BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read




 

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-18-2018, 11:46 AM   #1
SLC801
Private First Class
25
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: AW 1M
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Salt Lake City

iTrader: (0)

Production numbers by options

Iím wondering if there is a place that shows production numbers by options. To be completely transparent, my reason for wondering is Iím trying to get a handle on how many 1Mís were delivered as ďstrippersĒ, as I have one.

When I look at the various places these are brought to market I donít believe Iíve ever seen another fully base model (no nav, no heated seats, no power seats....am I missing any?). I have seen a couple of no nav, no power seats but with heated seat option cars.

It seems with other limited quantity cars, they have a pretty good handle on production numbers by options (my brother owns a 1/35, I believe, G8 GXP manual with a particular interior color combo, for example) but donít believe Iíve seen anything in regards to this with the 1M.

Iím also curious how folks here seem to determine their production number (____/740) for the NA market? Iíve seen the spread sheet but not sure how to correlate that to the 740 number.

Thanks in advance for any help in replies.
Appreciate 0
      02-18-2018, 12:33 PM   #2
ayao
Thread killer
353
Rep
1,620
Posts

Drives: 1M
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: CA

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLC801 View Post
Iím wondering if there is a place that shows production numbers by options. To be completely transparent, my reason for wondering is Iím trying to get a handle on how many 1Mís were delivered as ďstrippersĒ, as I have one.

When I look at the various places these are brought to market I donít believe Iíve ever seen another fully base model (no nav, no heated seats, no power seats....am I missing any?). I have seen a couple of no nav, no power seats but with heated seat option cars.

It seems with other limited quantity cars, they have a pretty good handle on production numbers by options (my brother owns a 1/35, I believe, G8 GXP manual with a particular interior color combo, for example) but donít believe Iíve seen anything in regards to this with the 1M.

Iím also curious how folks here seem to determine their production number (____/740) for the NA market? Iíve seen the spread sheet but not sure how to correlate that to the 740 number.

Thanks in advance for any help in replies.
I think you pretty much need to sort the spreadsheet first by "USA" and then by production date.
Appreciate 0
      02-18-2018, 12:59 PM   #3
nachob
Brigadier General
United_States
1193
Rep
3,585
Posts

Drives: 2011 1M, 2003 330i ZHP
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: California

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLC801 View Post
Iím wondering if there is a place that shows production numbers by options. To be completely transparent, my reason for wondering is Iím trying to get a handle on how many 1Mís were delivered as ďstrippersĒ, as I have one.

When I look at the various places these are brought to market I donít believe Iíve ever seen another fully base model (no nav, no heated seats, no power seats....am I missing any?). I have seen a couple of no nav, no power seats but with heated seat option cars.

It seems with other limited quantity cars, they have a pretty good handle on production numbers by options (my brother owns a 1/35, I believe, G8 GXP manual with a particular interior color combo, for example) but donít believe Iíve seen anything in regards to this with the 1M.

Iím also curious how folks here seem to determine their production number (____/740) for the NA market? Iíve seen the spread sheet but not sure how to correlate that to the 740 number.

Thanks in advance for any help in replies.
Canadian 1Ms came standard with heated seats and several US buyers opted for heated seats because they really don't add much weight. In the US i estimate about 150 true strippers. Most were ordered with Nav or Premium package with power seats. My first one was a true stripper, not even heated seats. We had a meet of 20 1Ms in SoCal in 2012 I believe and of the 20, most had parking sensor bumpers or powered seat. I only recall 2 true strippers from that meet. That's two out of 20 or 10% however, even if I missed a couple that would be 4 out of 20 or 20%. So let's say 4 were true strippers. 20% of 739 thats about 147 strippers possibly out there.

I still consider it a stripper if it only had one little option like heated seats or Sirius which don't really add any weight but I know what you mean about a true stripper, those are probably less than 100.
Appreciate 0
      02-18-2018, 01:07 PM   #4
SLC801
Private First Class
25
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: AW 1M
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Salt Lake City

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ayao View Post
I think you pretty much need to sort the spreadsheet first by "USA" and then by production date.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nachob View Post
Canadian 1Ms came standard with heated seats and several US buyers opted for heated seats because they really don't add much weight. In the US i estimate about 150 true strippers. Most were ordered with Nav or Premium package with power seats. My first one was a true stripper, not even heated seats. We had a meet of 20 1Ms in SoCal in 2012 I believe and of the 20, most had parking sensor bumpers or powered seat. I only recall 2 true strippers from that meet. That's two out of 20 or 10% however, even if I missed a couple that would be 4 out of 20 or 20%. So let's say 4 were true strippers. 20% of 739 thats about 147 strippers possibly out there.

