People who buy cars before they are out...

[mateo]

I'm stepping way out on a limb. I better like it, or I'm getting the 335i instead...:iono:

-Mateo

[LonghornTX]

Originally Posted by 1ster

I see you live in San Diego, Kurichan. Believe me: there are plenty of people in this country who think it's insane to live in California because of the incredibly high close of living (I think San Diego is an amazing city, BTW). But you live there anyway. Why? Obviously because you like it there and you're willing to pony up the bucks to be there instead of someplace else.

That's called subjective value preference. You're willing to pay through the nose to live in San Diego. Some of us are willing to pay MSRP for a 1-Series. Everybody here values different things differently. That's what makes the world a beautiful place. :thumbup:

This is a good perspective to look at it from IMO.

[Sixspeed J]

Originally Posted by LonghornTX

This is a good perspective to look at it from IMO.

I agree!

[335i=:)]

At my dealer, it's hard to get a good deal on a brand new car........anyway. Some dealers only sell new models for above invoice.

[inTgr8r]

You've got to pay to play; simple as that.

Not my game, but don't see anything wrong with it if it's your "thing"

[kurichan]

Originally Posted by Smokey

Kurichan says:
"You put down a deposit on a car you haven't even seen, and you're giving up leverage. They can see you drool."

Your argument rests on the assumption that people who have made deposits on the car cannot obtain quotes for the car from other dealerships and use the quotes as bargaining chips with the dealership holding their deposits.

That, my friend, is called "bad faith negotiation." In other words, it's unethical.

And it's not justified by the (mistaken in my book) belief that dealers are fundamentally unscrupulous.

[kurichan]

Originally Posted by 1ster

I see you live in San Diego, Kurichan. Believe me: there are plenty of people in this country who think it's insane to live in California because of the incredibly high cost of living (I think San Diego is an amazing city, BTW). But you live there anyway. Why? Obviously because you like it there and you're willing to pony up the bucks to be there instead of someplace else.

That's called subjective value preference. You're willing to pay through the nose to live in San Diego.

That's called a flawed syllogism. It sounds good, but if you look closely enough, it's plainly faulty logic.

It's also based on the assumption that you have any clue whatsoever why I live in San Diego.

A career in politics might be worth looking into though... :biggrin:

[kurichan]

Originally Posted by Khobin~

The whole idea that BMW is going to be trying to deal them off the lot within a couple months is rediculous. The only that would happen is if the car is a total flop.

No one stated, or even implied that...

Hell, even Mazda for the first 1-2 years when they brought out the 3, were hardly willing to budge at all on the pirce(at least the 5 different dealers I went to locally over the course that time) because the demand for it was there.

I think demand for the 1er will be limited, but I could be wrong...

As you said, it's a matter of supply and demand, if the demand that is apparently here now continues,

An enthusiast forum is NOT an indication of volume demand.

it will be a while before any "deals" will be had. If the demand isn't there, then sure, those that buy it right away will end up paying more, but personnally, if I love the car 1/2 as much as the one it's replacing, then I won't care, because either way I know what I'm prepared to pay for a 128, if the price is too high, I won't buy one, if it's where I want it, then I will, period.

Fair enough, but as you can probably guess, I maintain my original position.

[kurichan]

Originally Posted by mateo

I'm stepping way out on a limb. I better like it, or I'm getting the 335i instead...:iono:

-Mateo

Have you actually driven a 335i? I thought I was going to get one, until I drove it... Best to keep hoping that the 135i is great. I am.

[kurichan]

Sorry guys. I have just always had a thing about people making financially illogical decisions. I guess it's a pet peeve. And Americans seem to excel at it. Over something like cars and it amplifies for me. Just seems plain silly. But that's just my opinion.

[335i=:)]

maybe this is off topic but I would rather spend my time and energy making more money then saving a couple k. Given equal amounts of time spent on both, I know which will make me more/allow me to save more in the long run.

[1ster]

Originally Posted by kurichan

That's called a flawed syllogism. It sounds good, but if you look closely enough, it's plainly faulty logic.

It's also based on the assumption that you have any clue whatsoever why I live in San Diego.

I don't care why you live in San Diego. It's not relevant to my analogy unless you're imprisoned there and can't leave. My point is this: you choose to live someplace with a high cost of living when you could choose to live elsewhere. Maybe you have an awesome job there. Maybe you're the mayor. Maybe you have a sick relative to attend to. It still doesn't matter. You have a choice and, based on the overall benefit of living in San Diego, you choose to live there instead of somewhere else despite the high cost of living.

I'm not criticizing your decision. What I'm saying is that people value different things differently. Some people value (pending a test drive to confirm) the bundle of goods that the 1-Series offers highly enough to pay MSRP (pending confirmation of MSRP) for one. It's hard for me to see why you should care because it's not your money they're spending.

