Nasty experiences with the twin-turbo...

[adc]

Originally Posted by ttdamc

Overheating on cars that are being tracked happens on a regular basis, which is why many track enthusiasts will rest their cars between sessions.

You can't expect to take a road car and track it consistently without experiencing some issues during the life of the car.

I've tracked my E36 M3 and E46 330i without any overheating issues (or any other issues, for that matter).

I guess BMW raised my expectations, huh?

[john970]

Originally Posted by exokikwear

you'll have a hard time making a 135 feel like an S2000 on the track. i've been thinking about them recently.

If only BMW would copy that transmission... best shift feel of any car I've driven (the S2000). The worst has to be the rubber 1997 328i tranny I drove last week.

[john970]

Originally Posted by bradford

Audi 1.8t.

SLUDGE

[adc]

Originally Posted by john970

If only BMW would copy that transmission... best shift feel of any car I've driven (the S2000).

Not possible - the 335 (and 135, with which it shares the tranny) makes more than twice the torque of the S2000, over a much broader rev range.

But rest assured the transmission feels very very good - it does not bear comparison to any E36 transmission. All I had to do on the 335 is install a BMW short shift knob - the 135 already has it.

[john970]

Originally Posted by adc

Not possible - the 335 (and 135, with which it shares the tranny) makes more than twice the torque of the S2000, over a much broader rev range.

But rest assured the transmission feels very very good - it does not bear comparison to any E36 transmission. All I had to do on the 335 is install a BMW short shift knob - the 135 already has it.

Yeah, I meant the feel not unnecessarily the actual schematic. All of my past cars have been honda/acuras, too bad they refuse to put a bigger engine in the S2000, would have been on my short list. Still a great car.

[adc]

Originally Posted by john970

Yeah, I meant the feel not unnecessarily the actual schematic.

That's exactly what I meant too - you will like the feel of the 135 tranny, it's very mechanical with very well defined gates - and within 200 yeards of driving you will understand why it has to feel beefier than the S2k tranny.

[gmund1948]

Originally Posted by john970

If only BMW would copy that transmission... best shift feel of any car I've driven (the S2000). The worst has to be the rubber 1997 328i tranny I drove last week.

I hope NOT the s-2000 Box will never handle the stress, I drove a
135 here in Germany today, and the performance was amazing
really amazing. The DSC was going nuts until I turned it off

You will love this car !

I owned 2 S-2000s that were track bitches and had 3 trannies let loose, 2nd gear syncros twice, the whole box once

The 135 is a great ride, You will love this on a track. It drifts
very nicely !

[atr_hugo]

Nice first post from a Porsche fanatic! Thanks Gmund1948.

[gmund1948]

I have driven the 135 and can tell you, its more fun that anything
I have driven in a long long time It is a real pocket rocke. I am taking it out for an overnighter.

The Braakes are pretty amazing, actually I would compare it
to the world of Evos, STI or even the Cayman S or Boxster S

It will be an expensive car to insure as the car is that scary fast
I would peg the 0-60 in the 4.6 range with race tires and some break-in

Cheers from Germany

[larryn]

Welcome Gmund1948! By any chance are you in Gemunden (and hence your screen name)? I have been there many, many times while visiting relatives in Eussenheim.

[AwesomeBMW]

Originally Posted by Gmund1948

I have driven the 135 and can tell you, its more fun that anything
I have driven in a long long time It is a real pocket rocke. I am taking it out for an overnighter.

The Braakes are pretty amazing, actually I would compare it
to the world of Evos, STI or even the Cayman S or Boxster S

It will be an expensive car to insure as the car is that scary fast
I would peg the 0-60 in the 4.6 range with race tires and some break-in

Cheers from Germany

sweet:headbang:

[Italteen3]

Originally Posted by Gmund1948

I have driven the 135 and can tell you, its more fun that anything
I have driven in a long long time It is a real pocket rocke. I am taking it out for an overnighter.

The Braakes are pretty amazing, actually I would compare it
to the world of Evos, STI or even the Cayman S or Boxster S

It will be an expensive car to insure as the car is that scary fast
I would peg the 0-60 in the 4.6 range with race tires and some break-in

Cheers from Germany

Appreciate the mini-review. Man this wait is going to be long and hard....but well worth it! 0-60 in the 4.6 range with nice tires I also see easily possible. With all the tuners out there already working like mad on our engine I can't wait to see what kind of monsters we will produce on here.

