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09-01-2010, 12:38 AM | #23 | |
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Some may say and teach that, but it feels awkward to me, for daily driving that is. On the track it could be a different story. But, these cars are for daily driving. Some of them will get a on road course, but they should design it for daily driving. I've watched experienced drivers on road courses and it seems most don't hold their hand locked into one position. I'd probably end up using the lever, as that is what I am accustomed to being a MT driver. I would think that they could design a paddle system that would allow either option, stationary or synched with the hands. Simply create a lock mechanism that detaches the paddles from going around. Engage the lock if you want the paddles to move with your hands. Sheesh, it seems they spend so much time and effort into designing and redesigning the iDrive mechanism that they could take a little engineering effort and make the paddles driver adjustable. |
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09-04-2010, 09:32 PM | #25 |
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09-04-2010, 09:51 PM | #26 | |
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09-04-2010, 11:36 PM | #27 | |
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I drive with both hands on the wheel, except when shifting, and my right hand goes right back after every shift. Hand position isn't the thing. It's holding that position while daily driving, cause it doesn't work for me. There are many times I make 90 degree turns, and I can't hold that position with any comfort. Plus, on certain turns, I'd have to hold 1st for a higher rpm if I kept my hand there. Going right, I'd have to shift then get my hand back to past 6 o'clock position. Going left, I'd have to hold the wheel with my left hand with my elbow pushing into my ribs. For the street, it's easier and more comfortable. As I said, on the track I can see the added control, but the turns and road conditions are different too. |
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09-05-2010, 09:20 AM | #28 | |
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Using the gearlever and one hand on the wheel is more effective than having your hands tied up with that wheel trying to shift! If they were mounted to the colum there would be less hand movement than going for the lever between the seats...you would just reach out. I am not a fan of the paddles on the slushbox 135; sure its great for winding roads, however at the limit and just when you need it the most you have to remove a hand from the wheel anyway.
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09-05-2010, 11:58 AM | #29 | |
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You prefer putting in more steering input on an already understeering car in a corner? These are the feelings you created in me. Good luck in life.
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09-05-2010, 10:23 PM | #30 |
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I like the lever too.
Last edited by M34lnch; 09-05-2010 at 10:32 PM.. |
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09-06-2010, 03:08 AM | #31 |
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[QUOTE=M34lnch;7951193]I like the lever too.[/QUOT
Am I the only one who ordered a 2011 6MT? I test drove the auto and it was nice and all, but it just wasn't the same and I kept wanting to reach down and down shift at stop lights. What is the main reason you guys went for the DCT? |
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09-06-2010, 12:42 PM | #32 |
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Here are a couple of videos showing the "shuffle" method of always bringing your hands back to 9 and 3. This is the method I've been taught for driving on the track, rally-x, curvy mountain roads, etc.
This video is particularly cool because it is Chris Harris demonstrating drifting in an E39 M5.
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09-06-2010, 10:26 PM | #33 |
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This is it. Hands never get funny. always clear, always in control etc etc. Everyone does differently, what ever floats your boat.
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Last edited by Evice; 09-06-2010 at 10:34 PM.. |
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09-06-2010, 11:10 PM | #34 |
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Shifts are perfect every time and lightning quick. My hands never leave the wheel. My left foot is free to work the brake making gas/brake transitions quicker. More of my concentration goes to my driving line than transmission.
Also, the shifts are fast enough that the turbo doesn't drop boost on upshifts.
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09-07-2010, 04:19 AM | #35 |
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Yup, this is why DCT has an advantage over MT, and why I wanted a 1M with M-DCT......because in almost all top flight motorsport these days, sequential gearboxes/DCT/AMT's etc.,etc are used..... and that's precisely what I wanted to use a 1M for as well as a DD.
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09-11-2010, 12:01 AM | #36 | |
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Put a good boost gauge on it and take a look The DCT MUST decouple the engine from the trans even for it's ultra fast shifts, but it must still decouple. That will drop boost, even if less than an MT. Still, how much boost drops in an MT depends also on the driver. The Step is constant coupled with the torque converter, so it can claim the least boost drop, if any. I've never experienced shifting as removing my concentration away from the coming corner. It's just part of driving. I do like the feeling of a DSG, DCT, or Step coming to a corner. Better? Nah. Just different. I mean, do I not walk as well, and trip more often when I'm chewing gum at the same time? No. We all have different levels of coordination, which also explains why some people are professional race car drivers and most are not. BTW, I'm not a pro driver, but I play guitar very well, and I'm not a bad drummer either. |
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09-11-2010, 12:42 AM | #37 | ||
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2023 Supra 6MT - Deposit and Wait Last edited by MarkR171; 09-11-2010 at 12:47 AM.. |
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09-11-2010, 12:46 PM | #38 |
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09-11-2010, 12:50 PM | #39 | |
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I like listening to all the whinging about manual being better depending on the driver... Not saying it's not more enjoyable for some, but the bullshit has to stop at some point and data like this helps. Yes, it's missing a clutch pedal. But as one of the folks that's gone from a 135 MT to an 11' DCT I can tell you the arguement is about personal pref FAAAAAAR more than it is about the claims of fantastic stick skills. The DCT works very well. It functions on demand and or automatically and while there are always situational considerations to argue, most of this gets back to fragile ego... which is in no short supply round here... Last edited by Frustration; 09-11-2010 at 08:53 PM.. |
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09-11-2010, 01:15 PM | #40 | |
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9 and 3 doesnt mean 100% of the time, but it relates to a heavy enough percentage to still be enough of an overwhelming majority to make some of the complaining amount to arguement for arguements sake. |
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09-11-2010, 02:23 PM | #41 |
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09-11-2010, 08:48 PM | #42 | |
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I retract my comment. Technically, there is no throttle with valvetronic, in the traditional sense. But, there has to be some reduction, or the shifts wouldn't be that smooth. Imagine your WFO and the shift goes 1-2, if there were no reduction in "throttle", even as fast as the DCT is, there would be rpm surge as the next clutch reengages, and the shift would feel awkward, like a bad MT shift. I see that "throttle" is at 100%, but, is that an indication of pedal throttle, or what? I've driven dual clutches and automatics, and yes, the throttle pedal can be to the floor. But, what the ECU does is a different matter, as the pedal is simply drive by wire. I'm open to being wrong on that though. Last edited by RPM90; 09-11-2010 at 08:58 PM.. |
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09-11-2010, 08:54 PM | #43 | |
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Nearly all of the MT drivers on this forum do NOT argue about how good/great the DCT is at doing it's thing. What MT drivers try to explain is SIMPLY that MT gives them more enjoyment. If there is anything related to ego, it's that some DCT owners have had theirs blown up out of proportion. Last edited by RPM90; 09-14-2010 at 12:00 AM.. |
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