M1 vs competition

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by ChrisK

Here is what I don't understand. Mercedes Benz, Audi, and rest of the world has never been able to build a better balanced car than the M3...

Presto... Ford has a mustang with the winning formula? c'mon


This debate is ridiculous. Go to the Ford board and beat up on BMW.

What's ridiculous is that people here get so up tight anytime anyone gives someone other than BMW a little credit.

If you can't step back and take an objective look at this comparision, and admit that Ford is putting out VERY serious performance value right now, I'm just not sure what to say to you.

No one here is claiming that the Mustang is going to be a better overall car than the BMW. It's significantly cheapers. All we're saying is that it's a very close match when it comes to performance.

And then as soon as anyone mentions is, out come the fanboys who start ranting crap about it only being able to go fast in a straight line, which has been completely and utterly disproven.

Being on a BWM board, or driving a BMW shouldn't mean you have to choose sides and bash every other vehicle on the road that competes with it. It's childish, but it happens over and over on this forum. It's honestly no wonder the BMW stereotype exists as it does. It holds true to a large portion of the owners who think they're better than other people because of what they drive. All you have to do is look at this thread and you've got undebatable proof that attitude exists.

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

What's ridiculous is that people here get so up tight anytime anyone gives someone other than BMW a little credit.

If you can't step back and take an objective look at this comparision, and admit that Ford is putting out VERY serious performance value right now, I'm just not sure what to say to you.

No one here is claiming that the Mustang is going to be a better overall car than the BMW. It's significantly cheapers. All we're saying is that it's a very close match when it comes to performance.

And then as soon as anyone mentions is, out come the fanboys who start ranting crap about it only being able to go fast in a straight line, which has been completely and utterly disproven.

Being on a BWM board, or driving a BMW shouldn't mean you have to choose sides and bash every other vehicle on the road that competes with it. It's childish, but it happens over and over on this forum. It's honestly no wonder the BMW stereotype exists as it does. It holds true to a large portion of the owners who think they're better than other people because of what they drive. All you have to do is look at this thread and you've got undebatable proof that attitude exists.

Thank You, Thank You, Thank You!

[BrokenVert]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

What's ridiculous is that people here get so up tight anytime anyone gives someone other than BMW a little credit.

If you can't step back and take an objective look at this comparision, and admit that Ford is putting out VERY serious performance value right now, I'm just not sure what to say to you.

No one here is claiming that the Mustang is going to be a better overall car than the BMW. It's significantly cheapers. All we're saying is that it's a very close match when it comes to performance.

And then as soon as anyone mentions is, out come the fanboys who start ranting crap about it only being able to go fast in a straight line, which has been completely and utterly disproven.

Being on a BWM board, or driving a BMW shouldn't mean you have to choose sides and bash every other vehicle on the road that competes with it. It's childish, but it happens over and over on this forum. It's honestly no wonder the BMW stereotype exists as it does. It holds true to a large portion of the owners who think they're better than other people because of what they drive. All you have to do is look at this thread and you've got undebatable proof that attitude exists.

Thank You for summing up the point every post ive made in this thread.

[ChrisK]

Lock this thread and throw away the key.

[oztiks]

To BMWZONE:

You mention price as being 29k and monthly payments of 350.00 (lease on a GT). I just called Ford for pricing for Montreal ,Canada. GT with track pack.. all included taxes etc.... A whopping 52,500.00 Yes you read correctly.... CAMARO 2011 all included SS / RS package all included 49,700.

proof..link + add track pack 13% taxes...and so on.

http://www.ford.ca/app/fo/en/cars/mustang.do

For a Mustang that looks the same as any other mustang in the last decade?? The mustang has a beautiful sound..all I can think of as a compliment...than again so did my Viper...(what a piece of ...... that was) but reading all the hooo haaa HP magazines you would have thought differently. P.S Atleast the camaro looks nice... BUT a big BUT here, if the price would be anywhere close to that 350.00 a month you claim and or 29k I'd absolutely buy 1.

