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      05-20-2013, 09:22 PM   #1
SloPoke
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Anyone thinking about pulling the trigger on the Vargas Stage 3?

So who is going to be the first 1M with over 650 rwhp?
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      05-20-2013, 09:24 PM   #2
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If that SOB from Florida hadn't gotten my ticket I'd be doing it now!
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      05-21-2013, 06:50 AM   #3
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im aiming for 600whp,, hoping the turbo up grade along with tubular manifold will take mine up from the 454/530.
do you know what's involved in the stage 3 vargas upgrade?
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      05-21-2013, 10:33 AM   #4
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They have it all listed on their site. Can be yours for either $7699 or $7999, depending on which turbos you want. Really not a bad deal though. I wonder what install would cost.
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      05-21-2013, 11:15 AM   #5
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I believe someone else with new turbos (maybe Vargas maybe not, there is a bimmerpost "vow dude, respect"-wise thread on it) just recently recorded 700+ whp with N54 (a 335i). So, sky is the limit, almost literally.

Does this 650 whp kit also come with a free pass to a nearby runway? Would make more sense
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      05-21-2013, 11:38 AM   #6
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Once I'm out of warranty, I'll be considering some significant power upgrades and may go single turbo.

Neil
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      05-21-2013, 11:38 AM   #7
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I will be doing stage 2+ on my frankenstein build. I have upgraded brakes already and will be doing a spec stage 2+ clutch before the turbos. I want the car to fully support the upgrade.
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      05-21-2013, 11:51 AM   #8
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It's tempting, but the turbos on this car are perfectly matched to the engine, IMO. There's barely any lag at all. I can't imagine waiting till 3.5k+ for full boost to hit... But man 650+ hp would be fun...

Edit: I was about to comment that two small GT 28 series turbos might be worth while, but I believe that's what the Vargus kit is, right? (I was thinking it was a single BT). Anyone know what the spool up on the stage3 kit is like?
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      05-21-2013, 11:58 AM   #9
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Vargas' twin turbo setup made something like 725 hp to the wheels running meth and race fuel. Vinshu/FFTEC single turbo made something like 715 to the wheels running similar fueling. I think they both finally quit pushing it as the stock motor can only handle so much and best not to find that limit.

Install of either setup isn't much different than replacing the stock turbos. Figure about the same install time.

What I would really like is a rock solid 500 hp to the wheels running straight 93 octane. I don't want to run e85 and I don't want a tank of meth in the trunk. Probably by the time my warranty is done someone will have this worked out nicely. I believe either setup can probably run that now but I've not seen much to the effect. It's usually all about biggest numbers running whatever it takes to produce them.

Last edited by robertm; 05-21-2013 at 01:32 PM.
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      05-21-2013, 01:23 PM   #10
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Still have 28 months left on the warranty before the real fun begins.
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      05-21-2013, 01:44 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertm View Post
Vargas' twin turbo setup made something like 725 hp to the wheels running meth and race fuel. Vinshu/FFTEC single turbo made something like 715 to the wheels running similar fueling. I think they both finally quit pushing it as the stock motor can only handle so much and best not to find that limit.

Install of either setup isn't much different than replacing the stock turbos. Figure about the same install time.

What I would really like is a rock solid 500 hp to the wheels running straight 93 octane. I don't want to run e85 and I don't want a tank of meth in the trunk. Probably by the time my warranty is done someone will have this worked out nicely. I believe either setup can probably run that now but I've not seen much to the effect. It's usually all about biggest numbers running whatever it takes to produce them.
+1.

If you're not going for a dyno queen, turbo lag can be minimized --and spool-up maximized -- with a properly sized turbo and a well-designed manifold.

I'm thinking that a single twin-scroll turbo (B-W EFR, Garrett GTX,..) could be pretty sweet.

Neil
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      05-21-2013, 02:04 PM   #12
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I just put my deposit on the stage 2+. I may go stage 3 when the time comes but i honestly think it could be too much power for the car. I want around 500whp on e85.
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      05-22-2013, 07:46 PM   #13
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What tuning options is available?
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      05-22-2013, 10:07 PM   #14
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For Vargas twins PTF Cobb has already written a few tunes. Burger will be doing a JB4 tune as soon as he gets his hands on a car. I believe Renntech is awaiting delivery so they can tune one as well. Not sure about GIAC. I'd be surprised if they didn't tune one too.

