants of the N52B30 for more power?

Hey guys!

I looked up the 128i power plant (on wiki) and found that the X5 3.0si uses the same engine, but with a variation that produced 268bhp. Wiki states: "With a common engine displacement, the output changes result from the omission of the variable resonance system, dual plenum intake runner system, and the variable back pressure muffler." Has anyone attempted to perform these changes?

Thanks!

James B
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      05-03-2011, 10:09 PM   #2
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** very interested as well. I know we can use ECU tuners etc, but I'm very interested to know just how will an N52 do with the afore mentioned modifications..

" omission of the variable resonance system, dual plenum intake runner system, and the variable back pressure muffler"
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      05-04-2011, 01:03 AM   #3
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i'm pretty sure most of the parts are expensive to swap for minimal gains. Cheaper to go for ECU tune/pbx i believe
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      05-04-2011, 12:09 PM   #4
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268 from 230 is quite the difference. tune can come after those changes and will make for more power. Im interested.
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      05-04-2011, 12:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwayzUnce View Post
268 from 230 is quite the difference. tune can come after those changes and will make for more power. Im interested.
PRECISELY. It is a major bump in HP for people like myself who don't plan on trading in for a damnable turbo for another 50k miles.

The tune, as mentioned, can come after these modifications.

BUMP!
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      05-04-2011, 12:51 PM   #6
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I have the N51 so I have some of the stuff used on the higher HP N52s.
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      05-04-2011, 08:28 PM   #7
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this will be very interesting if someone steps up and gives it a go
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      05-04-2011, 09:04 PM   #8
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Or if a Company/Motorsport group came out with a kit..
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      05-05-2011, 02:33 AM   #9
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relevant
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...12#post9529112
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      05-05-2011, 05:11 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tarmacrapist View Post
Hey guys!

I looked up the 128i power plant (on wiki) and found that the X5 3.0si uses the same engine, but with a variation that produced 268bhp. Wiki states: "With a common engine displacement, the output changes result from the omission of the variable resonance system, dual plenum intake runner system, and the variable back pressure muffler." Has anyone attempted to perform these changes?

Thanks!

James B

You don't need to change any hardware. With a simple SW flash you can get:

258-280 PS and 310-325Nm of Tq. Costs about 1K euros from the few tuners(two or three) in Germany who have cracked BMW ECU code.

I think BMW is doing to the 125/128/3.0si motor what is does to the 116d/118d/120d - slight mechanical differences but mostly SW changes the engine's output.



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      05-05-2011, 05:30 AM   #11
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care to name these tuners? i would like to find out what potential i have left in my 130 SW
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      05-05-2011, 05:50 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 130iguy View Post
care to name these tuners? i would like to find out what potential i have left in my 130 SW

MS Tuning is one. Marcel just finished tuning my 135i yesterday. I will be making a nice writeup in the next day or so. We were actually talking about tunes for the 125/128/130's bc there is so much interests.


http://www.ms-chiptuning.de/kontakt.html
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      05-05-2011, 06:40 AM   #13
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This has been discussed at some length before. There are interesting posts on the 3 series board as well. The few dynos posted for the n52 also indicate it is under-rated. I believe I remember seeing one with a stock motor generating about 210hp at the rear wheels. Normally you would assume 85% of flywheel gets to the rear wheels indicating nearly 250hp at the flywheel. I believe some of the difference in ratings may just be added conservatism for the lower rated n52s.

If you research on realoem you can find the parts differences. I used the n52 in the X5 which is rated nearly 270hp. It has a different exhaust manifold and the three stage inlet and different injectors. Things like the camshaft, which can make a big difference, are exactly the same. It is well known that better breathing - more airflow - will increase hp. A chip may be able to find some hp, apparently does, but it's methods are different and potentially complementary. A different intake and exhaust will increase airflow and thus hp.

There is a post on the 3 series forum of a guy that switched to the 3 stage inlet. He got around 210 hp at the rear wheels. But his engine is up well over 100,000 miles. So he got to something approximating a "fresh" lower rated n52. Maybe he gained 10-15 hp and maybe we would get the same.

If you come across a X5 with a n52 that somebody is parting out, it could be fun to swap some parts and see. But at dealer prices for the parts, it doesn't seem worth several thousand dollars to get maybe 20-30hp.

