BMW 128i, 370Z, Camaro, Genesis Coupe?

[amdmaxx]

Get genesis coupe and chip it.

Originally Posted by ajc

OK - There are 4 cars that I am considering (Camaro, 370Z. BMW 128i, Genesis Coupe).

I test drove all but the Camaro.

370Z - The Z is a beautiful car from any way you look at it. When you sit in the car you get such a great feel. Nissan did a great job on the exterior & interior. The Z out on the road is where it goes down hill. I think they forgot to put shocks in the Z, it rides like a a rock, you feel every thing and it's not good on the back. This car was made for the track and that's it. The Z is off my list.

Genesis Coupe - Hyundai did a real nice job with this car. The exterior looks great and the interior is nice. Out on the road is where this car also falls short, not as bad as the 370Z but still harsh for every day driving. The car handles very well. Also off my list.

BMW 128i - Now this is a remarkable driving machine. The exterior is different but looks BMW. The interior is kind of plane but still very nice. When you sit in the BMW you can feel it's a solid well built car. I started the car and the exhaust note put a big grin on my face. The BMW drives beautifully, it handles great and it has a great feel. This is a great driving machine where you want to just drive. This car can be driven as a daily driver because you do not get beat up like the 370Z and the Genesis Coupe. The BMW is definitely on my list. Now I have to drive the Camaro and make my decision

[amdmaxx]

How is that related?

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

GM is going bankrupt. I wouldn't buy one now.

[gtaday51]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

GM is going bankrupt. I wouldn't buy one now.

It is that atitude that will be the end of the American car industry just as the American Steel industry died all those years ago.

Im a Ford guy...thank my dad for that...but American cars are still fantastic (2010 Fusion anybody) and quite frankly are worth your money.

[drivendriver]

Originally Posted by JHZR2

There is a comparisson between the 370Z and the 135i (and a couple other cars) in the latest automobile or car and driver (I forget which). The 370Z wins over the 135i, but not by much - for what that's worth.

I think I read that article in a bookstore. IIRC, it's a comparison between 4 cars ("Best value sports cars" or something like that). The Mazda RX-8 was also included. I can't remember the 4th car. The 370Z took the first place, and the 135i came in second. And the main reason why the 370Z beat the 135i is because it fared better on the track.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

I'm really not sure what you're bitching about with the interior. You guys can try to blast GM all you want on the interior, but this is simply the fastest new car you can buy for $32k. It's not like BMW interiors are out of this world. The design on the Camaro fits the retro image of the car, and at least GM saw fit to include more than an oil temp gauge on the performance models. I'm betting it's probably got a real dipstick as well.

In the same way you like the style some dislike. Agreed that it is fast but speed is not as important to some as what you have to look at every time you sit in it. At the end of the day style is personal taste.

The whole retro/heritage thing works for Harley Davidson but is one more reason why GM is in the poorhouse. The market for this sort of car has shrunk. If GM moved along with technology like other manufactures they may not be on the verge of collapse.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

If GM moved along with technology like other manufactures they may not be on the verge of collapse.

And what technology would that be? This car has a 300Hp direct injected V6 available that bests the 135i's fuel economy, even though it's significantly larger and heavier.


Retro styling doesn't equal a retro powertrain, and even BMW has called on its heritage to sell cars. They openly (and wrongly) billed the 1Series as a successor to the 2002.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by gtaday51

It is that atitude that will be the end of the American car industry just as the American Steel industry died all those years ago.

Im a Ford guy...thank my dad for that...but American cars are still fantastic (2010 Fusion anybody) and quite frankly are worth your money.

It is the attitude of 77% of Americans as well. They have to be allowed to reinvent themselves without the help of taxpayers. Just like every other business who is in the same predicament.

I give you that Ford is the only one who say the light a number of years ago and started to turn things around without govt help.

[scorcherjf]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

It is the attitude of 77% of Americans as well. They have to be allowed to reinvent themselves without the help of taxpayers. Just like every other business who is in the same predicament.

I give you that Ford is the only one who say the light a number of years ago and started to turn things around without govt help.

Yep. Ford is also the only one out of the big three who didn't take any government bailout money, which is a +1 in my book!

Besides, why should americans be forced to buy garbage cars just to save a dying company? It's the company's fault for getting where they are now, not the consumer. The consumer talks with their wallet, and they've made it clear what cars they prefer.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

I give you that Ford is the only one who say the light a number of years ago and started to turn things around without govt help.

