BMW, others pay fuel-economy fines

noflash · 01-06-2006, 04:23 PM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737840/

GTS_330 · 01-06-2006, 06:13 PM

wow... that's suck!!!! I thought 30mpg highway is pretty good..... I wonder how will the new 335i turbo stand up to this????

ZenDriver · 01-06-2006, 06:16 PM

US$12M in fines...
/
BMW NA sold 300,000 vehicles (including Mini)...
=
$40 Per vehicle sold.

Yea, I don't think BMW cares sweet FA about this.

ward · 01-06-2006, 06:20 PM

I love how the big 3 aren't penalized for their trucks......

what a load of crap.

voltron1011 · 01-06-2006, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward

I love how the big 3 aren't penalized for their trucks......

what a load of crap.

You took the words right out of my mouth....

poldim · 01-07-2006, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward

I love how the big 3 aren't penalized for their trucks......

what a load of crap.

I was reading that list and wondering where the americraps were. I guess they all average wayyyyy above 27.5 mpg...

ward · 01-07-2006, 02:05 AM

the americans just don't have cars, the only cars they have are all terrible crap that nobody on this board would even consider buying

trucks don't count in that penalty, as the US govt doesn't need to help speed along the death of GM and Ford

poldim · 01-07-2006, 06:51 AM

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/nhtsa/Cfc_t...331.html#32902

All technical talk, but essentially it says the gov has the right to allow certain companies to do whatever. Seems like this applies to US brands...

bavarian19 · 01-07-2006, 07:49 AM

Where are the fines on Hummer? I know its GM, but holy crap. The H2's gas mileage averages about 13mpg. Id say tahts far south of the mark

espo · 01-08-2006, 10:05 AM

I love this fuel economy debate.... A little history. The original idea for these standards came after the gas crissis here in the late 70's. In 1978, the government put in these fleet and individual car taxes and penalties for crappy fuel economy. At that time, they did not want to add and extra tax burden for farmers and small businesses so they exempted "light trucks". Now fast forward to 2006 where 50% of new cars sold by the "big three" fall under that catagory. As a result the overall fuel economy of ALL cars on the road has been dropping over the last 10 years instead of going up. And people wonder why gas prices are $2.50/gal... They deserve it!!

BTW SUVs and other light trucks also do not have as strick environmental regulations as standard cars for the same reasons.... Don't you just love that one also :mad: :mad: :mad:

espo · 01-08-2006, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bavarian19

Where are the fines on Hummer? I know its GM, but holy crap. The H2's gas mileage averages about 13mpg. Id say tahts far south of the mark

Also, if you look up the "gas guzzler tax" schedule, an H2 owner would be hit with a tax of about $7500 for his right to suck up soo much gas. That is if the tax applied to ALL cars/trucks/SUVs sold.

Ed_330i · 01-08-2006, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenDriver

US$12M in fines...
/
BMW NA sold 300,000 vehicles (including Mini)...
=
$40 Per vehicle sold.

Yea, I don't think BMW cares sweet FA about this.

i read that BMW pays bout $28.

BMW0 · 01-08-2006, 12:33 PM

I guess you pay what you have to, to do business in the US.

poldim · 01-13-2006, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by espo89

Also, if you look up the "gas guzzler tax" schedule, an H2 owner would be hit with a tax of about $7500 for his right to suck up soo much gas. That is if the tax applied to ALL cars/trucks/SUVs sold.

Thats just bullshit...

espo · 01-13-2006, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poldim

Thats just bullshit...

Fo you think my numbers are BS or the fact that an owner doesn't have to pay this amount...

If you think my numbers are BS then here is the link that gives the schedule for taxes:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/info.shtml#guzzler

Look at the bottom around the 12.5 number... GM doesn't have to disclose the MPG for the car since it weighs SOO much it isn't even considered a "passenger" car.... Because of that I would have to assume the MPG number is in the 12-14 range..

