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      08-30-2010, 09:10 AM   #529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Future M1 owner View Post
http://www.bimmerfile.com/2010/08/30...-modified-n54/

-Power more in the 35is range (335-ish), no longer a dedicated M-engine;
Audi TTRS - 335bhp
Porsche Cayman S - 320 bhp
Lotus Evora - 276bhp

BMW 1M - 335bhp (unconfirmed)

That looks like a pretty tight group to play in.
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      08-30-2010, 09:11 AM   #530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer-Bob View Post
Simply having limited resources and strict parameters to work within doesn't imply diminished quality, to me. It simply means that the project presented some unique developmental and engineering challenges. We'll see if they were sucessful or not; I won't cast judgement until the full reveal.

My main gripe is the price tag - do I really want to pay $50K for a 1 Series? Tough call.
To the first part, I totally agree, being strict in R & D is not a disaster, after all it will keep the price down.

To the second statement, the same could be said for the M3, why pay 60 for just a 3 series. But if this is your mindset, you don't quite get that "feel" of the //M car Dr. Kay speaks of.
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      08-30-2010, 09:14 AM   #531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by niuniu View Post
Audi TTRS - 335bhp
Porsche Cayman S - 320 bhp
Lotus Evora - 276bhp

BMW 1M - 335bhp (unconfirmed)

That looks like a pretty tight group to play in.
No one is buying a Lotus instead of a 1M.
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      08-30-2010, 09:21 AM   #532
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pyrat View Post
No one is buying a Lotus instead of a 1M.
Sure someone might - I might if the 1M ends up under-performing, not that I think it will. Evora is a cracking 2+2, more functional that a Cayman too:

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      08-30-2010, 09:35 AM   #533
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I see cars in the earlist stage but I have other projects to work on that I cannot afford to be distracted as I have many projects not only for cars but I also conceive stuff for BMWTV.de The German only BMW TV channel which in some cases do not involve cars. With each project now we have started to do Pre-visualisation on the computer because we can show it to the director and production crew and explain this is the angles we want to get the perfect shot.


The time window for this car is extremely tight and originally enthusiasm was not apparent until Dr. Kay Segler came to the M Division.
We had initially toyed with the idea of an 1M when we were conceiving the Coupe and did work with evaluation models then using the engine from the
E46 and the upgraded E46 CSL engine but it proved to be too heavy for the car.

Originally in the early days of marketing the standard 135i was originally meant to be an M model.

The 1M that stands before you now has had possibly the most progressive stage from thought-production turnaround for a BMW. There had to be a lot of arm-twisting in the BMW Board because of the tight window between generation 1 and generation 2 of the Coupe. The proposal was greenlighted when BMW decided to use the Coupe model for the BMW eDrive evaluation.
Therefore slightly extending it's life cycle.

When I first saw the car it was in a design studio as a full scale claymodel but since then some designers ideas have to make way for aerodynamics and engineering. The initial engine proposal was the N55 but they were having issues that cannot be solved within the time window. BMW Greenlit this car in July 09, now over a year later we see it as it intended , although testing still commences until the launch. Valvetronic was the main cause of the time delay but BMW have spent some time on this and are using the N55 as a basis for the next M3.

The best way to describe the engine of the 1M is a "Hybrid" but in the original form of Hybrid, nothing to do with "alternatives", but it is not a straightforward transplant.

There is a lot of this car that will carry over for the next generation 1M in which that car will switch to four cylinders to which the M Division engineers are already working on the basics without time constraints or restrictions.
1M (E82) is showing what is possible in a small timeframe 1M (F22) will show what is possible once you do not have restrictions.
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      08-30-2010, 09:48 AM   #534
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Thanks SCOTT.

This appears to confirm that the N54 will be the basis of the 1M.

Interesting....and slightly disappointing....I am also guessing they will be making it a lot more difficult to tune than the initial N54 engines...

The iS N54 pushes, what, 330 BHP? With an overboost function as well?

I would say that BMW would need to put at least another 30 BHP on the 1M to make it worth it....which is right at the 360 mark that SCOTT mentioned so long ago....
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      08-30-2010, 09:49 AM   #535
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
...the next generation 1M in which that car will switch to four cylinders....
Oh my.
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      08-30-2010, 09:50 AM   #536
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Itanius View Post
Oh my.
He had mentioned that a while back as well.

F20 1M--4 cylinder with turbos
F30 M3--I6 with turbos
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      08-30-2010, 09:54 AM   #537
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3roar View Post


Is it just me or is that some nice Carbon Fiber rear Valance!!
I'll see about posting a better quality blowup of that section tonight from to original photo, but it looks like c/f to me too.
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      08-30-2010, 09:55 AM   #538
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmboone25 View Post
He had mentioned that a while back as well.