[gmund1948]

Actually Gmund1948 is derived from a small town in Austria
"Gmund "where the Porsche family moved to during the war and in 1948, Ferry Porsche built the first car with their name the number 1, a midengined car based on the volkswagen that his father designed. The first Porsche was built in a converted sawmill
I was lucky enough to go there for the 50th aniversary of this event.

I own several Porsches from 1957-1996 and a 335 /e93 6 Mn convertable, and a 08 C-6 Corvette with the Z-51 suspension.

I will now order a 135 as a daily driver, be warned it doesnt have the smooth lines of the 3 coupe, and the back seats are really small and the trunk very large.

I will order sport, metallic and heated seats, the car is really equipped well and will blow you away

The Europeans pay 46 K Euro for the 135 equipped like we get it
so check out the exchange rate and dont complain


from Germany

Originally Posted by larryn

Welcome Gmund1948! By any chance are you in Gemunden (and hence your screen name)? I have been there many, many times while visiting relatives in Eussenheim.

[sciamop]

Originally Posted by Garrett

All turbocharged engines run hot without the use of an oil cooler. How many turbo charged engines don't have an oil cooler..?

Nissan S13 (U13, etc) w/ SR20DET
Link to Dave Coleman Article on SCC

The N54 is an evolution of the N52 engine. The N family was not designed from the ground up for FI. Many of the old school 'legendary' Japanese turbo engines (2JZ, SR20, RB26) *were* engineered from the ground up for FI; They were designed with oil squirters (keep down oil temps), forged pistons (better withstand detonation), beefier rods (ditto) and low compression ratios (ditto) -- all notables that are lacking in the N54. Had BMW followed these best practices, the N54 would be significantly more expensive and a bit rougher around the edges. It would also probably be capable of a Supra-like 800hp... So many damn pros and cons!

That said, BMW NA *can* overcome the high oil temp problem simply by adding a gigantic oil cooler. Here's a great shot of the Porsche design that Mike Miller alludes to (Ernie Jakubowski's Targa Newfoundland 2006 Entry -- Cayman S):



Sorry for thread resurrection.

[larryn]

Originally Posted by sciamop

The N54 is an evolution of the N52 engine.

Other than it being an inline 6 BMW engine produced around the same time as the N52, they are very different motors. The N52 has a magnesium/aluminum composite block, where the N54 has an solid aluminum block, with cast iron cylinders. They have different internals as well. This was done so it CAN handle the extra stress from the turbos. The magnesium block was deemed unfit for the extra stress and heat. The N54 is also about 75lbs heavier than the N52, because of these differences...

Again, other than being a BMW inline 6, they are extremely different motors.

I do think that they are onto something by saying it needs a biiig oil cooler to push more power, just as any turbo car can benefit from.

[atr_hugo]

Originally Posted by larryn

The N54 is also about 75lbs heavier than the N52, because of these differences...

And what do you want to bet the 'trim weight' in the rear bumper is, oh, say, right around 75lbs? ; -)

[larryn]

Could very well be, Hugo. the motor is within the wheelbase though, so 75lbs there is not as balance changing as 75lbs on the rear bumper, beyond the wheelbase.

You could probably eliminate the forward weight addition of the N54, with half the weight beyond the wheelbase. Good thinking though... that may very well be the case. I wonder if the N52 powered 128i has the ballast?

[atr_hugo]

Cylinders 1-3 are in front of the front axle, add the weight of the intercooler and viola, you have an approximation of the trim weight. The battery ought to be the same 128i/135i so that weight should already have been accounted for.

Now I remember why I like the Cayman so much - weight inside the axles.

[larryn]

Originally Posted by atr_hugo

Cylinders 1-3 are in front of the front axle

Dammit, I hate when you're right!

[Numb3rs]

Originally Posted by larryn

Dammit, I hate when you're right!

You two brothers..?


sciamop, The N54 was designed from the ground up as a directed injected, forced induced engine. Don't let the fact that BMW continued use of previous award winning design fool you. They just incorporated the use of their past engineering accolades into the making of this engine.

Hollowed camshafts and forged cranks, there is a lot of new and expensive technology that makes this engine what it is. All your "notables" are surpassed in the N54. Some reading may be required on your part.

[adc]

My understanding is that the N54 is an evolution of the M54 engine from the E46 cars. The magnesium/aluminum N52 block was considered unproven as far as strength so they went back to the aluminum M54 design.

I think I've read this from a believable source, but as so many of these internet rumors, it could be wrong.

[Drawarms]

In another thread we were talking about if you get the sports pkg, you get dual oil-coolers. And the over heating issues only happened to the first few 335i, BMW has since then addresses the issue and the problem should be fixed.