M1 vs competition

[BrokenVert]

Bforbes...the 2011 gt500 is still using the old supercharged 5.4. That means that it can only get better from here

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

Bforbes...the 2011 gt500 is still using the old supercharged 5.4. That means that it can only get better from here

I did not know that. Funny thing is the GT could possibly handle better. I think its the more balanced car and the power is in a sweet spot.

[gonerogue]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

Bforbes...the 2011 gt500 is still using the old supercharged 5.4. That means that it can only get better from here

The old supercharged 5.4? They changed from an iron block to an aluminum block, cutting over 100lbs from the front end.

[roundel]

Originally Posted by Spartikus

You beat me to it. Ford is freaking sick right now.

Ford is totally sick with these type of performance #'s. Wow. I could get an equivalent performing 5.0 and a Tiguan (winter ride) for the price of today's M3 !

[BrokenVert]

Originally Posted by gonerogue

The old supercharged 5.4? They changed from an iron block to an aluminum block, cutting over 100lbs from the front end.

That's in the standard mustang gt. Ford went from the old 4.6 iron block to a 5.0 aluminum.
The supercharged 5.4 in the current gt500 is an iron block and is over 10 years old...it's been in the svt cobra r, the ford gt, and the gt500

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

That's in the standard mustang gt. Ford went from the old 4.6 iron block to a 5.0 aluminum.
The supercharged 5.4 in the current gt500 is an iron block and is over 10 years old...it's been in the svt cobra r, the ford gt, and the gt500

BrokenVert, the GT500 engine in aluminum now!! How could u miss that?!?!

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/10/2...chicago-debut/

[gonerogue]

Originally Posted by BForbes

BrokenVert, the GT500 engine in aluminum now!! How could u miss that?!?!

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/02/10/2...chicago-debut/

[superchargedman]

Originally Posted by BrokenVert

That's in the standard mustang gt. Ford went from the old 4.6 iron block to a 5.0 aluminum.
The supercharged 5.4 in the current gt500 is an iron block and is over 10 years old...it's been in the svt cobra r, the ford gt, and the gt500

Both the GT and the GT 500 are running new engines for the 2011 year. 412hp (from 320) for the GT and 550hp (from 540) for the GT 500. Dyno runs of the GT show that it's running something closer to 435-440hp at the crank. Huge improvements in engines and handling.

I'd never see myself in a GT 500 when it's that close in price to a Vette, but I think the upcoming street legal Boss 302 has huge potential to be a big contender. There are no official specs, but various sources have speculated on an improved air intake, improved handling, and lowered curb weight.

[BrokenVert]

I thought that the aluminum one was comming for 2012 and that the iron block was still here for 2011

whoops

[///Mangler]

Originally Posted by Guibo

Very impressive time for the GT500. Anyone know which tires were on this car? That lateral g-meter hit 1.1g in the first turn. Same as the ACR in the C&D test. Keep in mind it was also C&D editors at the wheel of the old GT500, not SVT engineers.

So this car in the video is a showroom stock car or are there still "test" items on the car that SVT engineers were testing?

T

[///Mangler]

Originally Posted by superchargedman

Both the GT and the GT 500 are running new engines for the 2011 year. 412hp (from 320) for the GT and 550hp (from 540) for the GT 500. Dyno runs of the GT show that it's running something closer to 435-440hp at the crank. Huge improvements in engines and handling.

I'd never see myself in a GT 500 when it's that close in price to a Vette, but I think the upcoming street legal Boss 302 has huge potential to be a big contender. There are no official specs, but various sources have speculated on an improved air intake, improved handling, and lowered curb weight.

So the GT is going to be quicker than the GT500 with 130 less HP on a track with to VERY long straights? I don't know, we'll have to see.

From the looks of that video, it didn't really have very good track manners. Kinda like a sumo wrestler tap dancing. Not really inspiring to me.

Oh and the best quote in the C&D test of the M3 at VIR "But the real difference was the M3's automated manual gearbox (DCT), which didn't want to downshift on command, and our best lap was achieved while driving the car in pure automatic mode."

I'm pretty sure that when the software bug with the DCT was fixed it would help the times just a smidge.

