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      07-01-2019, 01:39 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Because there's no deal to see.

Meeting time for Trump and Kim must have changed because our press were scrambling to get inside.

A bunch of Americans start rushing and the security was supposed to do what? It was nothing but people squeezing inbetween other people. Roughed up...lol.
She put up a pretty good body block on that guy though.
Please as if they weren’t up everybody’s assholes inside out before they got in that room from a security standpoint. A reporter with a camera is gonna do what?
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      07-01-2019, 01:59 PM   #68
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Conspiracy theory: Trump and Company to take over management of the hotel the North Koreans built in their capital city. (joking).
Trump to develop virgin beachfront property and build a gold course with nice hotel for Chinese to stay at. (not joking) The place is totally undeveloped and Trump sees a goldmine.
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      07-01-2019, 02:44 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irishbimmer View Post
Conspiracy theory: Trump and Company to take over management of the hotel the North Koreans built in their capital city. (joking).
Trump to develop virgin beachfront property and build a gold course with nice hotel for Chinese to stay at. (not joking) The place is totally undeveloped and Trump sees a goldmine.
You know it, I know it, everybody knows it.

How is your little buddy doing?
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Hell, I get random sausage attacks when I go anywhere.

Several actors have played James Bond, Sean Connery IS James Bond...
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      07-01-2019, 02:48 PM   #70
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He's in very rough shape, thanks for asking. Sat with him all weekend and we are just a mess about it. Not much to look forward to about the situation, unfortunately.It feels like we are enveloped in perpetual sadness.
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      07-01-2019, 04:48 PM   #71
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NK has short-range nukes. That is a very big deal in the region, esp for SK and Japan (allies) and possibly Guam (US Citizens). They would like to develop long-range delivery, with ability to reach continental US. We likely are not going to get them to go backwards on the nukes they have - that’s what gives Kim a position on the world stage. But we might keep them from finishing development and testing of long-range delivery. That would be a big win. And that, plus the fact that we were at war (or in a police action) against NK in my lifetime makes it historic, IMO.

I think the Prez did a great job of deflecting media prior to the visit, keeping it a surprise. Tweeting about soccer and other nonsense just prior got the usual media in a frenzy and they completely lost focus on what he is actually doing. Again, just my opinion.
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      07-01-2019, 05:54 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by DETRoadster View Post
Anyone else thinks he's angling for a Nobel Peace prize? I mean Obama got one so that's gotta be on his mind. Trump loves awards, accolades, and recognition. Not having that prize when Obama got one has to sting.
Ask the people of South Korea and Japan if it matters one iota what his motivation is.
Anyone on this thread from S Korea or Japan is welcome to chime in.
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      07-01-2019, 06:17 PM   #73
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NK has short-range nukes. That is a very big deal in the region, esp for SK and Japan (allies) and possibly Guam (US Citizens). They would like to develop long-range delivery, with ability to reach continental US. We likely are not going to get them to go backwards on the nukes they have - that’s what gives Kim a position on the world stage. But we might keep them from finishing development and testing of long-range delivery. That would be a big win. And that, plus the fact that we were at war (or in a police action) against NK in my lifetime makes it historic, IMO.

I think the Prez did a great job of deflecting media prior to the visit, keeping it a surprise. Tweeting about soccer and other nonsense just prior got the usual media in a frenzy and they completely lost focus on what he is actually doing. Again, just my opinion.
So the region is still threatened by an unstable dictator (some very good allies including US territory, citizens, military personnel/families and bases). Nothing changes for the people of NK and we just hold him off for awhile in getting a longer range missile to hit the mainland US in exchange for sanctions relief? How is this a win and how does this help anyone, but NK/Kim who is now trustworthy after said agreement? Pardon my extreme skepticism on this. And a lot of you are saying Obama gave Iran a gift.....

What does the bottom part have to do with anything at all? And the press was not really thrown off from what I could tell. Again, even if they were, what advantage does this give the President? He wants this to be covered day and night.
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      07-01-2019, 06:20 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
Haha I'm still waiting for the WW3 that everybody swore was going to happen the past 3.5 yrs.

Along with the massive recession.

Along with the nuclear war with North Korea.

I'm a minority, still waiting to by lynched by the conservative boogeyman.
I'm waiting for all the people who said they would leave the country if Trump were elected, to actually follow through on their word.
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      07-01-2019, 06:50 PM   #75
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So the region is still threatened by an unstable dictator (some very good allies including US territory, citizens, military personnel/families and bases). Nothing changes for the people of NK and we just hold him off for awhile in getting a longer range missile to hit the mainland US in exchange for sanctions relief? How is this a win and how does this help anyone, but NK/Kim who is now trustworthy after said agreement? Pardon my extreme skepticism on this. And a lot of you are saying Obama gave Iran a gift.....

