04-27-2012, 01:12 AM | #112 |
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I had no idea there was that much auto theft in the UK. I have never been and I seem to have this image that there is no crime because the cops don't even carry weapons.
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04-27-2012, 03:11 AM | #113 |
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Premium cars attract alot of stolen to order, a number end up somewhere in Europe on the back of lorries.....
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04-27-2012, 07:22 AM | #114 | |
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I also decided to write a letter to BMW UK (well, why not...) and enclose a pdf of the response I got. I wrote quite a detailed letter outlining the problem and referring to the recent theft of a footballer's X6 reported in the Press. Although I specifically stated that there was a blind spot in the alarm they appear to directly refute this claim with (para 5)... "should the vehicle be locked, the vehicle would need to be broken into to gain access to the port and at this point, the alarm system on your vehicle is designed to sound..." They also refer to other premium brand vehicles being targetted equally, but I am not aware that this has been with anything like the success thieves have had in targetting late model BMWs. I wondered if anyone had any comments on this response which indicates that they have now moved on to an awareness of 'a' problem but deny any flaws in the alarm set up or OBD positioning, and clearly states that no recall or solution is to be offered by BMW. |
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04-27-2012, 07:44 AM | #115 |
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I must admit, for some time now I had been locking the car pressing the lock button twice believing this was a double dead lock like a number of my other cars and my current other but then finding out depressing for the second time on the 1M actually switches off the internal sensors and the tilt sensor, this could in fact be what a number have done not even realising as I know of people always press a second time to check they have in actually locked the car the first time, the rest could be then history and no alarm would sound from a broken window etc.
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04-27-2012, 10:01 AM | #116 | |
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04-27-2012, 01:32 PM | #117 |
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hahaha! that letter was historical. in essence:
...blah, blah, blah...yes we've heard about this...blah, blah, blah...sorry, but we can't move the OBD port...blah, blah, blah...blind spot you say? HA! What blind spot? we're not aware of one...blah, blah, blah...because we're bmw...this is bound to happen [stolen cars], because everyone LOVES us...and while we're sorry about this...at least the thieves will be driving a BMW as opposed to [let's say] an accord...blah, blah, blah...i'm done with this letter, so please see your local dealer and bug them about this matter. Yours sincerely, blah, blah, blah |
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04-27-2012, 02:03 PM | #118 | |
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If only......
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04-27-2012, 02:29 PM | #119 | |
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I'm moving my own OBD port!
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04-29-2012, 02:33 PM | #120 | |
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Thanks to the OP in this thread I have done the needful to my car following my latest communication with BMW in reply to the previous woeful response. Although they ignored my comment about alarm blind spot... perhaps the alarm would go off if the glass is broken... they advised that I or a third party can do what I want to the OBD port as part of "Block Exemption" and it will not harm my vehicles warranty if I did so with the usual exemptions to faults regarding the device. If enough people take suitable action the scum will get bored and move on to something else when their easy steal method fails. See letter below: Dear Shost Thank you for your email dated April 25, 2012. I am sorry that you have had further cause to contact BMW Customer Service regarding the issue you have previously raised with my colleague. After reading the additional comments you have made, I acknowledge that you have carried out some research on the Internet. While this can be a useful tool, it does not always give a reliable representation of a possible situation as it is not a regulated source. BMW are aware of claims that our vehicles can be stolen in the way you have mentioned and I can confirm that this is an area which is still under internal investigation. I can advise that BMW are always endeavouring to stay ahead of the people behind organised vehicle crime. There are many measures in place that guard against electronic attacks on a BMW and software is updated periodically to ensure our vehicles remain secure. I can confirm that under block exemption, it is entirely at your discretion whether you or a third party decide to modify the OBD port. However, if a fault occurs which is directly attributed to the work carried out or non approved parts are used, the warranty will not cover the cost of repair. Any warranty work, must be carried out by a BMW Approved Dealership. Please be assured that your additional comments have been logged under case reference number 1-78XXXXXXX, which will be used in conjunction with our ongoing product auditing and customer satisfaction programmes. I trust that this information clarifies our position, however, please be assured of my full attention should you require it again in the future. Yours sincerely BMW UK Diane Lee I Love that second to last paragraph, last line. DAMM RIGHT you'll product audit! Last edited by Shost; 04-29-2012 at 03:30 PM.. |
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04-29-2012, 03:08 PM | #121 |
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Come on BMW, your responses to our concerns are not good enough.
