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      10-23-2016, 07:03 PM   #45
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Was thinking about it but I am too busy to update it regularly lol I was also considering the bimmerworld kit just worried about how intrusive it would be looking through the windshield with that installed...I may just go through with it just to get the heater core out from under the dash until I can think of a better solution.
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      10-24-2016, 10:39 AM   #46
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Wife went to our (future) son's baby shower at the inlaws so I had a whole Sunday to myself. Win.

Started off by removing the doors to make it easier to wrench on the car. Even after being gutted, they are still very hefty. So sad.

Doors will be going to the shop in a few days to get aluminum covers fitted to the inside. No more cutting up my race suit and passengers' elbows!


Proceeded to cut out the unnecessary parts of the wiring harness from the rear of the car to the firewall. Hopefully JUST the unnecessary parts... Will find out in a couple weeks if I dun f**ked up. Hah.

I figure I've removed about 20lbs from the wiring harness to date.. You can also see bits of the firewall sound deadening material.


After cutting out the wiring harness and the firewall sound deadening, I proceeded to remove the last bits of the sound deadening tar. Haven't finished yet, though.

Doing what I'm doing now BEFORE the cage was installed would've made life 18230541234729 times easier. Crawling through the cage to get at the rear seat area, foot well areas etc is a royal pain in the ass.

Last edited by xBlueStreakx; 10-24-2016 at 01:27 PM..
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      10-28-2016, 02:35 PM   #47
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Forgot to mention. The oil pan baffle was installed prior to my last track event.

The day was uneventful motor-wise so I'd say it was installed properly.

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      11-03-2016, 09:17 PM   #48
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What a great project! Looks awesome.
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      11-23-2016, 09:12 AM   #49
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Been putting in a few hours on the weekends. Here's what's up so far:

I'm about halfway through shoehorning the Uras style vent into the OEM hood. I've seen this vent surface mounted on alot of cars and with rivets and IMO, it looked awful so I decided to undermount /w rivets then fiberglass over top. There is a combination of fiberglass /w resin, long hair and short hair glass. I'm in the final stages of bondo and sanding (not pictured).

*disclaimer* This is my first attempt at doing something like this so if I got the steps wrong, you know why. At the end of the day, I think I'll get it right enough that it'll look good once I re-wrap the car.



Also got started on the 1M front fenders.



I have an order coming in from Hard Motorsports which should let me get back at the interior before sending the car off to the shop to get some more cage work done.
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      11-24-2016, 10:29 AM   #50
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Nice! That fiberglass will come out well, just sand the hell out of it. Car is friggin awesome too! Look forward to seeing updates.
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      12-05-2016, 01:23 PM   #51
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Update.

Hood is almost done. Painted it with Tremclad/Rustoleum gloss black because I couldn't see the imperfections in the bondo treatment. After painting it, there's a bit more work to do before I'll add one more coat then wrap it. Turned out decent.




Part of my Hard Motorsport order came in as well. Took a chance on their E90 upright/APR GT250 wing combo and it panned out. The uprights don't align with the trunk profile 100% but its pretty close. I'm really digging the look.



I'll need to brace the uprights about half-way up to the chassis somehow. Will take this up with my shop when it goes in for some more cage work.

Last edited by xBlueStreakx; 12-05-2016 at 04:55 PM..
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      12-07-2016, 12:13 AM   #52
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Very cool. I'm interested to see how it all looks when put back together!
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      12-24-2016, 06:07 PM   #53
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Lovely build, and some quality mods, well done

Do you get any rubbing with the 265 tyres with the ER oil coolers? I've the got the same setup, but can only use 255 ad08r's without it catching? Anything wider (cup2s/mpss/r888s) are all 265/35/18..on 1/2 turn lock, does the tyre touch the metal fins?
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      12-24-2016, 09:56 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinsta View Post
Lovely build, and some quality mods, well done

Do you get any rubbing with the 265 tyres with the ER oil coolers? I've the got the same setup, but can only use 255 ad08r's without it catching? Anything wider (cup2s/mpss/r888s) are all 265/35/18..on 1/2 turn lock, does the tyre touch the metal fins?
Thanks!