T

[Guibo]

Originally Posted by ///Mangler

So this car in the video is a showroom stock car or are there still "test" items on the car that SVT engineers were testing?

T

Based on the seat and racing harness, I don't think it can be considered showroom stock, unless Ford will be offering it that way. This is probably still a development mule, close to production, but likely with suspension and tire tweaks. C&D had observed them testing the GT with P-Zero Corsas during another test, so that's why I'm wondering about the tires.

[BBK]

Still talking about Mustangs?

This thread should be changed to 'Anything about the new Mustang'

[trahsub]

Originally Posted by superchargedman

Both the GT and the GT 500 are running new engines for the 2011 year. 412hp (from 320) for the GT and 550hp (from 540) for the GT 500. Dyno runs of the GT show that it's running something closer to 435-440hp at the crank. Huge improvements in engines and handling.

I'd never see myself in a GT 500 when it's that close in price to a Vette, but I think the upcoming street legal Boss 302 has huge potential to be a big contender. There are no official specs, but various sources have speculated on an improved air intake, improved handling, and lowered curb weight.

Fields was speaking about the special-edition Mustangs in the company's recent past, including the Bullit, Mach 1 and C/S, and said that while he couldn't tell the crowd what was coming down the pike, he could give everyone a small hint. Supposedly a 1970 Boss 302 purred across the stage behind him as he finished speaking.

[superchargedman]

Originally Posted by ///Mangler

So the GT is going to be quicker than the GT500 with 130 less HP on a track with to VERY long straights? I don't know, we'll have to see.

From the looks of that video, it didn't really have very good track manners. Kinda like a sumo wrestler tap dancing. Not really inspiring to me.

Oh and the best quote in the C&D test of the M3 at VIR "But the real difference was the M3's automated manual gearbox (DCT), which didn't want to downshift on command, and our best lap was achieved while driving the car in pure automatic mode."

I'm pretty sure that when the software bug with the DCT was fixed it would help the times just a smidge.

T

I'm not sure what you mean. The 2011 GT 5.0 is not going to be faster than the 2011 GT500. I think someone said that the previous gen GT and GT500 were close because of the GT500's inability to turn, due to its terrible balance. The 2011 GT500 dropped 120lb with its aluminum engine. So, it's much more balanced than the 2010 GT500. At VIR, it actually hits 1.2 lateral g's.

[Guibo]

Originally Posted by superchargedman

The 2011 GT500 dropped 120lb with its aluminum engine. So, it's much more balanced than the 2010 GT500. At VIR, it actually hits 1.2 lateral g's.

This is what I find very remarkable. In the Horse Shoe hairpin (Turn 1), it hit 1.1g, according to SVT's meter. Compare that with some others in the Lightning Lap:

Mosler MT900S (Michelin Pilot Sport Cup): 1.16g
ACR (Michelin Pilot Sport Cup): 1.10g
KTM X-bow (Toyo R888): 1.12g
ZR1 (PS2): 1.06g
GT-R (DSST 600): 1.04g
F430 Scuderia (P Zero Corsa): 1.00g
LP670 SV (P Zero Corsa): 0.98g
M3 (Pilot Sport Cup+): 0.91g
'10 GT500: 0.85g

[///Mangler]

Originally Posted by trahsub

The 2011 GT500 lapped VIR NINE seconds faster than the 2010 GT500. 2:58.5. But, the 'go fast in a straight line only: chorus still sings their silly song.

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/05/18/v...-nine-seconds/

Couple of items need to be answered here. Is the Mustang "stock"? No. Did the M3 have race buckets and harnesses. No. Was the M3 an automatic? Yes.

Until the 2011 GT 5.0 hits the track showroom stock, we are still bench racing. Period.


T

[BForbes]

Ford is throwing kitchen sink. This is what I like to see. Competing with the high performance cars offering tangible stuff whilst having 40mpg economy cars for sale as well. Take note Honda/Toyota/etc. I still believe the BMW will go about it differently and offer more finesse and likely the more rewarding experience, perhaps. But the price diff for a similarly equipped can be 20k+. For some they can't get past that especially how machinery depreciates fast. For other its just paper.

[gonerogue]

Originally Posted by ///Mangler

Couple of items need to be answered here. Is the Mustang "stock"? No. Did the M3 have race buckets and harnesses. No. Was the M3 an automatic? Yes.