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by oztiks

To BMWZONE:

You mention price as being 29k and monthly payments of 350.00 (lease on a GT). I just called Ford for pricing for Montreal ,Canada. GT with track pack.. all included taxes etc.... A whopping 52,500.00 Yes you read correctly.... CAMARO 2011 all included SS / RS package all included 49,700.

proof..link + add track pack 13% taxes...and so on.

http://www.ford.ca/app/fo/en/cars/mustang.do

For a Mustang that looks the same as any other mustang in the last decade?? The mustang has a beautiful sound..all I can think of as a compliment...than again so did my Viper...(what a piece of ...... that was) but reading all the hooo haaa HP magazines you would have thought differently. P.S Atleast the camaro looks nice... BUT a big BUT here, if the price would be anywhere close to that 350.00 a month you claim and or 29k I'd absolutely buy 1.

http://www.movetotheusa.com/

[HondaGoneRogue]

LOL

[bmwzone]

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/25/2...-chevy-camaro/

29K A-Plan LOADED GT Premium

[bmwzone]

I love my 135i as much as anyone and have had no major issues so I'm even more pleased with BMW. I'm also not immune to new technologies and vehicles from other automakers.

On a quantifiable level, the 5.0 Mustang should be as fast as the M3 or faster, handle as good on a smooth track, have a better electronics package with the Sync 2.0, have equal quality based on defects and other measurable variables, and the styling on a subjective level will be just as appealing.

Status? The M3 has it. $20k more in price? The M3 has it. The "M" mystique? WE.

So admit that that is what BMW is about because performance-wise I see the 5.0 being it's equal.

Now comparing the 5.0 to the 2011 135i? That is even more in the 5.0's favor. Where does a 135i beat a 5.0 Mustang in ANY quantifiable category? Let me guess, it's got "German Engineering" LOL. Come on.

[oztiks]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

http://www.movetotheusa.com/

Not even if the Mustangs were free How's the housing market doing,stocks,health care? etc...although you do have freedom fires

bmwzone.. you are right about everything you say.

Let's change subject, What yall think of Alex Jones?

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by oztiks

Not even if the Mustangs were free How's the housing market doing,stocks,health care? etc...although you do have freedom fires

Ha! I'm quietly doing advanced planning for my 2012 relocation to Vancouver should this country actually elect Palin. Since my Dallas hockey team is performing like a Canadian team, it shouldn't be too hard of a transition.

[adc]

Originally Posted by bmwzone

On a quantifiable level, the 5.0 Mustang should be as fast as the M3 or faster, handle as good on a smooth track

And how exactly do you quantify this? Numbers-racing again?

Status? The M3 has it. (...) The "M" mystique? WE.

Only if you are concerned with such things. Funny you should mention this, and I as an M3 owner wouldn't.

$20k more in price? The M3 has it.

And no apologies necessary. It really is $20k better.

After all these posts, I really don't expect you to understand. I wonder if you've driven one or simply basing your opinion on magazine articles.

If a person has the money and wants something better, why should they go for the cheaper, but less satisfying product? Why settle for less?

Last time I drove a GT (in 2007) I had a 330i with just 230BHP and despite the 100BHP power advantage, there was absolutely nothing on the Ford that made me want it (except perhaps the exhaust sound).

What would sway me this time around? The sync entertainment system???


Why did I chose an M3 over a 135i? I mean, a 135i will have similar amenities, a $500 chip makes it accelerate faster and I'd have an extra $15k in the bank.

It was the way you can deploy all 400 horses on a narrow, bumpy, slick with rain country road that clinched it for me. The balance, speed, engine response and driver feedback are absolutely incredible. I've probably had more fun driving in this harsh winter on all season tires than all my friends combined. Slipping behind the wheel of the M3 is like fitting a glove - the bond is instant. It just works with you and stays with you to an extent other cars don't, and so you gain confidence to push it. And the more you push the better it feels.

I simply don't want or desire another car that steps down in any category. I have my eyes on the M1 but only if it can raise the driving experience one notch higher.


Edit: There is another appealing aspect of the M3 I forgot to mention - it can turn from a comfortable cruiser to hard bruiser at a push of a button - only possible with an adjustable suspension and a very stiff body. When I drive my mother around she has no idea I drive a 400BHP car, my son can play his DS in the back without getting carsick and the wife can take it out shopping - but when I'm alone and the road beckons I can scare myself silly within the first few hundred feet. If I wanted an all out performance machine the only BMW I'd consider would be the MZ4 Coupe, otherwise I'd be looking at an Elise, Exige etc.

So admit that that is what BMW is about because performance-wise I see the 5.0 being it's equal.

What you see and what the reality is are not necessarily the same thing.

