Venoxy 1M Style Gauge Faces + White LED Swap

[cjb762]

Originally Posted by Suprgnat

Weird. I find my Venoxy gauge faces to be quite legible in daylight, though they're not 1M style.

Yeah - yours do look good. And the 1M version in the third pic of 6ixSpd's post above don't look that bad either (I think that's the one with the lights off). But mine just look like grey numbers on a slightly darker grey background. I'll take a pic tomorrow.

When I got them, they had a kind of fuzzy paper backing on them. I asked Venoxy if I was supposed to remove the paper or leave it on since the stock gauge faces weren't glued on. They said take the paper off, so I did. No adhesive underneath. I wonder if that had an impact...

[6ixSpd]

Originally Posted by cjb762

They said take the paper off, so I did. No adhesive underneath. I wonder if that had an impact...

None of this sounds right. They are adhesive backed. It's pretty foolproof.... Sounds like you ended up removing the material off the backing that you were not supposed to.

[cjb762]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

None of this sounds right. They are adhesive backed. It's pretty foolproof.... Sounds like you ended up removing the material off the backing that you were not supposed to.

I know - it was different than everything I had read. There was no adhesive on the stock gauge faces, they were just free floating on the clear plastic pieces, and there was no sign of adhesive on the clear plastic pieces.

Also, there was no adhesive on the Venoxy faces. There was a paper type backing that peeled off (with a lot of effort), but once off, the back of the Venoxy faces were not sticky at all.

Finally got around to taking a pic of the gauges... They look slightly better or worse than this while driving depending on the position and brightness of the sun...

[6ixSpd]

Ah, that's why. You have a 1 series. E8x clusters don't have the gauges glued on. However, the Venoxy ones definitely have an adhesive backing. The white cover should've come off without much effort, that's the cover for the adhesive. From what you're saying, you ended up removing the backing+adhesive together as one. The adhesive also acts as a blotting ink to illuminate all the details only. There's your problem. The whole face is being lit, and thus the numbers/details are not getting focussed light.

[cjb762]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

Ah, that's why. You have a 1 series. E8x clusters don't have the gauges glued on. However, the Venoxy ones definitely have an adhesive backing. The white cover should've come off without much effort, that's the cover for the adhesive. From what you're saying, you ended up removing the backing+adhesive together as one. The adhesive also acts as a blotting ink to illuminate all the details only. There's your problem. The whole face is being lit, and thus the numbers/details are not getting focussed light.

Ah - didn't realize the 1 series was different.

I spent a lot of time looking at the Venoxy faces and backing, and I sincerely don't believe there was any adhesive on them - at least not the tacky type. There was nothing that felt like the vinyl wrap type of adhesive either. The part that peeled off the back was very thin, and there was no adhesive attached to the back of it. At any rate, it didn't matter from mounting them, as the 1 series doesn't use adhesive.

Also, there is no problem when the lights are on - the numbers and dials seem to be getting plenty of light (they look great). It's only when the lights are off that things look bad (as in the picture above).

Here's a pic with the back lights on. They look fine during the night too.

[6ixSpd]

Ah. Well, to be honest I'm not sure what your gripe is then lol. You have white numbering and markings against a grey backdrop, that's obviously not going to give you as much contrast as white on black. That's exactly how all E46 and 1M gauges look too...

[cjb762]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

Ah. Well, to be honest I'm not sure what your gripe is then lol. You have white numbering and markings against a grey backdrop, that's obviously not going to give you as much contrast as white on black. That's exactly how all E46 and 1M gauges look too...

I mean... you do understand that my post was intended to relay my experience to other people thinking about doing it, right? As such, I was pointing out a few of the things that I didn't love about the swap - one of which is the reduced contrast between the lettering (which appears more grey than white on my gauges) and the background when the gauge lights are off.

Does that help you understand what my "gripe" is? If not, I would be happy to discuss it further with you.

[ShocknAwe]

You have gauge faces with less natural contrast for numbers and lettering due to the simple fact that light gray on medium gray is a poor design compared to light gray on black.

Of course it looks better with the faces backlit. Backlit polished turd.

Or maybe I missed the point entirely.


TLDR; IMO the 1M face design was a mistake to dilute the gauge readout functionality in exchange for "sporty" fashion.

[cjb762]

Originally Posted by ShocknAwe

You have gauge faces with less natural contrast for numbers and lettering due to the simple fact that light gray on medium gray is a poor design compared to light gray on black.

Of course it looks better with the faces backlit. Backlit polished turd.

Or maybe I missed the point entirely.


TLDR; IMO the 1M face design was a mistake to dilute the gauge readout functionality in exchange for "sporty" fashion.

Thanks - I understand how contrast works, I was just pointing out that it is one of the things I don't love about the gauge faces. As long as you have the backlight on they look great and I am happy with them.