I still consider it a stripper if it only had one little option like heated seats or Sirius which don't really add any weight but I know what you mean about a true stripper, those are probably less than 100.

Thanks guys. So it sounds like that info isnít out there widely. Wonder how other brands/models get that detailed of info....
Appreciate 0
      02-18-2018, 09:24 PM   #5
nachob
Brigadier General
United_States
1193
Rep
3,585
Posts

Drives: 2011 1M, 2003 330i ZHP
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: California

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLC801 View Post
Thanks guys. So it sounds like that info isnít out there widely. Wonder how other brands/models get that detailed of info....
No, not really out there. The registry only has partial VIN numbers but as I mentioned if you look at for sale postings and my personal experience no more than 20% are strippers. That makes about 150 at the most. I think it's closer to 100.

Congrats on a rare and special combination though!
Appreciate 1
SLC80125.00

      02-18-2018, 11:41 PM   #6
champignon
Disrupter
champignon's Avatar
United_States
1264
Rep
2,303
Posts

Drives: 1M;Z3M Cp;135is Vert, 18 MG M2
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Idaho

iTrader: (0)

The data isn't available, in part, because the marketplace hasn't defined "strippers" and their variants to be different or more valuable than any other version of a 1M.

There are a few individuals who believe that these strippers are more highly desirable than any other 1M, but I do not believe that this is the general consensus. These individuals, not coincidentally, generally happen to own a stripper.

I would be shocked to see any kind of analysis of resales that showed that strippers sell for higher prices than other 1Ms; this would be the only way that one could establish the elevated value of a stripper vs. other 1Ms. Most people shopping for a 1M are going to concentrate on the obvious qualities that differentiate a good resale 1M from a mediocre one, such things as overall condition, mileage, prior maintenance history, whether or not the car has been in an accident.

Once you get down to such things as power vs. manual seats, you will find that you are truly off in the weeds.
__________________
Disappointing People for Two Centuries; MT Rules
Appreciate 0
      02-19-2018, 12:07 AM   #7
SLC801
Private First Class
25
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: AW 1M
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Salt Lake City

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by champignon View Post
The data isn't available, in part, because the marketplace hasn't defined "strippers" and their variants to be different or more valuable than any other version of a 1M.

There are a few individuals who believe that these strippers are more highly desirable than any other 1M, but I do not believe that this is the general consensus. These individuals, not coincidentally, generally happen to own a stripper.

I would be shocked to see any kind of analysis of resales that showed that strippers sell for higher prices than other 1Ms; this would be the only way that one could establish the elevated value of a stripper vs. other 1Ms. Most people shopping for a 1M are going to concentrate on the obvious qualities that differentiate a good resale 1M from a mediocre one, such things as overall condition, mileage, prior maintenance history, whether or not the car has been in an accident.

Once you get down to such things as power vs. manual seats, you will find that you are truly off in the weeds.

I wouldnít say the reason the data isnít available has anything to do with what you mention. It simply isnít available, to my understanding.

My point isnít to understand my value vs yours, itís just something fun to know as a car guy. Again, reading through BaT auctions and youíll see ď1/37 with this color combination and transmissionĒ etc (last I saw that got this going was on a Viper GTS auction on BaT). That stuff is fun and Iím mostly surprised itís not out there with so few and only one model year while other cars have this insight with much higher production numbers.

To the thought specific to 1Mís, we are very early in this cars collectibility evolution, so what weíve seen to date will change over the next few years. But again, that wasnít my intent with this.
Appreciate 1
JP-1M98.00

      02-19-2018, 12:30 AM   #8
champignon
Disrupter
champignon's Avatar
United_States
1264
Rep
2,303
Posts

Drives: 1M;Z3M Cp;135is Vert, 18 MG M2
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Idaho

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SLC801 View Post
I wouldnít say the reason the data isnít available has anything to do with what you mention. It simply isnít available, to my understanding.

My point isnít to understand my value vs yours, itís just something fun to know as a car guy. Again, reading through BaT auctions and youíll see ď1/37 with this color combination and transmissionĒ etc (last I saw that got this going was on a Viper GTS auction on BaT). That stuff is fun and Iím mostly surprised itís not out there with so few and only one model year while other cars have this insight with much higher production numbers.

To the thought specific to 1Mís, we are very early in this cars collectibility evolution, so what weíve seen to date will change over the next few years. But again, that wasnít my intent with this.
The data exists, no doubt, it is just a matter of accessing it. I wonder if someone went to the trouble to go to one of the VIN# build sites such as BMW Archive, then pull up all of the VIN #s known to exist, if a data set for at least the known VIN #s could be produced?

