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01-23-2017, 12:40 PM | #46 |
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There is, but the prices are higher.
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01-24-2017, 11:39 AM | #48 |
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I'm on my second repair job through my warranty. Injector #3 is out and they'll replace that. But I have to buy the other two out of pocket to ensure they all work.
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01-25-2017, 08:47 AM | #49 |
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Odd. Why are they not covering the others? From what I hear it's required to do them in sets.
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01-25-2017, 11:31 AM | #50 |
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I know. When I asked they said that the injector is only covered if it's faulty/broken/damaged. So #3 is and the others are fine. I'll call back and see if I can press the issue but I'm not getting my hopes up.
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01-25-2017, 07:36 PM | #52 |
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01-25-2017, 07:48 PM | #53 |
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Also see if you can get the BMW instruction sheet saying if you do one do all. That will help.
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01-26-2017, 08:55 AM | #54 |
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This is what you want. It's in their best interest to pay for labor once
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01-26-2017, 02:48 PM | #55 |
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Just got off the phone, they'll cover all three injectors on that bank. Phew.
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01-26-2017, 03:32 PM | #56 |
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Good for you!
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01-26-2017, 10:28 PM | #57 |
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Of course, no reputable extended warranty company writes policies that they know from detailed experience that they will lose money on. And the cost of repairs on BMWs can't be a mystery to anyone :-)
Any thread like this will suffer from the same bias that online reviews suffer from, when one tries to make sense of the high number of awful product ratings on products one assumes would be reliable. If you bought a washing machine and it works fine for you, there is little motivation to write a post saying the appliance is terrific, whereas if the appliance gave nothing but grief, many people will want the whole world to know about it. Likewise, a post from a BMW tech saying that these things pay off, has to be taken in the same light. If all you ever get at the dealer is an oil change, the dealer and the tech have no idea whether or not you have an extended warranty, it is only when you file a claim that this becomes obvious. Assuming I am using the term correctly, this is called "selection bias." None of the above should be interpreted as a reason for you to either buy or refuse to buy an extended warranty. I live in a rural location and nowadays I try to buy all of my major appliances from Costco, and to buy their extended warranties which are also cheap. Once the appliance gets to 5 years of age and the warranty is finished, the first sign of a breakdown and the appliance goes to the landfill. This is because I have come to the conclusion that I have better things to do with my time than searching for appliance repairmen, and that I no longer want to deal with the agonizing decision of dealing with a 3 year old broken dishwasher and deciding whether or not I should get it fixed. For me, it is a convenience decision, I prefer to have an arbitrary set of guidelines for when or if I will deal with a broken major appliance, and I am willing to pay for that convenience. Likewise, one can make a similar decision on a car, either because one thinks one can't afford some potential repairs, because one doubts how a used car they bought was treated by prior owner(s), convenience, whatever. Just don't kid yourself that this is a money-saving approach, ON AVERAGE. I can assure you that the extended warranty companies have access to much better claim/loss information that you do, and that they have made a well-founded business decision on whether or not to offer you a warranty on you car, what to cover and what not to cover, and how much to charge you for their coverage. Most people will not come out in the plus column on these policies; if they did, the companies selling them would go out of business, and quickly. |
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01-26-2017, 11:32 PM | #58 |
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Out of curiosity do you buy health insurance? Same principle applies of course. Some will & some won't come out ahead. Bigger macro economics at work are that these companies take in premiums, roll the investment, and expect their profits to exceed the claims. Even if they lose money on certain models or brands they make it up in the time value of money vs. investment and cost.
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01-26-2017, 11:39 PM | #59 |
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01-27-2017, 12:09 AM | #60 | |
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My answer to your question would depend on whether I am who I unfortunately am, or if I were Warren Buffet or Donald Trump. If I were Warren Buffet I would not buy health insurance, most probably, since anything that would happen to me I could afford to pay for in cash and it just wouldn't be worth the effort to fill out the forms and deal with the insurance company (forget for the purpose of this discussion that he would be on Medicare so he wouldn't really need to pay much for basic coverage). Similarly, if I were Donald Trump, the taxpayers would pay for my medical care for the rest of my life, so I'd not bother with health insurance. So now we get to me personally, unfortunate serf that I am. Were I to need a bone marrow transplant, for example, that could bankrupt me. Even though the odds of my needing that are small, I would not want to deal with that or anything similar so I would elect to pay for health insurance. Getting back to a vehicle, let's take a hypothetical 135i that might be worth $20 or $25K at the present. By definition, the most that one could lose on that car would be its present value, because you could always have it hauled to the dump or donate it to Father Joe or whatever; that is your downside. If you financed the car and the car is worth less than you owe, then of course your downside might be a little bit worse than that. But, unlike your life, the downside would have a definite financial cap on it. Am I personally willing to accept the possibility that when my car goes out of warranty that I might need to place that call to Father Joe? Yes, I can deal with that. |
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01-27-2017, 07:14 AM | #61 |
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Ok let's take a deeper dive here. We're talking about a car valued at 20 to 25k currently. The warranty cost is 3000 to 3500 give or take, and I believe we can agree that in 5 years of ownership and 60,000 miles (coverage) there is bound to be some repair work on what would now be a 5-10 year old car.