Yeah. The tires definitely make contact if I'm trying to maneuver the car using alot of steering input. But with regular inputs at the track - which is at most 1/4 turn - the fronts stay clear of the oil cooler.

I'm on 275s now. Having issues out back with the tires contacting the fuel filler neck. Grrr.
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      01-03-2017, 09:11 AM   #55
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Took last week off to spend time with my family, wife, son and to wrench on the 1er. In between my son's naps, I snuck into the garage to get some work done.

Started off by wrapping and dropping in the modified fenders; I think it looks awesome. This mod should definitely help with front end lift at Mosport while taking turns at 160KM/h+ and down the straight at 225KM/h.


Next up. I rewrapped the hood. Messed up so bad the first time (tore the wrap) that I needed to try again. This left me with scraps of wrap to finish off the driver side front fender and other areas of the car. Suffice it to say, 2017 will not be a good year in the looks department unless I spring for a new roll and redo a whole chunk of the car.


In between doing exterior work, I'd spend time working on the interior paint job. Going with gloss black on everything save for the roof skin (natural) and cage (gloss red). The garage is on the cold side so it takes about 24 hours for the paint to dry in between coats. I'm applying 2 coats.


The final batch of my Hard Motorsport order arrived which consisted of their E90 front splitter and rear diffuser kit. Fitment is almost bang on with the front splitter kit and 1M bumper. However, I will be making modifications to the splitter and adding additional reinforcement for peace of mind. Front splitter mock up:


Also ordered these bad boys. Turner Motorsport had a 20% off sale over Christmas so I jumped on them. I'll have the shop install this as I no longer do extensive work under my car; don't want to risk injury.


More to come!... Eventually. Hah.
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      01-03-2017, 10:43 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
However... I did some wheel rate calculations and the rear is severely under-sprung compared to the front (which explains a tendency to really understeer at the limit). I'll need to upgrade to 1000lbs springs out back (from 670lbs) to balance the front and rear so the added camber may not be necessary. Regardless, the spherical link will go in for performance reasons.
How does that spring rate feel in the rear? Everyone goes with these ridiculously stiff front springs and a spongy rear spring. Makes no sense to be at 2.5hz up front (with a big 28mm sway bar on top of this) and 1.5hz in the rear. You have some decent tread all around, so I am interested in hearing your feedback on how you like the more even F:R ratio. Car should be more neutral so long as you're light with your right foot (power oversteer)...

I just got my YCW coilovers with that came with 6k/12k and the front just feels stupidly stiff compared to the rear. I am also ready to pull my 27mm front bar out because I feel like the car pushes/understeers on entry now. I really wanted 6k/18k, but they weren't doing "race" setups for round 2 testing... 18k would've given me 1000lb/in out back and a more even 2hz F:R spring frequency.
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      01-03-2017, 11:18 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bNks334 View Post
How does that spring rate feel in the rear? Everyone goes with these ridiculously stiff front springs and a spongy rear spring. Makes no sense to be at 2.5hz up front (with a big 28mm sway bar on top of this) and 1.5hz in the rear. You have some decent tread all around, so I am interested in hearing your feedback on how you like the more even F:R ratio. Car should be more neutral so long as you're light with your right foot (power oversteer)...

I just got my YCW coilovers with that came with 6k/12k and the front just feels stupidly stiff compared to the rear. I am also ready to pull my 27mm front bar out because I feel like the car pushes/understeers on entry now. I really wanted 6k/18k, but they weren't doing "race" setups for round 2 testing... 18k would've given me 1000lb/in out back and a more even 2hz F:R spring frequency.
I wish I had a definitive answer to your whole post. I'm still trying to figure things out...

With the 672lbs rear, the car is very very planted mid corner and corner exit (understeer... and it drives me nuts). I can get it to oversteer on entry if I'm very aggressive with the trail braking but I don't like this driving style. BTW, I have the stock front swaybar and dont' plan on changing it just yet.

This topic has been discussed quite heavily by Orb and fe1rx (check out their threads). Orb eventually settled on 1008lbs out back while fe1rx went to 800lbs. Front spring rates were similar to my setup.

