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      12-09-2012, 06:53 AM   #1
sparoz
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Proflex vs Ohlins

For the people who deals with them, putting money aside, how do Proflex compare to Ohlins? Just realised that we have a local suspension expert on the Sunny Coast and I don't have to deal with people overseas.
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      01-16-2013, 04:54 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparoz View Post
For the people who deals with them, putting money aside, how do Proflex compare to Ohlins? Just realised that we have a local suspension expert on the Sunny Coast and I don't have to deal with people overseas.
Murray Coote (MCA not proflex anymore)is awesome and will help set your suspension correctly.
Only catch is he will want to do it at the track. We all know that's not going to happen.

Just find out which is the most expensive and buy those !

Btw they are having a come and try hillclimb at mt cotton on Sunday
Great place to explore your cars abilities in a safe environment lol
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      01-16-2013, 04:57 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparoz
For the people who deals with them, putting money aside, how do Proflex compare to Ohlins? Just realised that we have a local suspension expert on the Sunny Coast and I don't have to deal with people overseas.
What's wrong with peeps os
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      01-16-2013, 05:01 PM   #4
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What's wrong with peeps os
+1 these stuck up californians
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      01-16-2013, 05:58 PM   #5
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+1 these stuck up californians
LMFAO he is from Australia not the states
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      01-16-2013, 07:33 PM   #6
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LMFAO he is from Australia not the states
Alright then my mistake no offence to australia
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      01-16-2013, 07:44 PM   #7
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The Real Deal

Well if you must, go with local support as setting up a race car is not like setting up your road / track day car.
There is a BLACK ART to this and unless you race a car offen you have no hope of getting the setup correct.
These top line systems will not work correctly if you havent done the soild subframe bushes, adjustable arms and sway bars etc. And dont forget the semi slick tyres.
If you dont do all this you are wasting you $$$$$$$$$$$$ and by the way it will drive like a brick on the road duck and dive all over the place.

But on the track what a dream total fun but dont forget that the little BIMMER
cant do more than 5 hot laps on a cold day. but thats another story

So why do you need the best shocks ?

Last edited by Peter@Advan; 01-16-2013 at 11:37 PM.
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      01-16-2013, 07:53 PM   #8
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Waste of $$$

Buy a dedicated track car or turn your 1M into a dedicated track car. The KW kit 'beemer' in Sydney put on his with camber plates is a great compromise (http://www.autoevolution.com/news/km...ery-44822.html )
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      01-16-2013, 07:59 PM   #9
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get a gokart, then you wont have to worry about suspension
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      01-16-2013, 08:36 PM   #10
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I thought the ohlins was an equivalent to KW V3's?

Well that's the ohlins I had looked at anyway the R&T's for around $2.5K?
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      01-16-2013, 09:03 PM   #11
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Try AST, we have local distributor here and I know the person.
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      01-16-2013, 09:09 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DR-JEKL View Post
I thought the ohlins was an equivalent to KW V3's?

Well that's the ohlins I had looked at anyway the R&T's for around $2.5K?
KW have 3 settings on the system that is available for the 1M. There is a button in the car, else there is an iPhone app that lets you customise.
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      01-16-2013, 09:10 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skycat View Post
But on the track what a dream total fun but dont forget that the little BIMMER
cant do more than 5 hot laps on a cold day. but thats another story
Excuse my ignorance Peter, but why do you say the bimmer can only haddle 5 hot laps on a cold day? Over heating?
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      01-16-2013, 09:29 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhouse View Post
Excuse my ignorance Peter, but why do you say the bimmer can only haddle 5 hot laps on a cold day? Over heating?
the n54/5 is a hot engine and will go into limp mode if pushed hard. Pete was exagerating but it will happen.
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      01-16-2013, 09:29 PM   #15
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I'm looking at suspension changes at present. Had a lengthy discussion with Beric Lynton's race car builder yesterday about my options.
BTW they are now fielding two cars for the 12 hour race. The second will be a 135 coverted to a 1M including all the bodywork, chassis changes etc.

At present I have Eibach sportline springs on the car but it needs different shocks as it is quite skittish over stutter bumps and the like. I will probably be changing the car back to stock springs then looking for a kit to change to.

As Skycat says, "There is a BLACK ART to this".

Some thing I hadn't thought of is - when altering the ride height the roll centre can be affected. I.e the static roll centre can go from above a pivot point to below. Dynamically though, the altered roll centre can move above the pivot point and cause a drastic change to the car's behaviour. Eg. think of heavy braking into a downhill corner with the front end roll centre below the pivot point and the light rear end above the pivot point. A nice recipe for snap oversteer, something the car is already prone to.

I do not any special have suspension knowledge, I am just passing on some info as I interpreted it as of yesterday. Plus, some things make logical sense.

