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      08-20-2012, 09:50 AM   #1
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Question Can Someone Describe the Wastegate Rattle Noise?

Hey guys, quick question.

When I go off boost or release the throttle while holding gear I can hear a ratcheting noise from under the car.

It sounds like I just stopped pedaling on a bike but I'm still moving. You guys know that noise? Does that make sense?

Is that the Wastegate rattle? I've been out of warranty for a while. But with the recent news of the extension to 82K I'm officially nervous again.

Thanks
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      08-20-2012, 10:23 AM   #2
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it was that noise for me while pressing the pedal around 2k revs. it also felt less responsive than before in that rev range.
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      08-20-2012, 11:49 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom View Post
it was that noise for me while pressing the pedal around 2k revs. it also felt less responsive than before in that rev range.
Thats was afraid of/hopeful for.

I have 5K miles to get the turbos replaced. So how do I go about saying "give me new turbos" to the dealer?...
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      08-20-2012, 12:27 PM   #4
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Bring the the service/warranty bulletin and say, "Give me new turbos"?
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      08-20-2012, 12:36 PM   #5
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You also know they extended the warranty on the N54 turbo's... right?
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      08-20-2012, 12:44 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bogart View Post
You also know they extended the warranty on the N54 turbo's... right?
Yeah. As I sai in the op it's to 82K mile now.

My car currently has 77K miles
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      08-20-2012, 01:29 PM   #7
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Just say that you are hearing a lot of noise from your engine that sounds like rattling and that it feels way less responsive in the 2k range and remind them about the TSB (since it is an update to a previous one, not all have paid attention to it). Took my dealer an hour to dial in that it was in fact wastegate rattle. I will warn you that since it is past the original warranty that they will probably try their best to only replace the wastegates. (I also asked for photographic proof of the new turbos to make sure that they replaced the whole thing.)
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      08-21-2012, 04:33 PM   #8
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So I called the dealership yesterday and told them what was happening (ratcheting noise on in gear deceleration under engine vacuum).

And they flipped out! They told me to bring the car in ASAP to get the turbos replaced, no questions asked.



I hope it stays this easy. New turbos at about 80K - cant complain!
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      08-21-2012, 06:31 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokenVert View Post
So I called the dealership yesterday and told them what was happening (ratcheting noise on in gear deceleration under engine vacuum).

And they flipped out! They told me to bring the car in ASAP to get the turbos replaced, no questions asked.



I hope it stays this easy. New turbos at about 80K - cant complain!
Now here's hoping you have some competent mechanics at your dealership.

(The Vert is broken once more )
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      08-23-2012, 03:34 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom View Post
Now here's hoping you have some competent mechanics at your dealership.

(The Vert is broken once more )
Yeah wouldnt you know it. The engine is the one thing that doesnt go wrong while the car is under warranty. But the moment the car hits 70K it suddenly decides to start breaking.



Got the call today. Confirmed - wastegates are both dead. But theyre trying to deny me turbos - saying that the SIB doesnt cover the wastegates being defective, only failed turbos (mine are apparently fine).

So either im reading SIB 01 02 12 completely wrong or theyre trying to shaft me at the dealership.


Now is when the fun really begins
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      08-23-2012, 08:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokenVert View Post
Yeah wouldnt you know it. The engine is the one thing that doesnt go wrong while the car is under warranty. But the moment the car hits 70K it suddenly decides to start breaking.



Got the call today. Confirmed - wastegates are both dead. But theyre trying to deny me turbos - saying that the SIB doesnt cover the wastegates being defective, only failed turbos (mine are apparently fine).

So either im reading SIB 01 02 12 completely wrong or theyre trying to shaft me at the dealership.


Now is when the fun really begins
I think you have that flipped, the bulletin explicitly states that it is for a wastegate failure causing the turbos to fail. Does not necessarily extend to the turbos themselves. Which is why they might just try to replace the wastegates. Since I got mine replaced under warranty it made more sense for them to replace the turbos as well because it was on BMWs dime.
"BMW NA has agreed to extend, to a total of 8 years or 82,000 miles, whichever comes first, the emissions warranties covering the Settlement Class Members’ vehicles for any failure of a turbocharger caused by a defect in a turbocharger wastegate."
So my guess is that since your dealership is saying that only the wastegates have failed, they will salvage the rest of the turbo components.

If they have this flipped however, teach them to read.
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      08-24-2012, 08:27 AM   #12
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keep us posted OP.

My car is at the shop right now for the same issues, and I'm awaiting the results from their inspection.

I fear they will also deny the turbo replacement.

Anyone with some solid experience on what components are truly failing please chime in. From what I have gathered on the wastegate failure, the housing bushings and flapper are also the issue, not only the actual vaccum wastegate. Replacing the wastegate seems to only be a temporary fix.

Last edited by n54door; 08-24-2012 at 08:39 AM.
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      08-24-2012, 08:44 AM   #13
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Heres the line that I keep coming back to...

"If the noise is described as a clanking noise occurring up to six or seven times in a row during a deceleration from approximately 3,500 RPM, or during a heavy application of the accelerator without a drive gear being engaged, then continue with the procedures described in this document."

From there all of the procedures that I see are for replacements of the turbos. Am I wrong?



