Limp Mode this morning

[warmtoes]

Well, the car has been picked up so I'll see what my two limp mode instances will be diagnosed as. At least they gave me a decent vehicle, 328xi coupe. No sport seats though.

[warmtoes]

Originally Posted by Critical Mass

I wonder if thats what happened to me (Gas tank valve etc)? I took a hard turn this morning and went into "limp mode" right after. My fuel tank was low. Engine service light came on and a yellow engine symbol appeared in the center screen. I am guilty of suspecting the hpfp and the car is at the dealership now. As a side note, and most likely mentioned elsewhere on the forum; I was informed that Borgwarner are going to supply the Rev5 HPFP's which are due out the end of the month??

I had CEL's when they replaced my fuel tank vent valve. I never had limp mode until recently.

[andrew777]

I just had my first limp mode today. It was right after starting the car. I didn't get a check engine light and I haven't had any long cranks ever. I basically just pulled over and restarted the car and everything was fine. Is this something I should worry about?

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by andrew777

I just had my first limp mode today. It was right after starting the car. I didn't get a check engine light and I haven't had any long cranks ever. I basically just pulled over and restarted the car and everything was fine. Is this something I should worry about?

You should take it in. If the car is going into limp mode, something isn't working as it should. Even if they can't find the problem right now, it's better to get a service ticket opened on it so there's at least some record that it happened and you asked them to fix it.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by adrean8j

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It irritates me when people say this right off the bat....just drive the car for a few more days and see if it comes back. The ecu on the car may need to adjust for a temporary lean condition and give you the limp mode...restart the car and you will be fine many times....I have had a couple of rough idles/starts in the two years of ownership....restarted the car and have not had other problems. I honestly think many people jump the gun on the whole HPFP thing.....BTW 23k miles and still on original pump...May '08 build date...

EDIT: I did not read the whole thread....if you keep having repeated issues then yes you may have the dreaded HPFP problem....but my above statement still stands for others who have the initial limp mode....

If you're getting limp modes, something is wrong with the car. Period.

What could possibly cause a lean condition unless something isn't working properly? If you're getting limp modes on startup it's very likely coming from low fuel pressure because the system is bleeding down, and that means it's not working right.

A simple adaptation for variences in fuel quality isn't going to set a Limp mode.

[adrean8j]

If that condition lasts for longer than the computer likes on startup I would think it would go into its protection mode (limp)....and yes give you limp mode....By the way notice you said limp mode(s) plural...i was referring to ONE limp mode specifically followed by the car starting fine and running fine.....I don't know how many times I have to say it....23,000 miles and 1 limp mode waaaaay back at 8,000 miles.....what caused it do you think? Was NOT the fuel pump because the car still starts fine within 1/2 to 1 second....the only other time I saw something like this was on my E39 with the fuel pressure (gas cap)....I am not a mechanical engineer or computer science major so I cannot say with any certainty that it was a lean condition...but my guess would say a lean condition caused by an ECU that is not setting the fuel trim(?) properly...and then like any computer needs to be reset...just guessing here of course...LOL...

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by adrean8j

If that condition lasts for longer than the computer likes on startup I would think it would go into its protection mode (limp)....and yes give you limp mode....By the way notice you said limp mode(s) plural...i was referring to ONE limp mode specifically followed by the car starting fine and running fine.....I don't know how many times I have to say it....23,000 miles and 1 limp mode waaaaay back at 8,000 miles.....what caused it do you think? Was NOT the fuel pump because the car still starts fine within 1/2 to 1 second....the only other time I saw something like this was on my E39 with the fuel pressure (gas cap)....I am not a mechanical engineer or computer science major so I cannot say with any certainty that it was a lean condition...but my guess would say a lean condition caused by an ECU that is not setting the fuel trim(?) properly...and then like any computer needs to be reset...just guessing here of course...LOL...

If it went into limp, something wasn't working right. It could have been a sticky check valve in the fuel return, or a fouled spark plug, but it's a sign that something isn't right.

If the fuel trims are off so much that the ECU thinks it need to completely kill the turbos in order to protect itself, something would have to be screwed up.

Keep in mind, there's a difference between a Service Engine Soon indication (which can be caused by lots of things) and Limp mode. Limp mode is there to prevent damage to the engine and it shouldn't be coming on randomly.

[adrean8j]

I agree.....I would definitely have checked the codes and let BMW take a look at it.....I would not, however, just assume it was the HPFP (my original point)

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by adrean8j

I would not, however, just assume it was the HPFP (my original point)

I agree with you on that, it's just that the HPFP is the most common cause of limp modes, followed by coils and injectors it seems.

[warmtoes]

Well, I was wondering if they would change the HPFP and they did on Saturday.

[warmtoes]

After driving it for a bit I have found that the power seems improved as is the smoothness of the acceleration but I can't tell if the smoothness is due to the software update, the HPFP or both.

I guess I was driving with reduced power all along as it really feels like it's pulling a lot more now.

[BlackjackMulligan]

Originally Posted by warmtoes

After driving it for a bit I have found that the power seems improved as is the smoothness of the acceleration but I can't tell if the smoothness is due to the software update, the HPFP or both.