I don't often leave my car in places I'm not familiar with but to know that it is so vulnerable to theft makes me feel very uneasy. Modern car security should be far better and BMW has a serious problem with blank keys and programming devices being available to joe public. The paragraph in Tamara's reply from BMW to say that owners would need to pay for any software updates to be applied to their vehicle is a joke. It won't be long before our insurance premiums will increase and I for one would seriously consider switching brands if this was to happen. In the meantime I hope my coded underground car park with CCTV, trackstar and steering wheel lock will keep the thieving b**stards away! |
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05-26-2012, 08:02 AM | #122 |
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hi guys, been following this story ,I was led to this link via pistonheads via another site etc.etc.
My sister bought a 335d recently and read about this after buying it so with this in mind I fitted a small switch to two of the wires leading to the obd port, one to the obd port power and one to another terminal,(which shall remain secret obviously)which any scantool needs to interface with the vehicle. these are obviously hidden and can remain off until you need to access the obd port. This method will kill any attempt to programme any key. 3 nights ago the inevitable happened,window broken alarm triggered, obd port cover removed and no one to be seen BUT importantly the car was still there. If you are considering this approach any competent mechanic/sparks could do this in 20 minutes and will cost the price of a couple of micro switches,and a beer,cheap for peace of mind. |
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05-26-2012, 12:38 PM | #123 | |
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Thanks for that mate, you could make yourself a few quid and some extra pocket money if your'e up for a few 1M owners needing some work |
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05-26-2012, 04:11 PM | #125 |
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Thanks to the indifference/incompetence that BMW demonstrates yet again people are finding their way out themselves, history repeats itself and bravo for you guys who just don't surrender under such circumstances
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05-26-2012, 04:47 PM | #126 | |
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The idea is to prevent simple and easy access to the OBD port with out taking at chance at voiding the warranty
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05-27-2012, 09:47 PM | #127 |
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£600! No way your tires are that heavy, (Doc).
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05-27-2012, 10:51 PM | #128 |
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So, fellow 1M'ers - What after-market security systems would you guys recommend?
I was considering Viper's security system with proximity sensors sync'd to my iPhone for notifications of anyone nearing the vehicle. I got quoted ~$1k USD for the complete installation with proximity sensors. I feel like relocating the OBD Connector is just a minor deterrent that a thief can overcome if they spend a little bit of time watching your car. |
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06-01-2012, 03:51 AM | #130 |
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Just in the dealers and enquired about this , they have no knowledge at all about it and say its not possible , wish BMW would just wake up , why not do a software update to sort this ?
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06-01-2012, 04:04 AM | #131 |
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The crux of the problem is this: I have at my disposal a huge database containing all this information. I am not able to link to it (it is not pulic domain) and I cannot refer directly to it any more than a doctor could refer to medical notes. For example I would never dream of posting information as sepcific as Band0 seemed to be willing to. I also do not have access to this database when I'm posting. I am forced to refer to it from memory - it's not easy to recall perfect details when I'm talking about literally hundreds of reports. I'm also not in a position to have a 'strategic overview' like many claim to in this thread. My information is from a relatively limited geographical area but a large sample size if that makes sense. Believe me or choose not to, but I am fairly uniquely positioned in the centre of this issue in that: I am dealing with muliple instances first hand (so not a lone victim telling of their particular theft) I am not affiliated to BMW in any way but I just so happen to know a guy who actually works on their CAS systems as a design engineer so speaking to him about what BMW know has been very interesting to say the least. They are not as blind to the problem as they may seem and while some of their public responses are indeed laughable they are though necessity trying to keep a lid on the situation. Some facts for you to ponder from my experience. Sorry, no links to corroborate this as none of it is in the public domain and I could obviously have made it all up. Roughly 2/3 rds of thefts involve broken glass at scene or on recovery of car (sample size ~300 vehicles) It appears