I did further research on this matter and looked at E46 race cars and owners recommend a 200lbs split front/rear no matter what. i.e. 600F/800R, 700F/900R and so forth. Motion ratios are similar, if not identical to our suspension as well which means the theory on wheel rates/frequencies is taken with a grain of salt.

Other sites I have looked into suggest a very stiff front spring because McPherson suspensions work best when they don't work at all given their bad camber gain characteristics. By not working at all, I mean no body roll (stiffly sprung). This helps support the E46 race car spring rates I've seen.

I had some back and forth private messaging with Harold at HP Autosport and he flat out said he doesn't recommend going higher than 800lbs in the rear despite the math. Maybe he doesn't want to recommend something that may end up with me damaging the car? At any rate, I heeded his advice and went with 784lbs swifts out back for 2017 to take things incrementally instead of effing up the chassis dynamics and having to backtrack.

TL;DR. I'm at 392F/784R with an itch to also go stiffer at the front given the E46 guys and their setups.

Last edited by xBlueStreakx; 01-03-2017 at 11:24 AM..
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      01-03-2017, 11:01 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
I wish I had a definitive answer to your whole post. I'm still trying to figure things out...
Yeah, I understand. Finding good info on suspension tuning is like finding a needle in a haystack. Orb, Fel1x, and others have provided us with info that is as good as it gets when trying to make informed suspension decisions though.

Here is a pretty good read on the suspension geometry principles Fel1x tested: http://mk3ukr-supra.net/SCC%20-%20su...20part%204.pdf

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
With the 672lbs rear, the car is very very planted mid corner and corner exit (understeer... and it drives me nuts). I can get it to oversteer on entry if I'm very aggressive with the trail braking but I don't like this driving style. BTW, I have the stock front swaybar and dont' plan on changing it just yet.
At 6k/12k (336/672), I feel like the front end is unnaturally stiff compared to the rear and on paper it is. I feel like I am driving a boat or something where the rear squats but the front end doesn't budge.

Maybe I am just biased though because I ran my 128i with a spring rate of 200/600. The car was absolutely amazing to drive on track. I got many compliments from instructors on how well balanced the car was. I also used a smaller E92 front sway on that car only in an effort to offset some of the additional camber change caused by running 235 squared tires.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
This topic has been discussed quite heavily by Orb and fe1rx (check out their threads). Orb eventually settled on 1008lbs out back while fe1rx went to 800lbs. Front spring rates were similar to my setup.
Yes, I see where they both attempted to re-balance their cars by moving to a closer F:R effective wheel rate. Seems to have been motivated by feeling the car was pushing too much and then calculating that with rates like 400/700 the rear wheels are still massively under-sprung relative to the front.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
I did further research on this matter and looked at E46 race cars and owners recommend a 200lbs split front/rear no matter what. i.e. 600F/800R, 700F/900R and so forth. Motion ratios are similar, if not identical to our suspension as well which means the theory on wheel rates/frequencies is taken with a grain of salt.
I hate the typical "oh well it worked for this person/car so I'll do it too." I am not sold that many of the people making recommendations have any clue what they are talking about. A blanket "200lb" difference is terrible advice that ignores the proportionality of suspension geometry variances.

There are many people who will swear by tuning suspension by effective wheels rates. By taking the cars suspension geometry into consideration you can directly determine how well your chosen spring rate will work for you. The concept makes sense imo... Choose a neutral spring setup... then tune the rest of the suspension to make the car do what you want. Match how stiff of a spring you choose (frequency) to how much grip your tires can generate (don't choose a 2.5hz spring rate when you're rolling around on all seasons lol)... It's certainly a better approach than "well the x car ran 1000lb front springs and 500 rear." Maybe that car could've shaved 20 seconds off it's lap time too if it had been setup properly lol

A quick search tells me the following:
E30/36/46 front: .94^2 = .88 (1000lb spring gives 880lb wheel-rate)
E36/46 rear: .65^2 = .423 (1000lb spring gives 423lb wheel rate)
E30 rear: .67^2 = .45 (1000lb spring gives 450lb wheel rate)
E46 M3 = .9604/.4356 = 2.20