[ichiban]

all this talk about the price not being able to be lower than msrp on a brand new car untill maybe a year after is just stupid. The 1 series is a brand new platform that hasn't been established in the US, there are lots of interest around it concerning us car guys. But we are still a relatively small percentage compared to all the people that are looking at the 1er. When i looked at the infiniti G37S when it first came out, sure they were at MSRP, but after only 2 months, some forum members were saying they got as low as 1500 below MSRP. There were a lot of hype regarding the G37S and with motortrend's vote for the G instead of the 335i in their magazine it only heightened it. I dont know if the bimmer market is different than other makers in general since this will be my first. But i sure hope i'm right

[1ster]

I can find just as many counter-examples for you, though. Shelby GT 500, Corvette Z06, Honda Civic Si, Honda Fit (!!) ... all of these cars went for MSRP for at least the first year they were out. The Shelbys still go for more than sticker.

A lot of it will depend on how many cars BMW sends to the US. Is anyone aware of projected numbers?

[imported_MPower]

Originally Posted by 1ster

A lot of it will depend on how many cars BMW sends to the US. Is anyone aware of projected numbers?

I'd wager somewhere between 15-20,000 cars per year in the US. That's a little more than the Z4 and a pretty good ballpark for a first year new model.

[Smokey]

Originally Posted by kurichan

That, my friend, is called "bad faith negotiation." In other words, it's unethical.

And it's not justified by the (mistaken in my book) belief that dealers are fundamentally unscrupulous.

There is nothing unethical about it, my friend. So it is unethical to inform a dealership holding my deposit that there are other dealerships offering better deals on the 135i? I don't comprehend your logic! The money I placed on the car is mine and, to be frank with you, I can do whatever I like with it. You don't see me knocking you for choosing ED, which makes no sense to me unless you are doing it for the experience. But I am not going to take a week or two off to go to Europe just to save a couple of grand when I will end up losing more money from my business.

[imported_MPower]

Originally Posted by Smokey

There is nothing unethical about it, my friend. So it is unethical to inform a dealership holding my deposit that there are other dealerships offering better deals on the 135i? I don't comprehend your logic! The money I placed on the car is mine and, to be frank with you, I can do whatever I like with it. You don't see me knocking you for choosing ED, which makes no sense to me unless you are doing it for the experience. But I am not going to take a week or two off to go to Europe just to save a couple of grand when I will end up losing more money from my business.

The crux of this argument lies in the assumption that any deposit you put on a 135i allocation is nonrefundable. A refundable deposit, therefore, says nothing to the dealership "bagging" a client. Additionally, I agree with Smokey that there is nothing unethical about pinning dealerships against dealerships. Most of the deals that they make are highly unethical, anyway.

[ducati]

Originally Posted by emm3tt

I see all of these threads with folks who are on waiting lists, have already ordered cars, and have deposits down. Is this something that you do frequently? I can't grasp the concept of making a purchase as large as a car without driving, sitting in it, touching it, seeing it. Have you ever had buyers' remorse? :iono:

The only time I have done this is on a limited production model, my old Integra Type R. In fact, I bought it sight unseen, without ever taking a test drive or even sitting in one.

Never, EVER, had buyer's remorse on that one. There weren't many folks that got one who didn't do what I did.

If Honda brought the current JDM '08 Civic Type R, I'd buy that sight-unseen, too.

Any regular-production car, like a 135i or my current STI, I will wait until I can get what I feel is a fair deal, and then jump. I don't need to be the first one on the block to have a car. I can be the last one on the block, really, as long as I get the thing

[Smokey]

1ster says:
I don't care why you live in San Diego. It's not relevant to my analogy unless you're imprisoned there and can't leave.

Hahahaha.

[BtheMoneW]

The deposit is fully refundable and you will be able to check out the car in person and drive it before placing the order(at least thats how it works here in Dallas). Pretty much the only thing you'll be taking a risk in is color choice, but most of the colors are already available in other series so that shouldn't be that big of an issue.

[Brandon26pdx]

There'll be lots of hype and deals made at MSRP (or more) for a few months...maybe a half a year or so. This all reminds alot of when the Honda S2000 came out. You take any sporty niche car like this that's new and hot and plenty of people will line up at the door well beforehand to satisfy the Jones's. They were giving S2000's away a couple years into it.

It wont last forever though. I can see the 128's maintaining better sales figures over the long haul just because it will be priced more in line with what the average person would feel comforable affording for a nichy type car like this. (And it will be within the budget of many more of the youngsters compared to the 135's) The 135 will be the hot car of course, and the people who are dead set on one will have it quickly. After that it becomes more of a hard sell to the non car-buff crowd.

[135i_]

Originally Posted by emm3tt

I see all of these threads with folks who are on waiting lists, have already ordered cars, and have deposits down. Is this something that you do frequently? I can't grasp the concept of making a purchase as large as a car without driving, sitting in it, touching it, seeing it. Have you ever had buyers' remorse? :iono:

I have a better question:

Why do you care?