You don't even have a basic understanding of the situation, and that statement proves it. Neither does the vast majority of the American public. The problem is a little too large for "Joe the Plumber" to wrap his mind around at this point, and letting the car US car industry die largely because of mismanagement in the financial sector would (or maybe will) go down in history as one of the worst mistakes of modern times. You have no idea what the financial landscape of this country will look like without large scale automotive manufacturing.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

And what technology would that be? This car has a 300Hp direct injected V6 available that bests the 135i's fuel economy, even though it's significantly larger and heavier.


Retro styling doesn't equal a retro powertrain, and even BMW has called on its heritage to sell cars. They openly (and wrongly) billed the 1Series as a successor to the 2002.

So, explain to me with all the great things about GM why are they in the state they are in?

What are the fuel economy numbers?

the difference with BMW using heritage to sell cars is it seems to be working for them. The 1 series was never meant to be the successor to the 2002. It was built in the 'spirit' of the 2002. (Small coupe, big engine, etc)

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by scorcherjf

Yep. Ford is also the only one out of the big three who didn't take any government bailout money, which is a +1 in my book!

.

Ford didn't need the money because they cashed in a massive line of credit just before the banking industry collapsed. GM could have done the same thing, but didn't need it as badly, so they waited, and are now paying the price. GM currently has the best lineup of the bunch, especially if you care about performance. Ford got lucky, nothing more.

[gtaday51]

Originally Posted by scorcherjf

Yep. Ford is also the only one out of the big three who didn't take any government bailout money, which is a +1 in my book!

Besides, why should americans be forced to buy garbage cars just to save a dying company? It's the company's fault for getting where they are now, not the consumer. The consumer talks with their wallet, and they've made it clear what cars they prefer.

For the record. American cars were crap in the 80s and that idea has stuck with us for 20 years!
I want Ford to survive. And GM is consolodating, bye bye Pontiac.

But as far as im concerned. Crysler has already taken a bailout and they have been making horrible cars. I remember driving in a foot deep snowfall this year. I was taking a turn in my 135i and I saw a Jeep behind me spin off into the grass. How is it that an SUV cant take a turn faster than a RWD sports car in the snow?

Crysler can flounder for all I care.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

You don't even have a basic understanding of the situation, and that statement proves it. Neither does the vast majority of the American public. The problem is a little too large for "Joe the Plumber" to wrap his mind around at this point, and letting the car US car industry die largely because of mismanagement in the financial sector would (or maybe will) go down in history as one of the worst mistakes of modern times. You have no idea what the financial landscape of this country will look like without large scale automotive manufacturing.

And I suppose you do?

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

Ford didn't need the money because they cashed in a massive line of credit just before the banking industry collapsed. GM could have done the same thing, but didn't need it as badly, so they waited, and are now paying the price. GM currently has the best lineup of the bunch, especially if you care about performance. Ford got lucky, nothing more.

And the fact that the sell more cars. They have a large market abroad as well. Also they dont have the enormous labor costs.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

So, explain to me with all the great things about GM why are they in the state they are in?

What are the fuel economy numbers?

the difference with BMW using heritage to sell cars is it seems to be working for them. The 1 series was never meant to be the successor to the 2002. It was built in the 'spirit' of the 2002. (Small coupe, big engine, etc)

Fuel economy numbers? What are you talking about? GM's cars are near the top of nearly every class when it comes to fuel economy.

GM is in the state they're in because the financial markets collapsed while they were in the middle of a restructuring process, which denied them the operating capital they need, and shut down sales. In case you haven't noticed, sales suck for just about every full range auto manufacturer right now, not just GM. They were simply in a more vulnerable position when the downturn started.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

And the fact that the sell more cars. They have a large market abroad as well. Also they dont have the enormous labor costs.

Ford sells more cars than GM now? You prove once again that you don't really have the knowledge to be having this argument.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

Ford sells more cars than GM now? You prove once again that you don't really have the knowledge to be having this argument.

March 2009 sales figures

Ford - 109,490
GMC - 19,086

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

March 2009 sales figures

Ford - 109,490
GMC - 19,086

I'm going to leave it at that. You're not worth the time.

[scorcherjf]

Originally Posted by MrRoboto

March 2009 sales figures

Ford - 109,490
GMC - 19,086

Um... GM sold 8.35 million cars in 2008.

[gtaday51]

He compared Ford(the car brand) to GMC (the car brand). Not the actual company...just the brand. And those Ford figures are way low at that.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by gtaday51

He compared Ford(the car brand) to GMC (the car brand). Not the actual company...just the brand. And those Ford figures are way low at that.

Exactly.

[MrRoboto]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

I'm going to leave it at that. You're not worth the time.

They are not my numbers. Why do you have to act like such an ass? Cant you engage in a debate? If the numbers are wrong educate us.