[colorado.e9x]

I think they look great in the day time. Only thing I don't like much is I painted the back plates silver to help illuminate around the ring at night. If I had kept them black it would look better in the day time but not at night. I also messed up on painting my needles red, they don't light up very well at night. They're fairly dark. But.. They look good in the day. Oh well. I've been happy with it so far

[colorado.e9x]

I also used the red VHT to paint a square right behind the 330xi logo on the clear plastic back plate. I wanted it white in the day time but red at night. It did a great job, the only gripe is it makes the light on the top of the tach a little pink. Might fix that at some point.

Here's what they look like at night:

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

I also soldered in white SMD LEDs in place of the stock amber ones for the four gauges (3 each for the speedometer and tachometer, 1 each for the fuel and oil temp).

Considering getting these for my 135i. It seems everyone does the white LED mod with the grey gauge faces...trying to find pics of the grey gauge faces with the stock lighting, just to compare. Assuming you have seen everything related to this mod..lol.

[colorado.e9x]

Thinking about it now the orange would look amazing with the 1M faces, plus you'd be keeping the black background

I painted the background silver to further illuminate the white LEDs I replaced mine with. I just got so bored of the orange after seeing it for a couple years. Now I'm liking the idea of it again

[IMDRIVING]

Suprgnat - I've ordered a set of these for my '08 128i, but have only just realized that the tachometer scale on the Venoxy faces match the 135i/1M. The 128i has a slightly different scale (reference 4k RPM mark on stock 128i gauge vs. 135i/1M/Venoxy). As you've installed these on your 128i, checking whether you've noticed any discrepancy between actual RPM's and what is being shown on the gauge?

Originally Posted by Suprgnat

Weird. I find my Venoxy gauge faces to be quite legible in daylight, though they're not 1M style.

[Suprgnat]

Originally Posted by IMDRIVING

Suprgnat - I've ordered a set of these for my '08 128i, but have only just realized that the tachometer scale on the Venoxy faces match the 135i/1M. The 128i has a slightly different scale (reference 4k RPM mark on stock 128i gauge vs. 135i/1M/Venoxy). As you've installed these on your 128i, checking whether you've noticed any discrepancy between actual RPM's and what is being shown on the gauge?

No discrepancy, verified via OBD2, though mine is a 135i cluster.

[IMDRIVING]

Thanks much, Suprgnat . I guess I know the additional upgrade I'll need here

***Separately, I planned so much garage time today, I really did...then I clicked the link to your build thread...1/2 day lost, but totally worth it. I'm sure many others have had similar experiences. First, beautiful and perfectly modded car. Second, thanks for the effort to create such a detailed resource that I'm sure has benefitted countless other E82/E88 owners, myself now included.***

[LMB335IS]

Originally Posted by IMDRIVING

Thanks much, Suprgnat . I guess I know the additional upgrade I'll need here

***Separately, I planned so much garage time today, I really did...then I clicked the link to your build thread...1/2 day lost, but totally worth it. I'm sure many others have had similar experiences. First, beautiful and perfectly modded car. Second, thanks for the effort to create such a detailed resource that I'm sure has benefitted countless other E82/E88 owners, myself now included.***

Your tach reading will be consistently off throughout the range. The scales are different with different stepper motor settings for the rpm break points.

[fotontom]

Originally Posted by Suprgnat

No discrepancy, verified via OBD2, though mine is a 135i cluster.

Question for you, Supergnat. When you used the 135 cluster, how did you pick up the oil temp connection? Any other twists to that conversion? I have a 128 M-sport like yours and have followed most of your build. Would like to add this, as well. Thanks!

[Suprgnat]

Originally Posted by fotontom

Question for you, Supergnat. When you used the 135 cluster, how did you pick up the oil temp connection? Any other twists to that conversion? I have a 128 M-sport like yours and have followed most of your build. Would like to add this, as well. Thanks!

"It just works"™

There are no additional connections for the oil temp. The car already monitors that information, the 128i just lacks a (convenient) way to display it.

My only issue was using a vert cluster for the conversion and having all sorts of lights on the dash about a busted convertible top to code out.

[amg6975]

Originally Posted by fotontom

Question for you, Supergnat. When you used the 135 cluster, how did you pick up the oil temp connection? Any other twists to that conversion? I have a 128 M-sport like yours and have followed most of your build. Would like to add this, as well. Thanks!

Everything is CAN bus. The KOMBI just decides what to show you. Nothing needed.

[fotontom]

Originally Posted by Suprgnat

"It just works"™

There are no additional connections for the oil temp. The car already monitors that information, the 128i just lacks a (convenient) way to display it.

My only issue was using a vert cluster for the conversion and having all sorts of lights on the dash about a busted convertible top to code out.

Wow! Would never have expected that. And any tips on dealing with the odo?

[Suprgnat]

Originally Posted by fotontom

Wow! Would never have expected that. And any tips on dealing with the odo?

I did a lot of research on this site, but I didn't take any notes aside from what I may have posted on 1addicts. I still have the device i used to zero out the mileage on the eprom, and you're welcome to it for the cost of a USPS Small Flat-Rate Box. Couldn't tell you how to use it, though. Haven't touched the stuff in over three years.