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      12-20-2015, 10:36 PM   #67
houtan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slonik View Post
our at transmission had additional oil cooler installed previously (small enough), so first time we use same config. it was fitted on one of the stock exchanger lines.
when we fitted large cooler later, we use same lines to save time. i have in plans to change this config to something more neatly, cause i don't like a lot of bended lines there.

as i know dct cooling system has thermostat, so i don't understand, why people say "cooling system warms transmission oil".

and, do you saw dct temperatures? dct controls temperature in few points and i'm shocked how it's hot on some units, for example like forks cooling.
when we had small cooler, after second overheat warning i saw in log something about 180c degrees... same time, point with lowest temperature was about 130c degrees.

i can try to upload pics with dct information from Rheingold later, if you didn't saw this previously.
I love looking at the pics you post and watching the progress of your build, thanks for posting them!

from what i understand, the DCT heat exchanger is there to quickly heat up the transmission fluid from cold. I have been reading that cold transmission fluid increases wear, so the heat exchanger quickly warms up the fluid to operating temp to reduce wear. I am guessing that is important on a daily driver, but not so much on a track car as the harsher driving will probably heat up the fluid quickly.

never seen DCT info from rheingold, would be glad to look at it if it's available and learn about how you did the dct cooler install.
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      12-21-2015, 07:23 PM   #68
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Quote:
I love looking at the pics you post and watching the progress of your build, thanks for posting them!

from what i understand, the DCT heat exchanger is there to quickly heat up the transmission fluid from cold. I have been reading that cold transmission fluid increases wear, so the heat exchanger quickly warms up the fluid to operating temp to reduce wear. I am guessing that is important on a daily driver, but not so much on a track car as the harsher driving will probably heat up the fluid quickly.

never seen DCT info from rheingold, would be glad to look at it if it's available and learn about how you did the dct cooler install.
thanks

dct heat exchanger - usual water to oil cooler it's more efficient then air cooler with comparable size. but, it can cool oil only to water temperature (and, it has too small size, to make really good cooling)
how it can warm oil, if dct oil thermostat are closed, before oil heating up? )
so, dct oil heats up itself, without any influence of exchanger.

i already made some screen shots about dct from rheingold, but it's on my notebook in garage.

and some progress pics

today we had started welding






how it looks from inside






and battery compartment's frame removed
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      12-21-2015, 08:12 PM   #69
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Wow, Great pics and good info. I am definitely looking forward to the continued development of this car.
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      12-21-2015, 09:03 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slonik View Post
thanks

dct heat exchanger - usual water to oil cooler it's more efficient then air cooler with comparable size. but, it can cool oil only to water temperature (and, it has too small size, to make really good cooling)
how it can warm oil, if dct oil thermostat are closed, before oil heating up? )
so, dct oil heats up itself, without any influence of exchanger.

i already made some screen shots about dct from rheingold, but it's on my notebook in garage.
Thanks for the info. I had know idea the there is a thermostat. i completely agree, if the thermostat is on the line going to the heat exchanger, then yeah, the dct must be heating up the oil on its own.
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      12-26-2015, 07:48 PM   #71
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Quote:
Thanks for the info. I had know idea the there is a thermostat. i completely agree, if the thermostat is on the line going to the heat exchanger, then yeah, the dct must be heating up the oil on its own.
forgot to make some screens from ista and i've tried to found some info from web.
https://www.google.ru/url?sa=t&rct=j...l8J3Tg&cad=rjt
and, hmm... on m3 dct thermostat really change flow, to warm oil faster.
but as i saw on pics, dct on 135 don't have this item on the left side - only simple connection of cooling lines.
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      12-26-2015, 09:56 PM   #72
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and some updates! our own design dct oil pan

you can think, "why we can't just go and buy one of the dct pans, which already sells enough on market?". i'll return to this question after typing some info .


first time we thought about custom pan in summer, when swapped dct on our e82, but those time we had no time for this.
anyway, after some dct usage on track we have a lot of experience with it and we saw some weak spots.

one of the main problems on track - oil starvation. it happens when you have high G on lateral acceleration and after hard braking. dct trying to get right oil pressure, to make some of the operations, like working with clutch or gear shifting, and it can't build enough pressure, cause oil goes away from suction pipe. in that moment you can get some short delay, or, if you'll continue to push acceleration pedal - fault code on dash and transmission warning light.
easiest solution - raise oil level. this way chose bmw on their track oriented M3 GTS- it has additional liter in transmission.

this solution helps a lot, but not totally - on stock oil level we can get some transmission warnings every track session and after raising the level like on gts, only 1-2 times per day (about 8-10 sessions). thanks to huge grip of 275 square setup hankook semi slick .

so we decided to close this issue totally with changing stock dct pan. in our own design pan we added some huge partitions all over bottom surface. another way - lowering bottom of the pan. but it wouldn't have any real effect, if suction pipe will stay on same height as stock. so, we also make some spacer, to lower suction pipe to the lowest point of our new pan.

another weak spot - dct overheating. in some cases we had up to 185c degrees in some points of the transmission (oil ramp over forks and hubs).
main solution (and most effective) - uprated oil cooler. we also use it, but if we making custom piece of aluminum, we can make anything we want . so we must to use all possibilities - and we add some real cooling fins all over bottom surface.