E46 are 1:2 (.88/.423) ===> 400(.88)=352 and 600(.423)=253.8
E90/E82 are 1:3 (0.9216/0.316969) ===> 400(.9216)=368 and 600(.316969)=190

The E82 and the E46 DO NOT have the same motion ratios. An E82 would have a massively greater variance in F:R effective wheel rates than an E46 would at the same 400/600 spring rate. The E46 would have a frequency of close to 2.1/1.9hz and the E82 would have a F:R frequency of 2.16/1.63... An E82 would need a spring rate of 380/825 to match the same performance as an E46 running 400/600 springs... 400/600 doesn't look all that bad for an E46, but it looks heavily unbalanced for an E82.

To get back to blanket statements like "maintain a 200lb difference," for an E82, a 100/300 split would result in a rear spring that is effectively 6% stiffer than the front (oversteer/flat ride frequency). With a 900/1100 split you'd end up with a rear spring that is effectively -47% weaker than the front (a heavily understeer biased spring frequency).

These examples highlight the importance of calculating wheel rates and frequency to at least get a baseline of how to make meaningful changes to the suspension...

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
Other sites I have looked into suggest a very stiff front spring because McPherson suspensions work best when they don't work at all given their bad camber gain characteristics. By not working at all, I mean no body roll (stiffly sprung). This helps support the E46 race car spring rates I've seen.
I absolutely agree that, TO SOME EXTENT, you want to reduce the negative side effects of a McPherson style front suspension. However, how can you determine if you're stiffening the front relative to the rear if you're not taking the cars suspension geometry into account?

Also, I fail to see how keeping the front of the car unnaturally stiff produces "better" handling when coupled with the other typical mods we do to the E82. Yeah sure, by eliminating body roll you prevent dynamic camber changes. However, eliminating DIVE also means you kill all the BENEFITS of a McPherson suspension. Dive under compression causes a favorable change in toe which aids in turn-in (toe-out).

E82 owners are already doing mods that help reduce dynamic camber changes such as M3 control arms, lowering ride height, and sway bars. Stiffening up the front, and reducing bump travel, is also going to reduce dynamic camber change. Why also make the front un-naturally stiff in proportion to the rear?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
I had some back and forth private messaging with Harold at HP Autosport and he flat out said he doesn't recommend going higher than 800lbs in the rear despite the math. Maybe he doesn't want to recommend something that may end up with me damaging the car? At any rate, I heeded his advice and went with 784lbs swifts out back for 2017 to take things incrementally instead of effing up the chassis dynamics and having to backtrack.
No idea... but power oversteer should be controlled with your right foot and not with stiff front springs that cause understeer. BMW already dialed in "reverse rake" from the factory to aid rear traction and prevent snap oversteer. FR-S, BRZ, and Miata owners are using higher effective wheel rates on their lighter RWD cars than us E82 owners are lol... We are more tire limited though for the power we put down (without going staggered).

Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
TL;DR. I'm at 392F/784R with an itch to also go stiffer at the front given the E46 guys and their setups.
You're following down a bad path with that logic imo. From the threads I've seen, this is what people were doing back in 2008. They were assuming the 1 series had the same motion ratio as the E36 and they were sticking to their stiffer front than rear setups like 600/400. Apparently, even tc kline recommended 450/300 back in 2008... Look how far we've come. Don't go backwards

Fel1x ohlins suspension thread details all the dynamic changes the suspension goes through for a given ride height. After doing the easy performance mods like control arms, sway bars, springs, and lowered ride height, there is no way you need to to also unbalance the spring rates... The deflection Fel1x measured wasn't even that bad in stock form. Static camber alone could pretty much compensate for dynamic camber change even before the aforementioned mods. Dynamic toe changes would be decreased with the stiffening of the front subframe and control arms.