F20 1M--4 cylinder with turbos
F30 M3--I6 with turbos
True enough, but that doesn't make my reaction any less relevant.
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      08-30-2010, 09:59 AM   #539
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmboone25 View Post
He had mentioned that a while back as well.

F20 1M--4 cylinder with turbos
F30 M3--I6 with turbos
I am assuming the reasoning behind it is if the M3 drops and engine size so does the 1M? Not looking forward to a turbo'd 4 cylinder by any means.
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      08-30-2010, 10:00 AM   #540
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Itanius View Post
True enough, but that doesn't make my reaction any less relevant.
Fair enough.

I think a 4 cylinder with a 9000 RPM redline could be lot of fun.
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      08-30-2010, 10:09 AM   #541
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Guy View Post
I am assuming the reasoning behind it is if the M3 drops and engine size so does the 1M? Not looking forward to a turbo'd 4 cylinder by any means.
I think you hit the nail on the head--the 1M and M3 couldn't be that "close" so to speak, so if the M3 is moving from the V8 down to the I6 with turbos, then the 1M will need the same treatment.

Makes me wonder if there will be any I6 engines in the next generation 1er....
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      08-30-2010, 10:18 AM   #542
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Four Cylinders mean the car will be lighter, more powerful and have greater efficiency.
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      08-30-2010, 10:21 AM   #543
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pyrat View Post
To the first part, I totally agree, being strict in R & D is not a disaster, after all it will keep the price down.

To the second statement, the same could be said for the M3, why pay 60 for just a 3 series. But if this is your mindset, you don't quite get that "feel" of the //M car Dr. Kay speaks of.
Oh, I "get" it - but at the same time I see the other side that sees this as a $50,000 version of BMW's entry-level car.

Don't get me wrong, it looks like it could be a phenomenal car, but I have that one nagging doubt (truth be told, I think the M3 has gotten rather absurdly expensive as well, but it's also gotten more and more sophisticated with each generation).
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      08-30-2010, 10:23 AM   #544
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
Four Cylinders mean the car will be lighter, more powerful and have greater efficiency.
Which is always a good thing.

Thanks SCOTT.
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      08-30-2010, 10:32 AM   #545
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3_CSL_E92 View Post
I was just curious why you decided to copy the list from bimmerfile but leave out the N54 bit.
This wasn't mentioned yet when I added the list on Saturday, or so I think.


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      08-30-2010, 10:38 AM   #546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The time window for this car is extremely tight and originally enthusiasm was not apparent until Dr. Kay Segler came to the M Division.
Mr. Richter will love that statement.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The initial engine proposal was the N55 but they were having issues that cannot be solved within the time window. BMW Greenlit this car in July 09, now over a year later we see it as it intended , although testing still commences until the launch. Valvetronic was the main cause of the time delay but BMW have spent some time on this and are using the N55 as a basis for the next M3.

The best way to describe the engine of the 1M is a "Hybrid" but in the original form of Hybrid, nothing to do with "alternatives", but it is not a straightforward transplant.

There is a lot of this car that will carry over for the next generation 1M in which that car will switch to four cylinders to which the M Division engineers are already working on the basics without time constraints or restrictions.
1M (E82) is showing what is possible in a small timeframe 1M (F22) will show what is possible once you do not have restrictions.
Thanks Scott! IMO, there are two logical ways to make such a hybrid based on the N54. Either add the twin-scroll turbo or Valvetronic. Since Valvetronic was the cause for ruling out the N55 alltogether, I guess they use the N54 but add the twin-scroll turbo of the N55 (maybe a tad larger). Do I make sense?


Best regards,
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      08-30-2010, 10:56 AM   #547
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if the 1M is 350 hp am keeping my 135i a tune and full exhaust and my 135i will be more then 350 whp !
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      08-30-2010, 10:57 AM   #548
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Or two larger turbos with better exhaust manifolds? (although "log" manifolds often spool quicker than tubular, with reduced top-end performance)

Also, more aggressive camshafts would be a MAJOR plus!



I'm excited.
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      08-30-2010, 10:58 AM   #549
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oman135 View Post
if the 1M is 350 hp am keeping my 135i a tune and full exhaust and my 135i will be more then 350 whp !
Still blows my mind that people judge and base a whole car on its peak HP number.
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      08-30-2010, 11:00 AM   #550
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oman135 View Post
if the 1M is 350 hp am keeping my 135i a tune and full exhaust and my 135i will be more then 350 whp !
But then you wouldnt have the best one. You will always say. Its the 135i. The one below the 1M
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