For the FFTEC single currently Proceed is the only tune available. Although I think Terry Burger would like to write a tune that would work as well.

Last edited by robertm; 05-22-2013 at 10:17 PM.
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      05-22-2013, 11:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertm View Post
For Vargas twins PTF Cobb has already written a few tunes. Burger will be doing a JB4 tune as soon as he gets his hands on a car. I believe Renntech is awaiting delivery so they can tune one as well. Not sure about GIAC. I'd be surprised if they didn't tune one too.

For the FFTEC single currently Proceed is the only tune available. Although I think Terry Burger would like to write a tune that would work as well.
Thanks! Has someone tried it stage 2 with stock DPs?
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      05-23-2013, 05:48 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SloPoke View Post
So who is going to be the first 1M with over 650 rwhp?
I saw Vishnu has is a Vishnu 1M VFF700 on a dyno on their facebook page.


Personally I would do stage 2 Vargas with GIAC and only GIAC tune, but after warranty is up.
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      05-23-2013, 10:04 PM   #17
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Why GIAC? With the Cobb you can just take it to a tuner (or tune it yourself, if you know what you're doing) using ATR.
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      05-24-2013, 05:47 AM   #18
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Why GIAC? With the Cobb you can just take it to a tuner (or tune it yourself, if you know what you're doing) using ATR.
I don't want this thread to get off topic or turn it into a this or that tune thread. For me I like the linear nature of the GIAC tune. My car is used as a weekend cruiser and track day (road courses) car at the moment. At the track you want the car as predictable as possible. I could be wrong, but I'm under the impression that COBB may not maintain the overboost function on the 1M.
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      05-24-2013, 06:28 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Why GIAC? With the Cobb you can just take it to a tuner (or tune it yourself, if you know what you're doing) using ATR.
For all intents and purposes both Cobb and GIAC are the same tool here. Neither will perform right out of the box with these larger turbos. With the GIAC you will have them or one of their install shops create a custom tune. With the Cobb you’ll have an ATP tuner create one. True you could use the ATR software but in reality a very small handful of enthusiasts have the skillsets to do this correctly. This hold true for JB4 as well.
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      05-24-2013, 06:32 AM   #20
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BIG turbo 1m


Who done it?

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=844414
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      05-24-2013, 11:08 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robertm View Post
For all intents and purposes both Cobb and GIAC are the same tool here. Neither will perform right out of the box with these larger turbos. With the GIAC you will have them or one of their install shops create a custom tune. With the Cobb you’ll have an ATP tuner create one. True you could use the ATR software but in reality a very small handful of enthusiasts have the skillsets to do this correctly. This hold true for JB4 as well.
True. You should definitely not slap on an "Off The Shelf" tune with an upgraded turbo. That would likely be disastrous. One of the reasons I really like Cobb is you can just grab the map file and modify it using ATR, assuming your tuner didn't lock it. I'll do more reading on GIAC, I assumed it was one of those "flash and never touch" tunes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Splinterz88 View Post
I don't want this thread to get off topic or turn it into a this or that tune thread. For me I like the linear nature of the GIAC tune. My car is used as a weekend cruiser and track day (road courses) car at the moment. At the track you want the car as predictable as possible. I could be wrong, but I'm under the impression that COBB may not maintain the overboost function on the 1M.

Cobb essentially takes the overboost function and allows you to use it all the time. I never opened up a stock map file (I don't even know if one exists..) and compared it to the stage1 / stage2 maps from Cobb, but I assume you would notice that oem overboost = stage1's max boost target. And obviously stage2 raises the bar (no pun intended).

I hated the initial Cobb maps when I first installed them... It made the car too explosive. I remember driving up a (very) slight incline and the back end was coming around side ways up the hill! Dry weather. Slight throttle. WTF. I uninstalled and ran my JB4 until Cobb updated the OTS map.... NOW it's as smooth as OEM, except with more fun/wow factor.

You're right though, we're getting off topic... Sorry, I just wanted to know more about this GIAC tune (I'll research on my own).
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      05-30-2013, 07:28 AM   #22
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I'm thinking about getting the Vargas st.2 with TD04 for the next year.
I think that it is the best solution when you go high boost.
For example you can run the 19psi on this turbos whery safery and get approx. 470hp which is enough for a DD.
And you can make a race map with 22psi and get 500hp+ for drag racing or for anything else.
With st.3 you will have a big turbo lag I think and thi is just to get so records on drag racing, not for a DD or track... IMHO
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