F32Fleet · 01-13-2006, 12:23 PM

Hey guys...On of the reasons for BMW taking the hit and other (US Companies) do not has to do with the X5. BMW tried getting the X5 classified as a truck (they were going to make dealers sign new dealer agreements which may have addressed customer service/warranty issues, and if the dealer refused to sign, they BMW could withhold the X5 because they were treating it as a truck and not a car), BMW lost the contest in court.

Just my $.02

jcoo085 · 01-13-2006, 01:54 PM

So these fines are only levied on imported vehicles?? Do the US manufacturers have to pay fines as well??

voltron1011 · 01-13-2006, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoo085

Do the US manufacturers have to pay fines as well??

Not really because the only thing they sell is trucks and SUVs, and these fines don't apply to them because of our stupid ass laws that make trucks exempt. Guess what the number one selling vehicle is in the US? The Ford F150 pickup. When you are driving down the freeway in the U.S, 9 out 10 cars is either an SUV or a pickup truck.

lux.sh · 01-13-2006, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by voltron1011

Not really because the only thing they sell is trucks and SUVs, and these fines don't apply to them because of our stupid ass laws that make trucks exempt.

that is so friggin' stupid. more and more, this country is full of sh1t just like any other countries in this world.

jcoo085 · 01-13-2006, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by voltron1011

Not really because the only thing they sell is trucks and SUVs, and these fines don't apply to them because of our stupid ass laws that make trucks exempt. Guess what the number one selling vehicle is in the US? The Ford F150 pickup. When you are driving down the freeway in the U.S, 9 out 10 cars is either an SUV or a pickup truck.

What about those Town Car's, and Crown Victoria's, etc? Or do the US manufacturers sell so many 'trucks' that the cost per unit is so trivial it's not even worth mentioning?

voltron1011 · 01-13-2006, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcoo085

What about those Town Car's, and Crown Victoria's, etc? Or do the US manufacturers sell so many 'trucks' that the cost per unit is so trivial it's not even worth mentioning?

There really isn't much of those kind of cars left... Everyone who drove those is now driving a Lincoln Navigator (based on a Ford Expedition SUV) or a Cadilac Escalade (CHevy Tahoo). It is really out of control the number of Land-Yachts that are out here, all of them averaging 8 miles to the gallon.

jcoo085 · 01-13-2006, 04:22 PM

That's insane. *sniff sniff*. Do I smell glorified protectionism?