What does the bottom part have to do with anything at all? And the press was not really thrown off from what I could tell. Again, even if they were, what advantage does this give the President? He wants this to be covered day and night.
If we can keep him from developing long range nukes without having to go to war over it (and I think we would do that), that is a win for all. He loses everything if he uses a nuke locally (because we are allies), so he won’t use them in most circumstances I can envision. Without using them, but while having that capability, he is a “world leader”, on the main stage, and we can continue to engage in dialog that may ultimately result in other improvements. So I see it as a positive step, a win in the moment, perhaps not in the long run (battle vs war to borrow the analogy). Definitely better than the likely near term alternatives.

The second part had nothing to do with the first other than being about the same event. That is why I made it a separate paragraph with a line space between. Just like here. Or is it forbidden to have more than one thought in a post?
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      07-01-2019, 07:05 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000cs View Post
If we can keep him from developing long range nukes without having to go to war over it (and I think we would do that), that is a win for all. He loses everything if he uses a nuke locally (because we are allies), so he won’t use them in most circumstances I can envision. Without using them, but while having that capability, he is a “world leader”, on the main stage, and we can continue to engage in dialog that may ultimately result in other improvements. So I see it as a positive step, a win in the moment, perhaps not in the long run (battle vs war to borrow the analogy). Definitely better than the likely near term alternatives.

The second part had nothing to do with the first other than being about the same event. That is why I made it a separate paragraph with a line space between. Just like here. Or is it forbidden to have more than one thought in a post?
So the same argument most righties are saying that made the Iran deal bad are now good in the NK situation? Kim hasn’t given up anything and has already gained a ton from talks with Trump. Kim has already been deceitful by saying he would destroy the nuclear testing centers and not test etc. He blows up a defunct testing facility that was already not being used and when talks went bad he resumed ballistic missile testing. This is all the past and present Kim regimes foreign policy. Bully and blackmail until they get what they want. It worked in getting Trump to the table and now you want Trump to basically give up sanctions relief (the only leverage) allowing them to possibly gain the money to fund programs they’ll never give up.

If Kim gets this deal it will only embolden him to hold our allies and all the other previously mentioned assets in the region hostage even more. And why not, if it keeps working. You are willing to do this just on the chance Kim abides by it and doesn’t develop a long range delivery system or just buy one when he gets the money. What does the US get in return? IMO mainland protection for a very brief while and then we have a much worse problem on our hands in the near future. Sorry, but your proposal/idea doesn’t sound very well thought out.

Of course there can be more than one thought per post. I simply asked what you meant by it or what advantage is gained for Trump or anyone for that matter. Trump wants news like this to get that makes it look like he is the great diplomat/deal maker. Unfortunately now after 3 big meetings I see nothing that Kim has given up as the result of these efforts. Quite the opposite as a matter of fact. It is pretty obvious Kim has become very useful to Xi and Putin now who are heavily coaching him in all of this for their own interests in the region.
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      07-01-2019, 07:10 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
So the same argument most righties are saying that made the Iran deal bad are now good in the NK situation? Kim hasn’t given up anything and has already gained a ton from talks with Trump. Kim has already been deceitful by saying he would destroy the nuclear testing centers and not test etc. He blows up a defunct testing facility that was already not being used and when talks went bad he resumed ballistic missile testing. This is all the past and present Kim regimes foreign policy. Bully and blackmail until they get what they want. It worked in getting Trump to the table and now you want Trump to basically give up sanctions relief ( the only leverage) allowing them to possibly gain the money to fund programs they’ll never give up.

If Kim gets this deal it will only embolden him to hold our allies and all the other previously mentioned assets in the region hostage even more. And why not, if it keeps working. You are willing to do this just on the chance Kim abides by it and doesn’t develop a long range delivery system or just buy one when he gets the money. What does the US get in return? IMO mainland protection for a very brief while and then we have a much worse problem on our hands in the near future. Sorry, but your proposal/idea doesn’t sound very well thought out.

Of course there can be more than one thought per post. I simply asked what you meant by it or what advantage get gained Trump or anyone for that matter. Trump wants news like this to get that makes it look like he is the great diplomat/deal maker. Unfortunately now after 3 big meetings I see nothing that Kim has given up as the result of these efforts. Quite the opposite as a matter of fact. It is pretty obvious he has become very useful to Xi and Putin now who are heavily coaching him in all of this for their own interests in the region.
Fair points; it is an imperfect world. I guess it is a matter of whether we get that very worse problem now or later, and later gives us just a bit of time to work something better out, and avoid the very worse problem. So to me that is a good thing. But it might turn out to be just deferred.
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      07-01-2019, 07:19 PM   #78
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Quote:
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Fair points; it is an imperfect world. I guess it is a matter of whether we get that very worse problem now or later, and later gives us just a bit of time to work something better out, and avoid the very worse problem. So to me that is a good thing. But it might turn out to be just deferred.
Same as my Iran posts. If it came to the unthinkable, I’d rather deal with it now than before they became much stronger. Iran with nukes and a delivery system or NK with much a higher yield nukes and a long range delivery system.