Now comparing the 5.0 to the 2011 135i? That is even more in the 5.0's favor. Where does a 135i beat a 5.0 Mustang in ANY quantifiable category?

Just chip the damn thing. A 135i with a $500 JB3 will be as fast or faster than the Mustang.

[oztiks]

Smart move and you know it.

[oztiks]

get him ADC get em' attack...hurt em' muhaha.

[adc]

Originally Posted by oztiks

get him ADC get em' attack...hurt em' muhaha.

I have absolutely no intention of hurting anybody. I don't need people to agree with me. But if someone tries to convince me a Mustang is better than my M3, I'll tell him exactly what I think - in this case, that they're dreaming.

There would be absolutely no market for the M3 if all the other wannabe cars were as good, or better - and massively cheaper. But they aren't, it really is as simple as that.

Now tell me the budget is capped at $35k and I'll start to think really hard about my next move. I might still go with some used car that IMO is more entertaining, but for something fun & fast off the lot, the Mustang would be towards the top of the list. There's the stripped 135i, the Genesis coupe, the Evo, the 370Z, the Camaro SS and last but not least, the Mustang GT. I can see how someone might prefer the Mustang or the Camaro - they're loud, fast, good looking and RWD. Oh and one of them has sync.

But step up to a $55k budget and cars like the M3 play in a different category. Either that or else all their buyers are complete morons who are getting ripped off for decades by companies such as BMW or Benz.

I have a very strong suspicion that some posters have simply never driven an M3 at full tilt. Those who do, usually end up *wanting* it...

Edit: It's that last aspect that I'm hoping the M division will engineer in the M1 (if it ever comes out that is). If they can shoot a large does of OMG in the M1, I for one might fall for it.

[oztiks]

Have you driven a Ford latley? wtf For D umb ass. ahh Joy!!

[HondaGoneRogue]

Originally Posted by adc

Why did I chose an M3 over a 135i? I mean, a 135i will have similar amenities, a $500 chip makes it accelerate faster and I'd have an extra $15k in the bank.

It was the way you can deploy all 400 horses on a narrow, bumpy, slick with rain country road that clinched it for me. The balance, speed, engine response and driver feedback are absolutely incredible. I've probably had more fun driving in this harsh winter on all season tires than all my friends combined. Slipping behind the wheel of the M3 is like fitting a glove - the bond is instant. It just works with you and stays with you to an extent other cars don't, and so you gain confidence to push it. And the more you push the better it feels.

I simply don't want or desire another car that steps down in any category. I have my eyes on the M1 but only if it can raise the driving experience one notch higher.


Edit: There is another appealing aspect of the M3 I forgot to mention - it can turn from a comfortable cruiser to hard bruiser at a push of a button - only possible with an adjustable suspension and a very stiff body. When I drive my mother around she has no idea I drive a 400BHP car, my son can play his DS in the back without getting carsick and the wife can take it out shopping - but when I'm alone and the road beckons I can scare myself silly within the first few hundred feet. If I wanted an all out performance machine the only BMW I'd consider would be the MZ4 Coupe, otherwise I'd be looking at an Elise, Exige etc.

Wonderful post. Great to see a truly passionate post and not "My car is more exspensive, period."

[BrokenVert]

Somebody should post a link to this thread in a mustang forum. Here's the one that I used to frequent...

allfordmustangs.com

[JasonCSU]

I saw this posted on a few boards today. Sounds like this debate could eventually lead to a "forum war".

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/26/s...an-yours-inte/

[oztiks]

BMWZONE"

"On a quantifiable level, the 5.0 Mustang should be as fast as the M3 or faster, handle as good on a smooth track, have a better electronics package with the Sync 2.0, have equal quality based on defects and other measurable variables, and the styling on a subjective level will be just as appealing."


O.K Let's stop kidding, you are joking right? If not. You seriously don't believe the 395whp that's floating around? SERIOUSLY!!

[BrokenVert]

This could be a seriously funny show...but more than likely not. I say that we start this brawl with the GT guys. We could end up on tv

Originally Posted by JasonCSU

I saw this posted on a few boards today. Sounds like this debate could eventually lead to a "forum war".

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/03/26/s...an-yours-inte/

[LeoHammer]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

This could be a seriously funny show...but more than likely not. I say that we start this brawl with the GT guys. We could end up on tv

Let's start a brawl with the Hyundai Genesis guys instead so there's no chance for us to lose and look like Guidos on TV