He suggested a kit which has compression damping as well as rebound. Then play with sway bars to dial in the handling trait you want. I.e. understeer, oversteer or neutral. It's all very well saying you want throttle adjustable oversteer but are you good enough? I used to think I was good enough having raced a bit ( albeit on bikes )
but these days I'm looking for a little more margin for error so I will perhaps be aiming for neutral to understeer.

Beric's race car has a race KW kit fitted which was set up at the factory. They have done a fair amount of track development and are surprised at just how good the factory setting is.
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      01-16-2013, 10:00 PM   #16
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The point is moot
This vehicle is unlikely to ever see a racetrack
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      01-16-2013, 10:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
The point is moot
This vehicle is unlikely to ever see a racetrack
I should have clarified - If you go with KW, whether street or track or both there is a good chance of obtaining a system sorted for your needs out of the box.

I don't track anymore either but a nicely set up car is a nicely set up car.
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      01-16-2013, 11:05 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian///M View Post
KW have 3 settings on the system that is available for the 1M. There is a button in the car, else there is an iPhone app that lets you customise.
Well I guess what I meant was that the ohlins coilovers (The OP didnt specify which version of ohlins though) weren't a hard core race setup but still more of a KW V3 type coilover (Pete mentioned that big $ coilovers would be a waste of $ without solid bushes etc etc)

The ohlins coilovers offered for the 335i are the R&T series.

All I know is the ohlins gear transformed my bike into a plush ride around town yet on the twisties it provided excellent feedback and damper control.

It's one thing having a stiff setup to provide great feedback yet another to be able to maintain some form of dampening for the shit roads we have here in Oz.
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      01-16-2013, 11:30 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwhouse View Post
Excuse my ignorance Peter, but why do you say the bimmer can only haddle 5 hot laps on a cold day? Over heating?
Sorry to say, if you are trying hard and on semi slicks yes you will have a overheat issue at around 10-15 minutes on a 25deg day, maybe if your on road tyres you may go longer, and if it is STOCK a 1M with the extra Radaitor may go all day. Horses for courses
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      01-16-2013, 11:31 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gazz View Post
I'm looking at suspension changes at present. Had a lengthy discussion with Beric Lynton's race car builder yesterday about my options.
BTW they are now fielding two cars for the 12 hour race. The second will be a 135 coverted to a 1M including all the bodywork, chassis changes etc.

At present I have Eibach sportline springs on the car but it needs different shocks as it is quite skittish over stutter bumps and the like. I will probably be changing the car back to stock springs then looking for a kit to change to.

As Skycat says, "There is a BLACK ART to this".

Some thing I hadn't thought of is - when altering the ride height the roll centre can be affected. I.e the static roll centre can go from above a pivot point to below. Dynamically though, the altered roll centre can move above the pivot point and cause a drastic change to the car's behaviour. Eg. think of heavy braking into a downhill corner with the front end roll centre below the pivot point and the light rear end above the pivot point. A nice recipe for snap oversteer, something the car is already prone to.

I do not any special have suspension knowledge, I am just passing on some info as I interpreted it as of yesterday. Plus, some things make logical sense.

He suggested a kit which has compression damping as well as rebound. Then play with sway bars to dial in the handling trait you want. I.e. understeer, oversteer or neutral. It's all very well saying you want throttle adjustable oversteer but are you good enough? I used to think I was good enough having raced a bit ( albeit on bikes )
but these days I'm looking for a little more margin for error so I will perhaps be aiming for neutral to understeer.

Beric's race car has a race KW kit fitted which was set up at the factory. They have done a fair amount of track development and are surprised at just how good the factory setting is.

I have had a similar experience, put KW DDC on my 1M and lowered the front 10mm for aesthetics, nothing else. Car handled well but see sawed a bit over bumps and the front end had less travel before hitting the bump stops which actually brought on understeer earlier when pushing hard.

have since put the car back to stock heights and the handling is now so much better. The height of the front looks awkward but BMW have it like that for a reason.

With the KW DDC, the Sport setting is just amazing for the twisties like in the national park or mountians, car sits completely flat. In sport+ mode its strictly for the track. The soft mode is stupidly soft, alot of people with the DDC have complained about it. I feel it is a bit of a cynical ploy by KW to make you buy the iphone module for $450 to make the soft mode actually useable and the sport mode a bit softer.

Sparoz: i would get KW V3 if i could do it again, it only takes 5 minutes to wind them out for a track day and same to wide them back off for the road, and they are alot cheaper.

you gotta be just a little realistic with this 1M, its never going to be super quick at the track, but you can make it more fun, and safer at higher speeds.

With the KW and a set of 888's i feel pretty secure at eastern creek now
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      01-16-2013, 11:47 PM   #21
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Talking about old thread revival.

Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
Murray Coote (MCA not proflex anymore)is awesome and will help set your suspension correctly.
Only catch is he will want to do it at the track. We all know that's not going to happen.

Just find out which is the most expensive and buy those !