Although Miata's don't have McPherson front suspensions, they typically run higher front spring rates than rear. Why? Because the front motion ratio is LESS than the rear. You need stiffer springs up front than in the rear to create a neutral balance. On an ND Miata, the front motion ratio is 0.69:1 and the rear is 0.75:1. https://www.edmunds.com/mazda/mx-5-m...minations.html

here is another thread discussing tuning Miata race cars: https://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=594291. The poster did all the calcs in the first post but was given bad motion ratio numbers. Later posts go on to explain the front motion ratio is LOWER which is why the aftermarket targets higher spring rates in the front for ND Miata's.

On a Miata a, 9kg front springs produce a frequency of 1.96Hz and a 6kg rear spring produces a frequency of 2.12Hz. This is another example of how a stiffer front spring is only used on Miatas to produce a flat ride frequency. It is not used to produce a 2.5hz front spring rate and a 1.5hz rear spring rate like so many E82 owners are doing unknowingly.

An even better place to compare suspension tuning would be the FRS/BRZ forums. They are way more active than here and they too use a mcpherson strut with a multi-link rear. The aftermarket over there seems to be giving them front biased springs as well despite the logic saying you should run a higher rear spring rate. Many are reluctant to move to aftermarket suspensions out of fear of ruining the stock cars excellent balance (131/211 springs from factory supposedly).

If coilover manufacturers add in massive understeer to keep people from crashing their cars than that's one thing. I am looking for a neutral setup, for an already well balanced car, and that makes no sense to me regardless of what other people are doing.

Last edited by bNks334; 01-04-2017 at 09:01 PM..
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      01-06-2017, 10:33 AM   #59
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You're right on alot of points.

Also, after I mentioned that the E46 had similar motion ratios, I went to verify and realized "oh shit", they're not as similar as I thought. Foot in mouth on that one.

At any rate, I understand theory says X and I was all about targeting a wheel frequency, springing it accordingly and calling it a day. But then after searching around, the theory isn't applied verbatim which leaves me scratching my head. I'm versed enough in suspensions to not try something willy nilly (hence the move to go with an incremental approach with a stiffer rear spring) but not well versed enough to discount 'common knowledge' (whether right or wrong) and just do my own thing. Definitely want to get to the latter where I can comfortably do my own thing regardless of what others say.

Some things the wheel frequency calculations do not account for (or just assume) are chassis flex, give in the subframe/suspension bushings etc (which fe1rx touches on). The calculations assume the suspension is acting on a fully rigid chassis... which is not the case in any street car and to be honest may not be the case in my caged racecar either. For instance, my cage doesn't tie in to any part of the front suspension (or near it).

Quote:
Originally Posted by bNks334 View Post
An even better place to compare suspension tuning would be the FRS/BRZ forums. They are way more active than here and they too use a mcpherson strut with a multi-link rear. The aftermarket over there seems to be giving them front biased springs as well despite the logic saying you should run a higher rear spring rate. Many are reluctant to move to aftermarket suspensions out of fear of ruining the stock cars excellent balance (131/211 springs from factory supposedly).

If coilover manufacturers add in massive understeer to keep people from crashing their cars than that's one thing. I am looking for a neutral setup, for an already well balanced car, and that makes no sense to me regardless of what other people are doing.
Yeah. Will definitely scour the FRS/BRZ forums to see what's up. Thanks for the other links btw!

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      01-06-2017, 11:00 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xBlueStreakx View Post
You're right on alot of points.

Also, after I mentioned that the E46 had similar motion ratios, I went to verify and realized "oh shit", they're not as similar as I thought. Foot in mouth on that one.At any rate, I understand theory says X and I was all about targeting a wheel frequency, springing it accordingly and calling it a day. But then after searching around, the theory isn't applied verbatim which leaves me scratching my head. I'm versed enough in suspensions to not try something willy nilly (hence the move to go with an incremental approach with a stiffer rear spring) but

not well versed enough to discount 'common knowledge' (whether right or wrong) and just do my own thing. Definitely want to get to the latter where I can comfortably do my own thing regardless of what others say.

One thing the wheel frequency calculations do not account for (or just assume) is chassis flex, give in the subframe etc (which fe1rx touches on). The calculations assume the suspension is acting on a fully rigid chassis... which is not the case in any street car and to be honest may not be the case in my caged racecar either. For instance, my cage doesn't tie in to any part of the front suspension (or near it).