Either way my wastegates are dead and something needs to get done. But am I right in demanding a full turbo replacement?
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      08-24-2012, 09:52 AM   #14
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I may be out to lunch on this, but how do they replace just the wastegates? It's all one unit isn't it? The wategate is welded to the turbo housing.

If there is a way to just replace the wastegates plase let me know.....I'm at 100K and have the rattle and will have to replace the turbos myself at some point, but if I can just do the wastegates I would be happy.

EDIT: Is it the wastegate acctuator they are wanting to replace? That might be where the confusion is. Those are $30 parts...not easy to replace because you almost have to put the exhaust system down to almost parade rest, but still....those really don't fail.
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      08-24-2012, 12:15 PM   #15
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Just got another call.

"the waste gates have failed. But nothing is covered - here's your charge have fun"

So now the fun - really - begins
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      08-24-2012, 12:24 PM   #16
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Time to call the service manager, and BMW - you are getting f'd.

The bulletin clearly says your wastegates have failed based on the description of the issue. I would escalate it so far they would fear making this judgement call on the next one.

You may wish to mention this is court ordered and there are in direct violation of the ruling and your consumer rights.

Which dealership is your car at? I might want to call them myself for practice, lol!
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      08-24-2012, 12:32 PM   #17
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Ive already demanded to see the factory service rep.

I got told by Steven at Hassel BMW

"The shop forman says that theyve failed, but they havent failed enough to constitute a replacement. Thats not say that they wont fail, they might in a month or two, but they havent failed yet"

I have to pick up the car tomorrow morning - but theyre getting the car back with a letter that clearly states that I hold BMW responsible for any damage incurred by a turbo failure with this car.

I know exactly what theyre trying to pull, my car has 78K miles, theyre trying to keep me out until I pass 82 that way its on my dime.



Of course this happens a month after the former shop foreman at Hassel (a friend of mine) left BMW for another manufacturer...
Time to start calling other dealers
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      08-24-2012, 01:49 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrokenVert View Post
Ive already demanded to see the factory service rep.

I got told by Steven at Hassel BMW

"The shop forman says that theyve failed, but they havent failed enough to constitute a replacement. Thats not say that they wont fail, they might in a month or two, but they havent failed yet"

I have to pick up the car tomorrow morning - but theyre getting the car back with a letter that clearly states that I hold BMW responsible for any damage incurred by a turbo failure with this car.

I know exactly what theyre trying to pull, my car has 78K miles, theyre trying to keep me out until I pass 82 that way its on my dime.



Of course this happens a month after the former shop foreman at Hassel (a friend of mine) left BMW for another manufacturer...
Time to start calling other dealers
Seriously, Hassel BMW (aka Hassle)? That's too perfect... oh the irony in that name...

Good luck man, keep us posted. I would be livid if I were you, and would demand to have a logical and detailed explanation on the tolerances for failure. Such as we measure this____ and it did not meet the specs of this____.

What exactly are they saying? It's not loud enough? It doesn't chatter enough? It doesn't lose enough boost? I'd like to hear their argument.
They better be damn good at physics and math to wage a valid argument with facts!

You didn't pull the ebrake on the way into the shop to slide sideways, and jump out of the car with a 'illest' flat bill cap and tight jeans did you? I would deny you too if you did, lol! Just messing with you...
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      08-25-2012, 09:48 AM   #19
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So now it's gotten really interesting.

Got a call this morning. I was told that the factory rep was there yesterday (conveniently he only showed up 20 minutes after I demanded to have an appointment with him)

So he shows up and mysteriously they notice exhaust cam VANOS codes in the DME that weren't noticed before. (I'm guessing because they never checked the codes that I said the car was throwing)

And it's true, one of them was a VANOS code, the rest were 30FF (low boost). It's why when I brought it in for the wastegates i also asked them to price me out a VANOS soelenoid change.

So now they're blaming everything on the exhaust cam VANOS - and are now saying that the waste gates aren't rattling any louder than normal (pure BS)

I'm officially really skeeved out by this dealer - which is a shame considering how good they used to be to me. So I spent yesterday afternoon tracking down the former shop foreman at Hassel who is utterly fantastic.

It turns out that he, my former great SA, and about 10 other technicians all got fed up with the way Hassel was doing business and they all left shop for Habberstad BMW.

So I call Habberstad, ask for Peter, say my name and his first response was "ohh hey it's good to hear from you, how was London?"

Yep - haven't seen them in over a year and all I had to do was drop my name for a great conversation.

So I'm dropping the car at Habberstad this afternoon - well see what gets done.
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      08-25-2012, 10:26 AM   #20
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The solenoid error is easy to cure, it is most likely dirty. Take them out and blow them off with compressed air and you should be good to go.
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      08-25-2012, 10:32 AM   #21
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The solenoid error is easy to cure, it is most likely dirty. Take them out and blow them off with compressed air and you should be good to go.
They're cheap - id much rather just replace them with new parts. And if I do it at a dealer I get a 2 year warranty on whatever they touch. So if a VANOS soelenoid causes an engine failure in 2 years it's BMWs fault.

I like to cover my ass
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      11-01-2012, 12:25 AM   #22
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So the wastegate rattle its only a rattle noise when car is moving and rpm is around 2k?

My car/engine rattles every now and then when I start the engine.
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