01-06-2006, 04:23 PM	#1
noflash Captain Caveman 150 Rep 1,715 Posts Drives: '06 325eyeyiyi Join Date: May 2005 Location: midwest iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 325i [0.00]	BMW, others pay fuel-economy fines http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10737840/
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01-06-2006, 06:13 PM	#2
GTS_330 Private 0 Rep 68 Posts Drives: Sapphire Black 330 Join Date: May 2005 Location: Long Beach, CA iTrader: (0)	wow... that's suck!!!! I thought 30mpg highway is pretty good..... I wonder how will the new 335i turbo stand up to this????
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01-06-2006, 06:20 PM	#4
ward Major General 155 Rep 6,158 Posts Drives: F Join Date: May 2005 Location: T iTrader: (0)	I love how the big 3 aren't penalized for their trucks...... what a load of crap.
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01-07-2006, 02:05 AM	#7
ward Major General 155 Rep 6,158 Posts Drives: F Join Date: May 2005 Location: T iTrader: (0)	the americans just don't have cars, the only cars they have are all terrible crap that nobody on this board would even consider buying trucks don't count in that penalty, as the US govt doesn't need to help speed along the death of GM and Ford
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01-07-2006, 06:51 AM	#8
poldim Vroom Vrrooooom 303 Rep 3,146 Posts Drives: 330i Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (2) Garage List 2006 330i Sedan [0.00] 2003 GSX-R 600 [0.00]	http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/nhtsa/Cfc_t...331.html#32902 All technical talk, but essentially it says the gov has the right to allow certain companies to do whatever. Seems like this applies to US brands... __________________ -Dmitriy 06' BMW 330i & 03' Suzuki GSX-R600 SG \| Beige Dakota \| Poplar \|\| iDrive w/MP3 \| PP \| SP \| CWP \| PDC \| Comfort \| Shades \|\| 40% Tint \| Black Line Tail Lights \| Hardwired V1 Last edited by poldim; 01-07-2006 at 11:27 AM..
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01-06-2006, 06:16 PM	#3
ZenDriver Do Not Taunt Zen Driver. 12 Rep 466 Posts Drives: 325i w/ MT, ZSP in Graphite Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Portland, OR iTrader: (0)	US$12M in fines... / BMW NA sold 300,000 vehicles (including Mini)... = $40 Per vehicle sold. Yea, I don't think BMW cares sweet FA about this.
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01-07-2006, 07:49 AM	#9
bavarian19 General 524 Rep 18,858 Posts Drives: Car Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: VA iTrader: (23)	Where are the fines on Hummer? I know its GM, but holy crap. The H2's gas mileage averages about 13mpg. Id say tahts far south of the mark
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01-08-2006, 10:05 AM	#10
espo Captain 12 Rep 715 Posts Drives: 2014 M235i Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Sugar Land TX iTrader: (0)	I love this fuel economy debate.... A little history. The original idea for these standards came after the gas crissis here in the late 70's. In 1978, the government put in these fleet and individual car taxes and penalties for crappy fuel economy. At that time, they did not want to add and extra tax burden for farmers and small businesses so they exempted "light trucks". Now fast forward to 2006 where 50% of new cars sold by the "big three" fall under that catagory. As a result the overall fuel economy of ALL cars on the road has been dropping over the last 10 years instead of going up. And people wonder why gas prices are $2.50/gal... They deserve it!! BTW SUVs and other light trucks also do not have as strick environmental regulations as standard cars for the same reasons.... Don't you just love that one also :mad: :mad: :mad: __________________ E46 325xi Oxford Green/Sand Leatherette/Myrtle Wood Auto ZCW - Retired E90 330xi Mystic Blue/Black Leather/Aluminum 6sp Manual ZSP/ZPP/ZCW/CA - Retired F22 M235i Mineral Gray/Red Leather/Aluminum 6sp Manual ZPP/ZTP
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01-08-2006, 12:33 PM	#13
BMW0 Colonel 241 Rep 2,059 Posts Drives: AW E90 330i Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Spokane, WA iTrader: (0) Garage List 2006 330i [0.00]	I guess you pay what you have to, to do business in the US. __________________ 330i 6MT l 255 HP @ 5900 rpm 214 lb-ft Torque @ 3500 rpm l Alpine White l Beige l Aluminum l ZSP l 494 l PDC "Freude am Fahren" = "Joy to Drive"
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01-13-2006, 12:23 PM	#16
F32Fleet Lieutenant General 3637 Rep 10,394 Posts Drives: 2015 435i Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southeastern US iTrader: (0)	Hey guys...On of the reasons for BMW taking the hit and other (US Companies) do not has to do with the X5. BMW tried getting the X5 classified as a truck (they were going to make dealers sign new dealer agreements which may have addressed customer service/warranty issues, and if the dealer refused to sign, they BMW could withhold the X5 because they were treating it as a truck and not a car), BMW lost the contest in court. Just my $.02
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01-13-2006, 01:54 PM	#17
jcoo085 Lieutenant 43 Rep 463 Posts Drives: E90 320d Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Stuttgart, Germany iTrader: (0) Garage List 2005 320d [0.00]	So these fines are only levied on imported vehicles?? Do the US manufacturers have to pay fines as well?? __________________ E90 320d - Black Ext/Fluid Grey Int \| Steptronic \| Business Navigation \| PDC \| Sunroof \| Alarm Exterior Pictures \| Interior Pictures \| Video
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01-13-2006, 04:22 PM	#22
jcoo085 Lieutenant 43 Rep 463 Posts Drives: E90 320d Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Stuttgart, Germany iTrader: (0) Garage List 2005 320d [0.00]	That's insane. sniff sniff. Do I smell glorified protectionism? __________________ E90 320d - Black Ext/Fluid Grey Int \| Steptronic \| Business Navigation \| PDC \| Sunroof \| Alarm Exterior Pictures \| Interior Pictures \| Video
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