Until the 2011 GT 5.0 hits the track showroom stock, we are still bench racing. Period.


T

Didn't know they made an automatic M3...

You're calling out an "automatic" M3 (DCT is faster than 6MT, BTW),confusing the GT500 for the GT 5.0, and ignoring the fact that this is a SVT package GT500. The SVT package is pretty extensive, but I don't see any mention of bucket seats here: http://www.mustangblog.com/blog/1042...ackage-details.

Considering the handling improvement of the GT500 and it's huge HP advantage over the M3 on a track with long straights, I don't think it's a long shot that a GT500 SVT package can outgun the M3.

I'd love to see how the GT500's Goodyear Eagle F1 SuperCar G:2 tires stack up to the PS2s and Contis on the M3. They are brand new and I haven't seen any reviews. Equalizing the shoes on all participants or at least being aware of the differences is important when comparing lap times. For example, Falken was able to squeeze a full second out of a Mustang and 370Z at the Streets of Willow with their new RT615-K compared with the previous RT615.

It's hard to compare lap times of different drivers in different conditions, anyway, so we'll always be bench racing even after the cars hit C&D lightning lap

Even in light of the MPG crisis, it's a great time to be a car nut. We're comparing Mustangs with "1M" and M3s, for crying outloud! This kind of competition can only breed more awesome cars and I hope the Japanese throw their hat back into the mix.

More GT500 SVT goodies: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...00-review.html

[///Mangler]

Originally Posted by gonerogue

Didn't know they made an automatic M3...

You're calling out an "automatic" M3 (DCT is faster than 6MT, BTW),confusing the GT500 for the GT 5.0, and ignoring the fact that this is a SVT package GT500. The SVT package is pretty extensive, but I don't see any mention of bucket seats here: http://www.mustangblog.com/blog/1042...ackage-details.

Considering the handling improvement of the GT500 and it's huge HP advantage over the M3 on a track with long straights, I don't think it's a long shot that a GT500 SVT package can outgun the M3.

I'd love to see how the GT500's Goodyear Eagle F1 SuperCar G:2 tires stack up to the PS2s and Contis on the M3. They are brand new and I haven't seen any reviews. Equalizing the shoes on all participants or at least being aware of the differences is important when comparing lap times. For example, Falken was able to squeeze a full second out of a Mustang and 370Z at the Streets of Willow with their new RT615-K compared with the previous RT615.

It's hard to compare lap times of different drivers in different conditions, anyway, so we'll always be bench racing even after the cars hit C&D lightning lap

Even in light of the MPG crisis, it's a great time to be a car nut. We're comparing Mustangs with "1M" and M3s, for crying outloud! This kind of competition can only breed more awesome cars and I hope the Japanese throw their hat back into the mix.

More GT500 SVT goodies: http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...00-review.html

The M3's DCT was run in full automaic mode because of a software issue when they ran the test. So yes, the M3 was an automatic.

I am not confusing anything. Others have claimed that the GT 5.0 will be faster than the one in the video we just watched, hence it will crush the M3.

I say BS. The video shows a car that is better put against the M3 in GTS trim than the handicapped M3 that it is being compared to.

Again, what is the laptime of the GT 5.0, showroom stock, at VIR Grand West with a slushbox tranny?

T

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by ///Mangler

The M3's DCT was run in full automaic mode because of a software issue when they ran the test. So yes, the M3 was an automatic.

I am not confusing anything. Others have claimed that the GT 5.0 will be faster than the one in the video we just watched, hence it will crush the M3.

I say BS. The video shows a car that is better put against the M3 in GTS trim than the handicapped M3 that it is being compared to.

Again, what is the laptime of the GT 5.0, showroom stock, at VIR Grand West with a slushbox tranny?

T

Correct me if I'm wrong here but I dont think anybody in this thread has claimed the 5.0 will be faster than the 2011 GT500. All references were pointing to the VIR times of the 2010 GT500. It is entirely possible that the 5.0 will be faster than that. The point is that a Mustang GT is in the performance arena on that track. A slushbox is an option. I haven't seen them test it with it. I wonder if its actually faster like it is in the Camaro.

[mixxer]

What on that that gt500 in the video is not stock?