another additional function of new pan - add some stiffness to transmission case. oem dct pan made from plastic, which also bends on high temperatures - to compensate this, bmw (or getrag) use thick rubber seal.
in our case we don't need to compensate bended flange surface of the pan (cause it has excellent smooth surface), and if we will continue to use rubber, we can't get hard connection between oil pan and main case. so, designing oil pan flange without rubber seal, to fit it with sealing compound.

and another one condition - oem dct oil pan has a little slope from the front to the end. this was made to compensate transmission angle, when it installed on the car. this slope on the pan gives horizontal position for the bottom of the pan. we had repeated same slope on our pan.

also, we have some limits in the height - most of the track oriented cars has low ride height and smallest ground clearance, so we can't add height a lot.
so we have tried to make max height, which will not make our pan - lowest point (around transmission location).

so, why just don't go and buy?

because i've spent a lot of time, looking through the internet, and i saw most of them and... i don't like any of them .
all of them has some real minuses. a lot of them were made with huge savings in manufacturing - small cooling fins, which i don't understand how to call "cooling fins" (real fins takes a lot of cnc time). bottom without any slope - huge cnc time economy (if you work on 3-axles machine).
most of the pans has simplest design inside, without any partitions. best i saw - some small partitions on the bottom, which doesn't make any real difference.

and a lot of deep pans - one deeper than another but no one of them thought about suction pipe height.

and another "why?" because we can


ps this one was made for our M3F80. second copy, for our e82, will be done after new year vacations.
i'll post some pics, fitted on the car later.

















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      12-26-2015, 10:08 PM   #73
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Please make some additional DCT pans and sell them to 1addicts! Would love one!
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      12-26-2015, 10:36 PM   #74
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That pan is awesome. I don't even need one and I want one lol
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      12-26-2015, 11:13 PM   #75
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Quote:
Please make some additional DCT pans and sell them to 1addicts! Would love one!
it's not a problem for me
i'll be glad to make some good stuff for you.

Quote:
That pan is awesome. I don't even need one and I want one lol
i understand you - when i've received it after machining, i walked with it through the house for two days

Last edited by slonik; 12-26-2015 at 11:21 PM.
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      12-27-2015, 12:31 PM   #76
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i love your car. i was thinking of getting the same coilover as you the ST XTA, would you say these are fine for both street and track? i only track the car about 10 times a year. so mostly street. also which model did you go with? the e82 or the e88 for a higher rear spring rate? for the price with the camber plates they are hard to beat. thanks
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      12-27-2015, 03:32 PM   #77
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installation on car (M3 F80)


how gearbox looks without pan. oil pump with suction pipe removed






oil pump fitted. suction pipe with our spacer


dct pan








underfloor coating installed


i've tried to push on underfloor coating, there are few mm clearance between coating and dct pan.
so, anything lower, and we need to cut this cover.
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      12-27-2015, 04:36 PM   #78
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Quote:
i love your car. i was thinking of getting the same coilover as you the ST XTA, would you say these are fine for both street and track? i only track the car about 10 times a year. so mostly street. also which model did you go with? the e82 or the e88 for a higher rear spring rate? for the price with the camber plates they are hard to beat. thanks
yep, they works great for their price. we had kit for e82.

but for z214 semislick we used much higher spring rates.

i'll take same xta kit on my m3 e46 .
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      02-09-2016, 11:03 AM   #79
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Car looks great!! i was wondering if you could post what your approximate ride height is?

Thanks
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      02-17-2016, 04:22 PM   #80
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Quote:
Car looks great!! i was wondering if you could post what your approximate ride height is?
hmm, in which point you want?
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      02-17-2016, 04:47 PM   #81
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body arrived after roll cage was fitted.







































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      02-17-2016, 05:05 PM   #82
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BEAUTIFUL cage. Those guessets are on point. I really like how they did the A pillars and the roof. Nice. Any specific reason you went for that much bracing in the back? Seems like a lot of weight considering how much the cage would stiffen up the chassis already.
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      02-17-2016, 05:28 PM   #83
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Quote:
BEAUTIFUL cage. Those guessets are on point. I really like how they did the A pillars and the roof. Nice. Any specific reason you went for that much bracing in the back? Seems like a lot of weight considering how much the cage would stiffen up the chassis already.
about rear end - i've asked to tie all subframe mounting points to the roll cage.
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      02-17-2016, 05:40 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slonik View Post
about rear end - i've asked to tie all subframe mounting points to the roll cage.
Ah gotchya. Thats a good idea. might have to expand my cage a bit and do something similar...
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      02-28-2016, 01:47 AM   #85
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So sick.
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      02-28-2016, 08:08 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slonik
Quote:
Car looks great!! i was wondering if you could post what your approximate ride height is?
hmm, in which point you want?
Centre of hub to the top of fender if possible!!

Thanks!
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      04-10-2016, 05:05 PM   #87
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Quote:
Centre of hub to the top of fender if possible!!

Thanks!
i've forgot about you, sorry(. i can check our wheel diameter/radius and then you can try to figure on pics.



some update.

car now goes to the body shop.

our lightweight rear quarters (1M) are finished.











and now some pics fitting on the body








our old stock non m quarter

Last edited by slonik; 04-10-2016 at 05:18 PM.
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      04-10-2016, 06:29 PM   #88
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Incredible, so is it FRP from mold of 1M panel? Guess you'd need every piece of that insane cross bracing in there after removing the metal rear body.

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