Ordinary and typical items would be the OFHG $500 to $700, water pump $1000-$1400, window regulator $750?, door lock actuator $250-$500?, valve cover seal, injectors $2500, HPFP/LPFP/turbos$$, other? If one expects to pay for any two of those in 5 years that covers half the cost of the warranty or more. Paying, or gambling, or even wasting, depending on your point of view, around $1500 or less on anything else that might possibly go wrong on a 5 to 10 to now 15 year old car doesn't seem that bad a bet. Yes, I agree with you that the actuarials probably know their loss vs. investment upside (market investments vs. repairs aggregated over time) but for an individual person the true out of pocket final cost is small vs the common, known repairs, or worse yet a possible catastrophic failure event like a new transmission that cost $7000+ for a DCT equipped car. Or valve guide seals,
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01-27-2017, 08:42 AM | #62 | |
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Now let's talk volume. A company such as this will simply not have the man power to run a return rate analysis on every single car before they approve a policy, especially less common cars like the 1-Series. So the truth of the matter is that as people who spend a shit-ton of time on the internet communities based for these cars, we probably have more knowledge on our specific vehicle than they could ever hope to have on hand. So when I saw a warranty this comprehensive (lifetime, unlimited miles, complete coverage) at the price purchased, it was a no-hesitation decision. I drive hard and plan to keep the car for a LONG time, things will fail, and "things" are expensive.
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01-27-2017, 08:05 PM | #63 | |
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Of course, they don't know how your particular car is going to do, and some people do come out on these things. Some people win the lottery also, I have seen them on TV, but that is not a justification for a reasonable person to buy a lottery ticket :-) 2 of my 1 Series vehicles are still under warranty; my 1M is not. A bit more than a year ago there was a thread somewhere here about a dealer north of LA who was selling BMW-branded extended warranties at a reduced rate. I called the dealership and spoke with the manager who deals with those warranties, in the F&I dept., which is where you generally find the real sharks in any automobile dealership. I explained my situation to the guy including my likely usage of the vehicle. This gentleman (and he was a gentleman as you can see from what follows) strongly advised me not to buy the warranty, which I believe would have cost around $2500 for 3 years. He said, that with my likely usage of the vehicle there was no way I would ever come out on this warranty, that I would be flushing the money down the toilet. I then asked him, that being as he is in the business of selling product like this, why would he advise me not to buy it? He explained that they were a small family owned dealership and they value their reputation and don't sell stuff that is a bad deal. He said that with my intended low mileage usage, with a relatively low mileage car, that I should not buy the policy, end statement. I thanked him and that was the end of the call. Once again, I can see very clearly a situation where it would make sense for a person to buy an extended warranty on a vehicle, even if on average similar people buying similar policies on similar vehicles, would not on average come out on them. I am not advising anyone here not to buy an extended warranty. What I am saying, however, is that you are fooling yourself if you think that these companies don't know what they are selling, don't know what the loss ratios are on any particular car in any particular brand, and that they think it is OK that they subsidize BMW owners at the expense of Ford (or whatever) owners. That is truly what they call "magical thinking." |
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01-28-2017, 02:01 AM | #64 |
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I would never buy a dealer offered extended warranty. I also am glad I own a BMW with a credit union available after market extended warranty. Different products, different value.
To each his own decisions. For you it surely doesn't sound like it makes sense. For me it's a an obvious and easy value based decision. |
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01-28-2017, 10:48 AM | #65 | |
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It's all about return value, I think we agree on that. For someone who doesn't drive their car much it makes less sense. For someone who puts 20k+ miles on the car every year, it makes a world of sense.
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01-28-2017, 05:44 PM | #66 | |
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And yes, it makes no sense for ME to buy an extended warranty given my stable of cars and the low amount of mileage that any of them accumulate in a year. None of this negates my earlier comments; some may come out financially on an extended warranty, however taking the entire pool of similar cars out there, the company selling the extended warranties will normally make money, otherwise it would either go out of business or have no reason to be in business in the first place. This does not mean that I don't think it would be a reasonable decision to buy such a warranty for certain people. And of course, it is not my decision to make! This is a free country! |
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