Jim
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      05-05-2011, 09:09 AM   #14
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Is it true that the N51 engines have the 3 stage inlet?
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      05-05-2011, 11:18 AM   #15
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Yes, the N51 has the 3-stage intake manifold. However, it's used to essentially "make up" for power that's lost from the additional catalyst and a lower compression ratio that allow it to meet the SULEV-II emissions standards. At least, this is my understanding.
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      05-05-2011, 12:36 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AW128i View Post
Yes, the N51 has the 3-stage intake manifold. However, it's used to essentially "make up" for power that's lost from the additional catalyst and a lower compression ratio that allow it to meet the SULEV-II emissions standards. At least, this is my understanding.
Hmmm very interesting, that.... well im sure we could benefit from a custom tune. Either way, I'm really quite happy with the performance of my engine with the MPG I get. (currently reading 26.1 on the gauge cluster)
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      05-05-2011, 05:51 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AW128i View Post
Yes, the N51 has the 3-stage intake manifold. However, it's used to essentially "make up" for power that's lost from the additional catalyst and a lower compression ratio that allow it to meet the SULEV-II emissions standards. At least, this is my understanding.


Speaking of the 3-stage intake manifold also known as DISA. Have you guys seen this DISA problem...


http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewto...p?f=30&t=12150


I talked to Marcel again today. He assures me you do not need DISA to get 130i power levels from a 125i/128i. He has tuned many of those engines. Like I mentioned before... 280 PS and 325Nm of Tq can be acheived by software tuning. No (aditional) mechanical parts needed for the tune.
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      05-05-2011, 06:12 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
Speaking of the 3-stage intake manifold also known as DISA. Have you guys seen this DISA problem...


http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewto...p?f=30&t=12150


I talked to Marcel again today. He assures me you do not need DISA to get 130i power levels from a 125i/128i. He has tuned many of those engines. Like I mentioned before... 280 PS and 325Nm of Tq can be acheived by software tuning. No (aditional) mechanical parts needed for the tune.
I'm in if this DOES apply to the 128. I'll have to check the website out. Also, how do you know if you have a n51 or n52?
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      05-05-2011, 06:39 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riley1524 View Post
I'm in if this DOES apply to the 128. I'll have to check the website out. Also, how do you know if you have a n51 or n52?

Who me? I have a N54.
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      05-05-2011, 06:48 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
Who me? I have a N54.
I know you have a n54. i was just asking how does one know he has a n51 or n52 in a 128i? In other words, what are some things, visually that sets the 2 apart?
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      05-05-2011, 07:52 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
Speaking of the 3-stage intake manifold also known as DISA. Have you guys seen this DISA problem...


http://www.z4-forum.com/forum/viewto...p?f=30&t=12150


I talked to Marcel again today. He assures me you do not need DISA to get 130i power levels from a 125i/128i. He has tuned many of those engines. Like I mentioned before... 280 PS and 325Nm of Tq can be acheived by software tuning. No (aditional) mechanical parts needed for the tune.
Yeah, thats old news, had to replace the DISA valve on my 330i.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Riley1524 View Post
I know you have a n54. i was just asking how does one know he has a n51 or n52 in a 128i? In other words, what are some things, visually that sets the 2 apart?
You can plug your VIN into BMW Owner's Circle on their website. If you car car was originally in CA, NY or some other states, it may be an N51 (SULEV) engine.
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      05-06-2011, 03:18 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
You don't need to change any hardware. With a simple SW flash you can get:

258-280 PS and 310-325Nm of Tq. Costs about 1K euros from the few tuners(two or three) in Germany who have cracked BMW ECU code.

I think BMW is doing to the 125/128/3.0si motor what is does to the 116d/118d/120d - slight mechanical differences but mostly SW changes the engine's output.

Dackel
You won't get this much power out of the N52 with ONLY a software tune. You're going to blow your engine up mighty quick if you don't include parts that will allow it to function properly at these upper limits.

Intake, headers, exhaust... the costs add up quickly, you're looking at several thousand dollars for 30-40hp MAX. Buy an E36/46 M3 if you've got money to drop.
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