Btw they are having a come and try hillclimb at mt cotton on Sunday
Great place to explore your cars abilities in a safe environment lol
Are they? I just spoke to Josh when they are going to be on the track next and he said he doesn't know?

Quote:
Originally Posted by skycat View Post
Well if you must, go with local support as setting up a race car is not like setting up your road / track day car.
There is a BLACK ART to this and unless you race a car offen you have no hope of getting the setup correct.
These top line systems will not work correctly if you havent done the soild subframe bushes, adjustable arms and sway bars etc. And dont forget the semi slick tyres.
If you dont do all this you are wasting or $$$$$$$$$$$$ and by the way it will drive like a brick on the road duck and dive all over the place.

But on the track what a dream total fun but dont forget that the little BIMMER
cant do more than 5 hot laps on a cold day. but thats another story

So why do you need the best shocks ?
Thanks Pete for the input, I will keep those in mind. Looks like a drive down to Landsborough is called for. I don't need the best shocks actually, just ones that will achieve what I want to achieve with the car. I will let you know how long the little bimmer will last - if it doesn't overheat in 5 laps may be I am not driving fast enough. .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian///M View Post
Waste of $$$

Buy a dedicated track car or turn your 1M into a dedicated track car. The KW kit 'beemer' in Sydney put on his with camber plates is a great compromise (http://www.autoevolution.com/news/km...ery-44822.html )
Yes to some people I am. However, I am getting a very big kick (and headaches) from all these parts, much more than if I would have bought a M3. I am still loving the car and excited every time I open the door and get in the car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DR-JEKL View Post
I thought the ohlins was an equivalent to KW V3's?

Well that's the ohlins I had looked at anyway the R&T's for around $2.5K?
Yes, I am looking at the R&Ts as well but I am prepared to go to TTX front and rear. Beau seems to be very helpful and so is Murray but Murray needs to look at the car which I haven't found time for yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gazz View Post
I'm looking at suspension changes at present. Had a lengthy discussion with Beric Lynton's race car builder yesterday about my options.
BTW they are now fielding two cars for the 12 hour race. The second will be a 135 coverted to a 1M including all the bodywork, chassis changes etc.

At present I have Eibach sportline springs on the car but it needs different shocks as it is quite skittish over stutter bumps and the like. I will probably be changing the car back to stock springs then looking for a kit to change to.

As Skycat says, "There is a BLACK ART to this".

Some thing I hadn't thought of is - when altering the ride height the roll centre can be affected. I.e the static roll centre can go from above a pivot point to below. Dynamically though, the altered roll centre can move above the pivot point and cause a drastic change to the car's behaviour. Eg. think of heavy braking into a downhill corner with the front end roll centre below the pivot point and the light rear end above the pivot point. A nice recipe for snap oversteer, something the car is already prone to.

I do not any special have suspension knowledge, I am just passing on some info as I interpreted it as of yesterday. Plus, some things make logical sense.

He suggested a kit which has compression damping as well as rebound. Then play with sway bars to dial in the handling trait you want. I.e. understeer, oversteer or neutral. It's all very well saying you want throttle adjustable oversteer but are you good enough? I used to think I was good enough having raced a bit ( albeit on bikes )
but these days I'm looking for a little more margin for error so I will perhaps be aiming for neutral to understeer.

Beric's race car has a race KW kit fitted which was set up at the factory. They have done a fair amount of track development and are surprised at just how good the factory setting is.
Still looking at potentially KW, but I think using a local with the knowledge is important. However, I found a mechanic locally who used to be working with race cars setups too, but none would be better than Murray I guess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
The point is moot
This vehicle is unlikely to ever see a racetrack
FYI, I have booked in March.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DR-JEKL View Post
Well I guess what I meant was that the ohlins coilovers (The OP didnt specify which version of ohlins though) weren't a hard core race setup but still more of a KW V3 type coilover (Pete mentioned that big $ coilovers would be a waste of $ without solid bushes etc etc)

The ohlins coilovers offered for the 335i are the R&T series.

All I know is the ohlins gear transformed my bike into a plush ride around town yet on the twisties it provided excellent feedback and damper control.

It's one thing having a stiff setup to provide great feedback yet another to be able to maintain some form of dampening for the shit roads we have here in Oz.
That's the main reason why I was looking at Ohlins because of these feed back everywhere. Also, spoke to someone who had used MCA and Ohlins, and Ohlins have the edge on tracks and MCA probably off road. I haven't asked Murray or Josh the question yet, but they used to be happy to work with Ohlins as well but not sure if they still do.
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      01-17-2013, 12:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skycat View Post
Sorry to say, if you are trying hard and on semi slicks yes you will have a overheat issue at around 10-15 minutes on a 25deg day, maybe if your on road tyres you may go longer, and if it is STOCK a 1M with the extra Radaitor may go all day. Horses for courses

Thanks for the clarification Peter. I was curious more than anything. Now I will stop thread jacking
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