I guess I was driving with reduced power all along as it really feels like it's pulling a lot more now.

I also swear that my car felt more powerful after having the HPFP replaced at 1700 miles. Possibly just me, possibly performance degradation. No, I don't have any dyno results

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by BlackjackMulligan

I also swear that my car felt more powerful after having the HPFP replaced at 1700 miles. Possibly just me, possibly performance degradation. No, I don't have any dyno results

I'm wondering if this is more from the software update than the actual pump replacement.

Early on a lot of owners were getting an update that increased the lag, but fixed wastegate issues. Maybe they've gotten that figured out and this new update is better than the one the cars were shipped with?

Just a theory. The pump really shouldn't make a difference in performance.

[warmtoes]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

I'm wondering if this is more from the software update than the actual pump replacement.

Early on a lot of owners were getting an update that increased the lag, but fixed wastegate issues. Maybe they've gotten that figured out and this new update is better than the one the cars were shipped with?

Just a theory. The pump really shouldn't make a difference in performance.

You could be right. I have no way of separating the difference between the new pump and the new software. The load was supposedly just released on Saturday when my HPFP was being replaced.

I have to say, if my dealership wasn't so customer service oriented all of the stuff I've had to bring it back for would have really pissed me off. But, they are so great that I can't complain.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by warmtoes

You could be right. I have no way of separating the difference between the new pump and the new software. The load was supposedly just released on Saturday when my HPFP was being replaced.

I have to say, if my dealership wasn't so customer service oriented all of the stuff I've had to bring it back for would have really pissed me off. But, they are so great that I can't complain.

Good service can make up for a lot IMO.

My problem is, my dealership is a PITA. I'm lucky though, as I haven't had a pump failure.....yet, only minor things.

[warmtoes]

Well, your lucky that everything has been minor. My dealer is upping their fleet of BMW loaners from 100 to 150 if you can believe it. And, they offer complimentary valet service where they pick up your car and leave you a BMW loaner. They will also drop it off when it's complete and take back the loaner. I usually just drive into the dealership as I have to fill the tank anyway.

[spellbmw]

My 2010 135i at 5558 miles went into limp mode yesterday afternoon, just sorta 'bang'. Normal driving and as I started to accelerate, something 'went' -- could just feel the power-loss and the "Engine Malfunction - Decreased Power" light/warning came on, saying it was OK to drive but to get to a dealer for service (iDrive read out). Used BMW Assist to give dealer a heads-up (Kuni in Beaverton, OR) and dropped it off. My SA said they'd have it a day or possible two, depending on what they find in the codes and testing. Gave me a 328xi loaner with AT. Will keep you posted on what they report. No long cranks prior to this.

Update: 3/17/2010 - 3:00 PDT
SA called to say that they tried the software upgrade, but to no avail; so they put in the latest version of the HPFP. Gotta take bike (K1200RS) to shop for its 42,000 mile service, then go get the car. Fingers-crossed that the new pump is the solution!

[sburkeatqmi]

My 2008 135i has had the limp mode light come on twice the last two days. Both times it went away after restart. Both time that it came on I was driving semi aggressively. I don't have any SES lights on & the generic OBDII reader shows nothing. If I drive the speed limit & take it easy no light. It starts right up so I don't think it's the fuel pump. It has 106k miles on her. I checked all of the hoses/vacuum lines etc. I guess I'll have to bite the bullet & take it to a dealer to get scanned. My guess would be a misfire.

[dtla1]

Originally Posted by sburkeatqmi

My 2008 135i has had the limp mode light come on twice the last two days. Both times it went away after restart. Both time that it came on I was driving semi aggressively. I don't have any SES lights on & the generic OBDII reader shows nothing. If I drive the speed limit & take it easy no light. It starts right up so I don't think it's the fuel pump. It has 106k miles on her. I checked all of the hoses/vacuum lines etc. I guess I'll have to bite the bullet & take it to a dealer to get scanned. My guess would be a misfire.

My guess would be the HPFP. The car could still start fine, maybe a bit slower on the first start of the day while it tries to build pressure, but sometimes hard to tell.

[justinzhng]

I think it may be the hpfp I had a similar issue and it was accompanied by a SES light but once I replaced the hpfp it went away altogether and the car is running better than ever. When was the last time it was replaced or is this the original?

[sburkeatqmi]

Originally Posted by justinzhng

I think it may be the hpfp I had a similar issue and it was accompanied by a SES light but once I replaced the hpfp it went away altogether and the car is running better than ever. When was the last time it was replaced or is this the original?

No clue if it's original or not. The car has 106k on it. If I drive normal & don't get on it it doesn't come on. Only when I drive more aggressively. I was thinking something with the turbos but I need to get it scanned.

[dtla1]

Originally Posted by sburkeatqmi

No clue if it's original or not. The car has 106k on it. If I drive normal & don't get on it it doesn't come on. Only when I drive more aggressively. I was thinking something with the turbos but I need to get it scanned.

That's exactly the symptoms typical to a bad HPFP. Can't supply the pressure the car wants when you get on it.