Blown turbos, UPGrade to RB or Vargas stage 2

[spain4065]

The quick story is my turbos are blown, dumping oil in the intercooler. Looking at upgrading to either RB's or Vargas Stage 2. Currently FBO, looking for more power with some new snails. Seeing how they are both priced similarly, I'm not sure which route to go. Also, just informed that Dinan released their new kit, but thinking that just like the other things they sell they will not have the umph that the other kits offer.
All opinions welcomed!

Matt

[135Pats]

Save up and do a single conversion.

[Dmacc]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

Save up and do a single conversion.

+1, don't cheap out.

But if you really want to cheap out, RB > Vargas. Remember that.

[Lmaiuri]

Buy a 997.1 TT with mods.

[darkrom]

RB is what I want some day when the car is paid off.

[vma1788]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

Save up and do a single conversion.

Anyone have a dyno graph comparison?

I imagine a big single with yield higher power with a narrower powerband.

[135Pats]

Originally Posted by vma1788

Anyone have a dyno graph comparison?

I imagine a big single with yield higher power with a narrower powerband.

There are numerous dyno plots of various singles...58mm PTs, 62mm PTs, 64mm PTs, a few HTA and Garrett GTX setups running around out there.

Obviously, the curve shifts right quite a good deal. But the area under the curve once spool gets going is a totally different ballgame than the stock twins, or anything stock frame setups can dream of. With reduced backpressures and cylinder pressures.

[Lmaiuri]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

There are numerous dyno plots of various singles...58mm PTs, 62mm PTs, 64mm PTs, a few HTA and Garrett GTX setups running around out there.

Obviously, the curve shifts right quite a good deal. But the area under the curve once spool gets going is a totally different ballgame than the stock twins, or anything stock frame setups can dream of. With reduced backpressures and cylinder pressures.

Inb4 that 4500rpm boost spike. It would make a sick highway roll monster; but as far as practicality/reliability, you can throw all of that out of the window with a single turbo setup.

[vma1788]

That is exactly what i mean. Having owned many large single turbo cars, it is a very tough line to figure out what is more fun for you as an individual. Big turbo big power was fun but it was more fun on the street to have a smaller turbo with less max HP but larger powerband. Knowing your turbine housings come into play a lot too. If going with a single, do your research on exactly what you want from your car.

[135Pats]

Fair points. IMO anything that retains the stock frames is a serious compromise if you want big power.

[spain4065]

Yes, this is my daily, so single is gonna be out the window. Ok, so RB's over Vargas got it. Anyone have any input on Dinan NEW turbo upgrade kit, priced around the same ballpark as the RB's. Leaning towards RB's bc I hear good things and not many complaints with them.

[ilikebmxbikes]

I would do RB or try Dinan. Single Turbo is fun in all but despite making tons of HP, I honestly do not think it makes the car better. I would bet money that a upgraded twin would put down better track times than a single. Single would be better on a rolling airstrip event but that is about it.

[spain4065]

Ok, great. Thanks for the input. Thinking that RB's are the best bang for the buck. The Dinan just looks like it barely an upgrade compared to the stats of RB.

[darkrom]

RBs are proven. Dinan is proven to be good at taking money and giving you mild upgrades for serious coin.

[Lmaiuri]

Do you have meth/upgraded LPFP?

[shmorgan77]

Originally Posted by 135Pats

Save up and do a single conversion.

I have rb's and agree with this 100%

[Lmaiuri]

Originally Posted by shmorgan77

I have rb's and agree with this 100%

Care to expand on your opinion?

[Reapur]

Any upgraded hybrid turbo is unreliable. Id replace with OEM and go meth for big power.

The durability of the OEM turbos are unmatched. PTF is coming out with a crazy big single setup thats spooled by 2900 rpm with better than OEM build quality. No compromise has been made. Its not cheap but will be well worth it.

[135Pats]

Originally Posted by Lmaiuri

Care to expand on your opinion?

I won't speak for him but there's a lot to consider

You are taking a native turbo and machining it to accept a larger profile wheel. Despite the very good work of Tony and Rob, the inherent setup is going to be unreliable over the long term. Bottom line is a turbo and manifold frame that is meant to natively push 8-12 pounds midrange is now pushing upwards of 23 pounds midrage. The cylinder pressures, manifold pressures, and EGTs all rise in accordance. In many regards you are putting far more stress on your motor with an aggressive hybrid setup than you are with a more conservatively tuned single.

IMO if over 500WHP is your goal, figure out a way to make a single work. If you went with a bottom mount 58mm you'd have plenty of spool before 4K, and a really nice curve with pretty huge power and torque across the band.

That's my plan at least, but I need to smoke the stockers first

[Freon]

Turbo upgrade options are very limited and expensive. At some point it may make more sense to move to a different car if you really want a ridiculously fast car. It's already very hard to get enough tire on the car for bolt on power.

[135Pats]

Originally Posted by Freon

Turbo upgrade options are very limited and expensive. At some point it may make more sense to move to a different car if you really want a ridiculously fast car. It's already very hard to get enough tire on the car for bolt on power.

Good point. There's no reason to have this chassis pushing more than 5-600 to the wheels. Good luck getting enough tire back there. 265 doesn't even attempt to hook the 430-450 wheel i'm making now.

[vma1788]

Originally Posted by Reapur

Any upgraded hybrid turbo is unreliable. Id replace with OEM and go meth for big power.

The durability of the OEM turbos are unmatched. PTF is coming out with a crazy big single setup thats spooled by 2900 rpm with better than OEM build quality. No compromise has been made. Its not cheap but will be well worth it.

Yeah 2900rpm in 4th gear. So around town in lower gears think more 3800 range. Another note to consider is that to yield low end torque, you're going to be using a smaller turbine housing which will lead to HP taper high in the rev range and further- higher EGTs which makes more susceptible to knock and manifold failure.