that high tech methods are NOT routinely employed to gain access to these cars. Accurate lock drilling/pulling is also happening but less frequently. Also in a minority of cases, often involving cars with comfort entry, there is no clear indication how access was gained. There is credible evidence that radio jammers may be used to block a key fob from remotely locking a car, or to disruupt the 'comfort entry' proximity system. This causes victims to walk away leaving their vehicles unlocked unwittingly and they will swear blind they locked their car as they always do. BMW's are the only premium cars being stolen without keys in any significant number. Thefts outnumber the next most stolen premium marque about 3:1 (audis - key burglaries largely). Obviously this is meaningless without relative 'population sizes'. Audis and Mercs seem immune to "high tech" keyless theft. There are handfuls of other "keyless" thefts across all marques but these generally shake down to being the victim being mistaken (or on occasion lying to cover up the fact they left their keys in the ignition and thus invalidating their insurance) or to cars being lifted for parking infractions and then the reports not being properly resolved. Some very old cars are obviously still hotwireable. It's safe to say that in my experience NO criminal gang routinely lifts these cars on recovery trucks. Sheds towed by tinkers for scrap - yes. BMW's lifted off the street onto recovery trucks? No. Recovery rates are very low at under 20% for BMW's vs over 50% across the board for all makes/models. Believe it or not if you get your car stolen you have a good chance of getting it back if it's not a BMW. The device mentioned earlier in this thread doesn't code the key to the car, it codes the car to the key - it adds the key to the CAS as an accepted key which then opens and starts the car as normal. You can code one key to multiple cars in this manner. The key is in effect "solid state" and can't be re-coded or given a new identity, and doesn't need to be. It is almost exclusively M-sport trim vehicles being taken. Diesels are very commonly stolen, along with all points of the model ranges. Premium specs are seemingly targeted like 335i's, 335d's but again without knowing the relative sales numbers its hard to know what's significant. 120d's, 5 series of all engine variants are going just as regularly so it's by no means only big engined or the most powerful cars being sought by thieves (but nice trim and spec ones and left hand drives do certainly seem to be more nickable) Vehicles 2006 to present are affected, so long as it's an 'electronic' key without a physical ignition barrel. 2006-2009 seem worst hit. Again one assumes becuase it's parts demand driving theft and there's less parts demand for brand new cars. What we AREN'T seeing is M-cars being targeted. Very few M5/M6/M3's are going. One assumes that this is because there isn't parts demand for them abroad, where smaller engines and diesels are far more common. This is of course conjecture. Being petrol heads I guess we assume that if you could stroll off with any BMW you'd pick the most potent. These are organised gangs and they steal for profit, not joyriding or fun. X5's and X6's are being stolen - they're more likely to be recovered and they appear to be staying in one piece and going for export to Africa, whereas the bulk of "saloon" cars nicked appear to be broken for panels and parts very quickly and so recovery chances are lower. It is also a big problem in Germany and the rest of the continent, the UK is not alone. There is no suggestion BMW dealers/garages are involved - they don't need to be. You don't need loads of spare keys because one can be used over and over again. Remember, they're driving these cars off to be broken, not re-selling them whole. Finding a BMW to steal appears as simple as trawling streets/ carparks with high density of BMW's i.e. affluent areas and taking your pick of one on the desired list. Why try harder? On occasion there's indication specific cars may have been targeted for some reason -perhaps they're on that weeks shopping list - but overwhelmingly they are being taken from streets, drives and open spaces rather than within garages/secure or hidden areas. So, take it or leave it..... I've seen the data first hand, I've spoken directly to people who've had their cars stolen, I've spoken to people with a strategic nationwide overview of the problems from a number of angles. No one is in any doubt it's a big issue but with corporate reputations at stake no one should be surprised that companies aren't shouting failings from the rooftop. They need to solve the problem before it blows up and this becomes even more common knowledge - although I'd suggest the stable door is wide open and the horse fast disappearing over the horizon now. Sorry, I nearly forgot the important bit, which is of course the Crime Prevention advice: 1) Park somewhere overlooked and garage the car if you can. 2) Disable the OBD port in some cunning way. 3) Use additional physical security such as a steering wheel lock. 4) Consider additional and aftermarket immobilisers/trackers. Something perhaps that cuts fuel and is independant of the keyed ignition. Sadly I think this kind of security may become an necessity from an insurance point of view as time wears on. |
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