Yeah. Will definitely scour the FRS/BRZ forums to see what's up. Thanks for the other links btw!
Yeah, I was heated when I wrote all that after I had just installed my YCW coilovers. They tout delivering even F:R ratios, but I installed them only to find out I received 6k/12k springs that they were using for "stage 2" testing. It doesn't feel right with the 27mm bar up front. Car understeers if I turn in too hard. It also feels like it runs a wider line on exit. They will be sending me shorter 4k springs when the coilovers are in production stage.

The basic natural frequency approach is only taking a static 2d picture of the suspension into account. The suspension changes dynamically as it goes through it's motions which effects the springs effectiveness. Making alignment changes, changing bushings, and lowering the ride height also changes the motion ratio so you need to account for that as well. The typical changes we make to the rear, like spherical bushings and solid subframe mounts, serves to further reduce the effective rear spring rate, as fel1x points out in his testing. So no, spring frequency alone is not 100% accurate and shouldn't be relied on solely. It's a good place to start though rather than dialing in massive understeer right off the bat.

I jumped on the bandwagon modding my 135i suspension as everyone else does. The result so far is a car that handles worse in comparison to my 128i lol. I hope lowering the spring rate up front helps. Maybe simply removing the 27mm whiteline front bar will help get the car back to a more neutral balance. I'll try both.

Your car looks amazing btw!

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      01-13-2017, 01:26 PM   #61
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Ordered some swag from Harold at HP Autosport.

HP Autosport FSB endlinks and Rogue Engineering spherical rear camber/guide rod set. Will round out the Rogue Engineering toe arms already installed. Looking forward to having a pretty darn precise rear end though I still have squishy OEM bushings in the rear trailing arm and control arm. Will take care of that next winter.


And... Ermahgerd! Berk Midperps! IMO, by far the best sounding midpipes available for the 1er. Can't wait to hear the car rip.
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      01-30-2017, 03:06 PM   #62
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Went HAM on the car these last two weekends.

Fabbed up a switch panel /w circuit breakers. So far, I have use for 2 of them (electronic accessories and windshield defogger) with the rest as placeholders. Also fabbed a tablet holder with angled aluminum and velcro so I can have Harry's Lap Timer front and center. The underside of the dash was heavily gutted some time ago so its pretty light... Maybe 5-8lbs now.

Pretty happy with the way it turned out.




Swapped the OEM steering wheel for a flat bottomed Sparco unit too. Looks sexy and weighs a whole lot less. The interior is looking like a proper racecar now.


And last but not least. The 1er is now rocking the Rogue Engineering guide rods and camber links.


This coming weekend, I'm hoping to finish the wiring and reinstall the seats and harnesses. Then its back to the exterior work.

I tell you what, I wish I just bought a ready to run racecar. It would've been cheaper and alot less work. I'm over the pride of "built not bought" accomplishment. I just want to race :P
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Last edited by xBlueStreakx; 01-30-2017 at 04:06 PM..
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      02-25-2017, 08:45 PM   #63
Maxim_X
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It's always cheaper to buy a vehicle ready to race than building it. Sometimes its 2 or 3x cheaper, but there is always that wonder if it's all done right.

What series/class do you plan to race in? Are you racing at Bogie?
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      02-27-2017, 01:37 PM   #64
xBlueStreakx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxim_X View Post
It's always cheaper to buy a vehicle ready to race than building it. Sometimes its 2 or 3x cheaper, but there is always that wonder if it's all done right.

What series/class do you plan to race in? Are you racing at Bogie?
I'll be attending some CASC/CSCS events this year.

Definitely want to give Calabogie a shot; haven't figured out my 'travel events' just yet. Watkins Glen/VIR are also on my radar this year.

Dave
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      03-07-2017, 03:56 PM   #65
Maxim_X
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I've never been to watkins glen, but, VIR remains the nicest track I've ever ridden.
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      04-12-2017, 04:21 AM   #66
GrantCraik
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When you fitted the hard motorsport trunk filler plate did you delete the evap canister and dmtl pump?
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