The fact that no one has done this yet, to my knowledge, points to the fact that this is more or less minutiae of the highest order. No one would have any trouble figuring out how many hyper expensive Porsche Turbos were out there and in what configurations they were made, if need be.
__________________
Disappointing People for Two Centuries; MT Rules
Appreciate 0
      02-19-2018, 10:51 AM   #9
hunterl41
First Lieutenant
hunterl41's Avatar
United_States
70
Rep
340
Posts

Drives: 2011 1M
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Detroit

iTrader: (9)

Garage List
2011 BMW 1M  [0.00]
I agree that I don't think specific production configuration numbers really impact collectability or value in the short term. As others have noted ,there are a lot of factors that make a larger impact.

Having said that, there's really no telling what the deciding factor for high level car collectors would be in 20+ years. Maybe none of the person's collection has nav, so they are only looking to buy strippers. Maybe having the nav is a total novelty like finding a 70s era car with an 8-track tape player, and that's what the collector loves is the time capsule aspect of those technologies. Same could be said for AC, power windows, etc. It really just comes down to the collector, not the car.

Value variance based on options seems pretty arbitrary from a long-term collectibility standpoint.
Appreciate 1
JP-1M98.00

      02-19-2018, 11:34 AM   #10
champignon
Disrupter
champignon's Avatar
United_States
1264
Rep
2,303
Posts

Drives: 1M;Z3M Cp;135is Vert, 18 MG M2
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Idaho

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by hunterl41 View Post
I agree that I don't think specific production configuration numbers really impact collectability or value in the short term. As others have noted ,there are a lot of factors that make a larger impact.

Having said that, there's really no telling what the deciding factor for high level car collectors would be in 20+ years. Maybe none of the person's collection has nav, so they are only looking to buy strippers. Maybe having the nav is a total novelty like finding a 70s era car with an 8-track tape player, and that's what the collector loves is the time capsule aspect of those technologies. Same could be said for AC, power windows, etc. It really just comes down to the collector, not the car.

Value variance based on options seems pretty arbitrary from a long-term collectibility standpoint.
If in 20 years my financial well-being is to any extent tied up in the value of my 1M (assuming that I still own it then), than I would feel that my life, at least financially speaking, would have been an abject failure!
__________________
Disappointing People for Two Centuries; MT Rules
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2018, 12:44 AM   #11
stormchaser7
Private
stormchaser7's Avatar
145
Rep
82
Posts

Drives: BMW 1M
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Seattle

iTrader: (0)

My car came with power seats but were not heated. I also didn't have the compass mirror or comfort access or parking assist but did have Navigation. I was able to install my compass/homelink mirror from my 135i and it was plug and play. I also ordered heating elements for my seats and will have them installed soon. Wish I had comfort access but it's too much trouble to retrofit from what I've read.
__________________
Follow your dream car!
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2018, 12:49 AM   #12
SLC801
Private First Class
25
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: AW 1M
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Salt Lake City

iTrader: (0)

I actually miss comfort access from my 135is....
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2018, 04:54 AM   #13
analogue
Second Lieutenant
United_States
57
Rep
221
Posts

Drives: 1M, X4 M40i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: WI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by champignon View Post
The fact that no one has done this yet, to my knowledge, points to the fact that this is more or less minutiae of the highest order.
I'll bite. Some interesting tidbits for the 740 US spec cars:

Package selection (with or without other standalone options):
512 ZPP+ZCV
83 ZPP
145 no packages

272 were built with every option available.

16 were true strippers, not a single option added.

83 were ED cars assuming the addition of S428 (Warning triangle and first aid kit) is an accurate indication.

Remember when there was a brief window when people got Nav without paying for it or ordering ZCV? I believe there were 30 cars built that way. There are also 28 that have a drink holder without Nav.

2 of the 740 cars actually appear to be built to Canadian specs.

I'll get the full data up in a google docs spreadsheet soon.
Appreciate 2
SLC80125.00
///BYU92.50

      02-20-2018, 05:28 PM   #14
SLC801
Private First Class
25
Rep
127
Posts

Drives: AW 1M
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Salt Lake City

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by analogue View Post
I'll bite. Some interesting tidbits for the 740 US spec cars:

Package selection (with or without other standalone options):
512 ZPP+ZCV
83 ZPP
145 no packages

272 were built with every option available.

16 were true strippers, not a single option added.

83 were ED cars assuming the addition of S428 (Warning triangle and first aid kit) is an accurate indication.

Remember when there was a brief window when people got Nav without paying for it or ordering ZCV? I believe there were 30 cars built that way. There are also 28 that have a drink holder without Nav.

2 of the 740 cars actually appear to be built to Canadian specs.

I'll get the full data up in a google docs spreadsheet soon.

WHOA! This is what I was talking about. So cool, thanks for posting.

Can I ask where you got the info?
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:14 PM.




1addicts
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST