1 Series and the M

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by tbird

If you are headed out to work, or to the gym, or to the market, and you say to yourself "Golly gee, 4.1 seconds isn't good enough! I need a Lambo to go to the market." then yes, my point holds water. On a racetrack, yes, get a Lambo LP560-4 over the M3. For regular driving, if the M3 isn't good enough for you, then yes, you are a brat, and I stand behind that.

!

If you're headed out to work and think that 8 seconds 0-60 isn't good enough (as most of us do) that doesn't make you a brat, it makes you a performance car enthusiast. You've picked a certain mark to draw the line and you're saying that anyone who wants more is "spoiled" and that's a load of BS. People driving Prius and TDIs think 0-60 in 10 seconds is plenty, what would your reaction be to them calling you a brat because you own something that will do it in half that?


Your logic doesn't hold water at all.

[tbird]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

If you're headed out to work and think that 8 seconds 0-60 isn't good enough (as most of us do) that doesn't make you a brat, it makes you a performance car enthusiast. You've picked a certain mark to draw the line and you're saying that anyone who wants more is "spoiled" and that's a load of BS. People driving Prius and TDIs think 0-60 in 10 seconds is plenty, what would your reaction be to them calling you a brat because you own something that will do it in half that?


Your logic doesn't hold water at all.

That's not what I said. I said "4.1". My statement was that if 4.1 isn't fast enough, then you are a brat. If you need a Lambo to go to the market, then you are a brat.

Me, I have my 1, but when I go to the market, I go in my Focus. It is low 7's, and it has some dings and nicks, but you know what, I love that little car. I am in it more than I am in my 1, so I made it more comfortable, and I made it quicker without being stupid or wasteful. I am quite content in driving that to the market. Anyone else who does the same thing, if they are happy with their car that would do 7 seconds or 10 seconds, that's fine.

But with car enthusiasts, we keep asking for more, then getting more and then not being happy with it. "I want a sub-6 second car to go to the market.", then "I want a sub-5 second car to go to the market.", then "I want a sub-4 second car to go to the market.", when does it end? Do you need a freakin JATO Pack to go to the market.

My Point: 4.1 seconds 0-60, incredible handling, incredible sound, LOTS of bells and whistles. If this STILL isn't good enough, if the M3 is just too slow for you to get to the market, then.....THEN......you are a brat!

I mean, c'mon, 4.1 seconds 0-60. You are driving a beast, a monster, one hot car, and to have a car that beats probably 99.9% of the car market and you are driving it to pick up milk, freaking enjoy 4.1 second speed.

There are some people who are lucky to have a 12 second car. There are people who are lucky enough to even OWN any car. If you are so lucky as to own a M3, and can drive it on a daily basis, then learn to appreciate what you have, because one day, you might not have it.

I don't have an M3, can't afford it. I have a 1, and I don't feel bad at all. I am blessed to be able to afford my 1, and I say my thanks every single day. I am lucky to afford a decent commuter car, and I say my thanks every day.

Then there are people who say "WAAAAAAAAAH, boo hoo, I can only do 4.1 seconds 0-60 driving to the market!" Once again, if this is what you say, you are a brat! Be thankful you have anything at all!

[imported_mega]

I guess I'm a brat

but I would not trade my 135i for an m3, they are too big

[quality_sound]

Not to nit-pick but the M3 doesn't have DSG. VW patented the DSG and while the DCT in the M3 is very good and has a lot of the same quirks as the DSG I still prefer the DSG to the DCT. I would say it's the difference in power but my chipped 2.0T GTI makes more torque than the M3 so I dunno.

When I was looking at the M3 I drove both and I'd do the manual if I didn't like the 135 better.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by tbird

My Point: 4.1 seconds 0-60, incredible handling, incredible sound, LOTS of bells and whistles. If this STILL isn't good enough, if the M3 is just too slow for you to get to the market, then.....THEN......you are a brat!

!

And your point is stupid. You've picked a line in the sand that has no meaning whatsoever, and are making a judgement on anyone who wants to cross it.

As I said earlier, all the Prius and TDI drivers think that anyone who can't live with 10 seconds 0-60 are brats. That opinion is equally as dumb. If that's fast enough for you, then fine, but you look like a serious ass for passing judgement on people who want to go faster.

By your logic I guess all us people who are modifying 135s to go faster should just take what BMW gives us, consider ourselves lucky to have it, and leave it alone, or we're spoiled brats?


But, the real point here wasn't 0-60 times, it was weight, and when it comes to driving dynamics, weight has negative effects on much more than just accelleration. It hurts braking, handling, fuel consumption, and high speed stability. You can't overcome that kind of stuff with more HP.

[quality_sound]

Originally Posted by imported_mega

I guess I'm a brat

but I would not trade my 135i for an m3, they are too big

I agree. I drove them back to back and the M3 felt lethargic during day-to-day type driving and having driven watercooled VWs for a LONG time, that's saying something. Sure, the 135 is a pig too but but the M3 is like a hippopotomus. It CAN move, it just has to be properly motivated.

[BForbes]

Lets keep things a little more civilized guys.

Tbird, are you in south florida? I was in the Ft. Lauderdale test driving a car with a buddy and we saw a bunch of M3's blast down this abandoned road. They all had MPower on the side. I can guess what they were about to go do back there. Probably the same thing the very young salesmen asked us to do. It was pretty damn exciting. At least they gave you guys the cars to drive yourself. Mercedes had someone esle in the car at their AMG event.

[tbird]

I know for sure that I have a knack for explaining things to death. I certainly put myself into the class of 1Addicts people here who type entirely too much. I fully admit that.

But where am I failing in explaining my point? What am I missing here? Yes, there can be a debate on if 10 seconds is good enough, or 7 seconds, yes. My point, my sole point, was that 4.1 is absolutely plenty. Who needs to have a car that can go 0-60 in 1.3 seconds to go to the supermarket? When is enough....enough? Why am I unable to explain that point clearly enough?

I love the extra power in the 135, but when people say "The 135 doesn't have good enough suspension" or "it isn't fast enough", how does that make the 128 drivers feel? That's like telling them they all have cars like snails. Many simply can't afford the 135. I couldn't afford the 330i a while back, had to settle for the 325. It was slower than what I wanted, but hey, my wallet dictated. Now, I can afford the 135.

The 135 whips the vast majority of cars on the road today. It has plenty power, and I am glad to have it. If I lived near the Autobahn, or if I could afford to race my car on the track all the time, then I would need more. For those situations, a car enthusiast would want more. But for the love of God, to simply drive your car to pick up a gallon of milk and some bread, who would think that 4.1 seconds 0-60 is not enough? Porsche's used to have 90 hp, now they have nearly 10 times that amount. When is enough......enough? Car enthusiasts, yes, we are, I AM, I love speed and power. But there has to be a balance. Will we not be happy until cars can do 0-60 in 1.2 seconds and we all have JATO packs?

As for your weight comments, YES, I AGREE WITH YOU, I stated that before. Weight DOES matter! My "additional" comment was that weight in the M3 seemed to be handled well enough by the hp. I could easily feel the car's extra weight, but in the M3, it didn't seem to matter. When the car wanted to go, it did!

BForbes, yes, that was this very event. Apparently, they are touring with a bunch of cars and they give a mapped course through city streets for you to drive. You saw us participants driving. You were on SW 29th Ave, right? That was the one "open stretch" they allowed us on, and oh yes, we all blasted down it. Yes, the M3 has some issues, but for the most part, it is a blast to drive. Hands down it is on my list of lottery cars. Too bad you weren't there, would have been nice to meet one of the moderators. BUT you will be happy to know I got three more recruits to 1Addicts.com and that's always a good thing. When I see a 1, I make sure they know this site.

But you know what, if I won the lottery, I can honestly say I would simply make my 1 my daily driver and keep the M3 in the garage. I honestly love my 135.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by tbird

I My point, my sole point, was that 4.1 is absolutely plenty. Who needs to have a car that can go 0-60 in 1.3 seconds to go to the supermarket? .

Who needs a car that can go 0-60 in 5 seconds to go to the supermarket? Or even 8? Who are you to say what's plenty and then call anyone who wants more a "spoiled brat"?

The kind of cars we drive aren't about basic transportation, they're a luxury item and ment for enjoyment. As I said earlier, if you're happy with 0-60 in 4 seconds, that's fine. No one's telling you you need to run out and buy something faster, but there's no need to pass judgement on other people when you yourself are living well in excess of what you need.

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by tbird

BForbes, yes, that was this very event. Apparently, they are touring with a bunch of cars and they give a mapped course through city streets for you to drive. You saw us participants driving. You were on SW 29th Ave, right? That was the one "open stretch" they allowed us on, and oh yes, we all blasted down it. Yes, the M3 has some issues, but for the most part, it is a blast to drive. Hands down it is on my list of lottery cars. Too bad you weren't there, would have been nice to meet one of the moderators. BUT you will be happy to know I got three more recruits to 1Addicts.com and that's always a good thing. When I see a 1, I make sure they know this site.

Sweeet man! My friend was stalling a VW Rabbit at the light. I'm not sure which one it was. It was at the entrance of a dead business office center. There was a small overpass near it. I try to get recruits as well. I've dont a few crazy u-turns trying to chase down 1er drivers. I've done countless BMW events but that one just went over my head.

[tbird]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

Who needs a car that can go 0-60 in 5 seconds to go to the supermarket? Or even 8? Who are you to say what's plenty and then call anyone who wants more a "spoiled brat"?

The kind of cars we drive aren't about basic transportation, they're a luxury item and ment for enjoyment. As I said earlier, if you're happy with 0-60 in 4 seconds, that's fine. No one's telling you you need to run out and buy something faster, but there's no need to pass judgement on other people when you yourself are living well in excess of what you need.

Now you are saying what I have been saying all along, "Who needs a car that can go 0-60 in 5 seconds to go to the supermarket? Or even 8? " That has been my point all along.

For the luxury part, or for the people who are making their 1's into real track cars, with roll cages and such, YES, mod that baby out, have fun. Kick the crap out of other cars. With that 1 Series that was in the Australian GP exhibition (handicapped of course) and it won, I was jumping for joy!! My point was the people who complain that their car is not fast enough in going to the market.

When I see people complaining that their 1 is not fast enough, I feel for the 128 people who on numerous threads have said " I wish I could have a 135, but I couldn't afford it". I had a 325 because I couldn't afford the 330. So if I was a 128 owner and I hear these people saying that their 135 isn't good enough, I would be pissed. I'm kinda standing up for them a bit as well. The 128 is not as fast as the 135, but it is a damn good car and those drivers are smart enough to drive one!

As for living in excess, if I was doing that, I would be living in a monster McMansion and driving my LEASED M3. I could buy a 135 or lease a M3. I have a 135, that is not excess. I could go out and buy a used E36 and make that my commuter and live on the edge of my means in affording repairs. Nope. I drive a Ford Focus and I drive it the majority of the time. Trust me, that's not living in excess. That's living within my means.

So for the track, or of course for those who are lucky enough to take their babies on the Autobahn, or on some of the better Autostrada, or for those who know the special meaning of "The Stelvio Pass", mod up and enjoy.

For us normal people, live within your means, and be thankful for what we have, because all it takes is a couple of "dirty bombs" in Iraq and Saudi Arabia, and the majority of us will be selling our cars when gas hits $20/gallon

[tbird]

Originally Posted by BForbes

Sweeet man! My friend was stalling a VW Rabbit at the light. I'm not sure which one it was. It was at the entrance of a dead business office center. There was a small overpass near it. I try to get recruits as well. I've dont a few crazy u-turns trying to chase down 1er drivers. I've done countless BMW events but that one just went over my head.

Funny you say that. I was returning, and I was at a light at a new-but-empty little business park. I was headed back east on Marina Blvd, just before the I95 pass. At the light, a modded GTI was in front of me. He took off like a bullet and did a good job of zooming along, but once I got a bit ahead of him, he backed off and let me in. The M3 does command respect, no doubt about that beast.

Could that possibly have been me and your friend in the VW? That would be funny.

The event invite went to my mother's significant other who has the E92 M3. I have only driven it once, but I was behaving in it. He obviously loves his baby, and for good reason. But I did do some high speed passes in it, and from 60-100mph, it does get up and move. It does take some effort to wipe away the drool about the M3. The sound gets your heart revving.

But as always, I love my 135 vert. I literally get asked about it all the time, I will just hear someone behind me say "Do you like it?", and then we end up talking about the benefits of the 1 for 10 minutes or so.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by tbird

Now you are saying what I have been saying all along, "Who needs a car that can go 0-60 in 5 seconds to go to the supermarket? Or even 8? " That has been my point all along.

You don't really seem to have a point. If having something you don't need makes you a spoiled brat, and no one needs a car that will do 0-60 in 5 seconds...then what does that make all 135i owners?

[tbird]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

You don't really seem to have a point. If having something you don't need makes you a spoiled brat, and no one needs a car that will do 0-60 in 5 seconds...then what does that make all 135i owners?

Not what I said.

My point is clear.
Track Driving/Long Performance Runs/etc=Modding becomes a science, go for it.
Daily Drivers, driving to the market=Complaining that the car is not fast enough and need to take their $45K and spend $20K in mods to make it faster to get to the market quicker, THAT is a point of mine, and has been all along.

AND, this whole bit started on the point of not on the 1, but on the M3. My "original" point was that if a M3 is not good enough to go to the market in, THEN you have a serious issue. Way back in the beginning of this debate, that was my original point.

Someone goes out, buys a M3, mods it a bit, so that it will perform like a major beast on the track, ok, great, go for it. Take it to the track, and please please please beat every freakin Mustang out there (now THAT is bias, I admit to that one, Mustang lovers feel free to debate that point).

Someone goes out, buys a M3, then drives it to the market, then gets out and looks at their car and says "Geesh, that is just too slow to pick up groceries in, I better go buy a Lambo", THAT was my way-back-original point. THAT is the point of being a spoiled brat. If you need a Lambo to go to the market, you are a brat. If $75K car is not good enough for you, you need a $300K car to look good enough at the supermarket, THAT is being a brat.

As I have mentioned, I live in SoFL, so I happen to see this point on a daily basis. People live above their means, and can't be seen in public unless they take their $440,000 stainless steel Rolls Royce to the market, then drive back to their McMansion. We are in a recession. What helped to cause that, people living WAY above their means. Why did they do this? Because of the mentality that driving a $75K car to the market is not good enough. They need a $300K car, a $440K car, or they would be embarrased. "Keeping up with the Joneses" takes on a psychotic meaning here in FLL.

If people want to do that, that is their life, fine. BUT, when my house depreciates because the banks are insolvent because those "brats" sucked up the banks on their "2% for 2 years mortgages", and it affects me, then yes, I will call a brat a brat.

My mother's neighbor bought his house by borrowing the downpayment then doing two mortgages, then went out and bought a Maserati. He of course failed financially, he is fireselling his place, and it is plummeting my mother's house value. BRAT!

If you have a M3, be thankful and enjoy it. BMW wants you to drive it all over, so do so and enjoy it. Believe me, if I could get out of a M3 at the market, I sure as hell wouldn't be embarassed, no freakin way.

"Be thankful for what you have". That is self-explanatory. I can drool over the M3, but I love my 135.

Not sure how I can be any more explanatory. If $75K car isn't good enough for groceries, Brat.

Me, I'm currently headed out in my Focus to the grocery, and I feel fine. She's a good little cheapy car and does her job, protecting my 1 from getting dinged by the idiots who roll their grocery carts along and don't care who they hit. Every ding (and there are quite a few) on her is one less ding on my 1.

[imported_mega]

your not gonna pay 75k for an m3 right now, unless your dumb

I could have bought either, the m3 is not all that, I did not like it at all, it's just too big and it feels that way

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by tbird

Not what I said.

My point is clear.
.

If you say so.

Here's what you actually said earlier in the thread, which was mainly about weight recuction up until the point when you decided you needed to go on your rant.

Originally Posted by tbird

If you drive a E92 M3 and you complain that it is not fast enough, then you truly TRULY fall into the category of "Spoiled Rotten Never-Earned-Anything-In-Your-Life Brat" and you truly are wasting the oxygen out of the atmosphere we breathe. If you can't live with 4.1 seconds and you just desperately need to move from $75K price to $300K+ price to have a car that will do 3.6, you are a greedy little POS!

The weight is insignificant. If anything, it makes for a smoother highway ride, more stability in unstable conditions (rain, following 18-wheelers, etc). The M3 has plenty power to handle the weight.

How you managed to go from weight reduction into your problems with the housing market is beyond anything I'll ever understand, and with that I'm done with it.

[Robert]

Originally Posted by tbird

If you drive a E92 M3 and you complain that it is not fast enough, then you truly TRULY fall into the category of "Spoiled Rotten Never-Earned-Anything-In-Your-Life Brat" and you truly are wasting the oxygen out of the atmosphere we breathe. If you can't live with 4.1 seconds and you just desperately need to move from $75K price to $300K+ price to have a car that will do 3.6, you are a greedy little POS!

Think when most of us complained about the weight it is not in straight lane performance but more so in ability to change momentum at moments notice. 0-60,1/4 mile is easy to compensate with a big engine, the 225k jump from 4.1 to 3.5s is not solely on that 0.6s but also in the improved agility, the melodious exhaust notes that rivals a well synchronized orchestra, and the badge.

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by tbird

Funny you say that. I was returning, and I was at a light at a new-but-empty little business park. I was headed back east on Marina Blvd, just before the I95 pass. At the light, a modded GTI was in front of me. He took off like a bullet and did a good job of zooming along, but once I got a bit ahead of him, he backed off and let me in. The M3 does command respect, no doubt about that beast.

Could that possibly have been me and your friend in the VW? That would be funny.

The event invite went to my mother's significant other who has the E92 M3. I have only driven it once, but I was behaving in it. He obviously loves his baby, and for good reason. But I did do some high speed passes in it, and from 60-100mph, it does get up and move. It does take some effort to wipe away the drool about the M3. The sound gets your heart revving.

But as always, I love my 135 vert. I literally get asked about it all the time, I will just hear someone behind me say "Do you like it?", and then we end up talking about the benefits of the 1 for 10 minutes or so.

No sir. We were in a 2009 VW Rabbit. I'm glad you had a blast.

[tbird]

Originally Posted by BForbes

No sir. We were in a 2009 VW Rabbit. I'm glad you had a blast.

Oh well, that would have been funny.

Next time you are down here, PM me. We can hit FLL beach for a drink. As mentioned, it would be cool to meet a moderator, and of course to check out your 1.

[jmunro]

Ok maybe 2950 was a bit much to ask for. I think 3100lbs can be done for sure, though.