Sanctions must have worked because it did get Kim to act up big time and bring him to the table. But, the only way I ever see him giving up his nukes is if Xi and Putin give Kim what he wants and they get what they want. Most likely this would be economic and security assurances from Xi/Putin to denuclearize. The only way that would happen would be full sanctions relief and a complete pull out of US forces from SK, Japan and possibly Guam etc. I highly doubt that last part would ever happen with an emerging China and the next US President (Republican or Democrat) would just declare the deal void (like Trump did with Iran) and move the forces right back in.

It is a shitty situation with a lot of egos plus massive power in the region at stake. Speaking of skepticism, I’m not sure any deal of substance can be reached and I think we’ll continue to see the status quo for some time to come.
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      07-01-2019, 07:23 PM   #79
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I'm waiting for all the people who said they would leave the country if Trump were elected, to actually follow through on their word.
I bought U-Haul stock the morning after election day, and am disappointed that it didn't go through the roof with everyone moving out of the country.....
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      07-01-2019, 07:28 PM   #80
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Quote:
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Fair points; it is an imperfect world. I guess it is a matter of whether we get that very worse problem now or later, and later gives us just a bit of time to work something better out, and avoid the very worse problem. So to me that is a good thing. But it might turn out to be just deferred.
From what I've read, the above concepts was the very foundation of the Iran pact. It was thought to be too expensive in lives to bomb them to Hades and the hope was they would become a more responsible member and create stronger financial ties with our European allies that would be difficult for them to recede from.
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      07-01-2019, 07:29 PM   #81
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This always cracks me up. Where would they go? Canada too cold/expensive, Mexico too hot/cheap. I guess California would fit the bill.
I only wish CA was no longer part of the country.
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      07-01-2019, 07:39 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Run Silent View Post
You and I don't usually see eye-to-eye, but....
Can this be classed as a 'historic first' as well?
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      07-01-2019, 07:50 PM   #83
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You and I don't usually see eye-to-eye, but....
Can this be classed as a 'historic first' as well?
I like it
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      07-01-2019, 08:08 PM   #84
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Why do you even bother "engaging" CNN boy???
Better than being engaged to Faux news and "I will buy into any old conspiracy theory" Hannity and Carlson
Not so sure. We will have to agree to disagree.

Both are obviously extremely biased.

I can tell by his posts that he only gets his news from biased liberal sources. That was my point.

Why do you stick up for CNN on a regular basis? Do you actually think it's an unbiased news source? I'll be surprised if you say yes.
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      07-01-2019, 08:30 PM   #85
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Appreciate the link, but I think this is just Fox News trying to make a big deal out of something that isn't.

Man - I'm just not seeing anything there. She was bruised? What is she, a tomato? Good grief. Kim is probably the most hated man on the planet - his security guards are probably extremely nervous anytime he is in public.

I just don't see what the big deal was here.
It's more of a pattern for me and this isn't the first time the NK guards have gotten aggressive/handsy with US personal. I don't like it, especially when a woman is involved. Kudos to her for standing up for US values such as freedom of the press etc.

This isn't directed at you, but to the thread in general. What I like less is it appears Kim is winning the negotiations. Rumors are just that rumors, but it sounds like the US is leaning towards letting NK be a nuclear state if they don't build any more etc. If that happens, I'm not sure what any of this is even about as that would be disastrous. Kim gives up nothing, but yet keeps getting meetings with Trump and appears to be wearing him down.

Edit: It wasn't just Foxnews, it has been widely reported by just about everyone. I chose the Foxnews link for the overwhelmingly Repub/righty crew here.
Like the Turks? Don't they like to rough people up to?
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      07-01-2019, 08:32 PM   #86
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzschild Radius View Post
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Originally Posted by ///M4ster Yoda View Post
Why do you even bother "engaging" CNN boy???
Better than being engaged to Faux news and "I will buy into any old conspiracy theory" Hannity and Carlson
Not so sure. We will have to agree to disagree.

Both are obviously extremely biased.

I can tell by his posts that he only gets his news from biased liberal sources. That was my point.

Why do you stick up for CNN on a regular basis? Do you actually think it's an unbiased news source? I'll be surprised if you say yes.
He may read huff post or mother Jones. Those Are the truly liberal biased news sources.
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      07-01-2019, 08:44 PM   #87
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The libs on the usual suspect tube stations and the ones here for that matter are trying desperately to put a negative spin on this his historic event but the world and Americans in general see through their attempts to belittle the first ever crossing and try to sell to the public that the CIC trying his hardest to halt before it starts a potential nuclear war as a bad thing. It’s sad and laughable at the same time.
Voters will see through this and will recognize that the left would gamble with having a full blown mushroom cloud war then see DJT re-elected.
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      07-01-2019, 09:48 PM   #88
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The libs on the usual suspect tube stations and the ones here for that matter are trying desperately to put a negative spin on this his historic event but the world and Americans in general see through their attempts to belittle the first ever crossing and try to sell to the public that the CIC trying his hardest to halt before it starts a potential nuclear war as a bad thing. It’s sad and laughable at the same time.
Voters will see through this and will recognize that the left would gamble with having a full blown mushroom cloud war then see DJT re-elected.
You write weird stuff. Ya man, get after them with the wild weasels!
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