[bmwexecutive]

I know there's a big thread on this topic already (15 pages worth) but I actually just got a similar e-mail from my Sales Manager regarding the scores I gave them on the BMW after-sale survey. Funny thing because I received this e-mail several hours after I sent him an e-mail telling him I wanted to put down a deposit on an M3 Sedan. What do you guys think?

************************************************** ******
I am confused about the Customer Service report you gave to BMW about your experience with our dealership. After all we did for you--from meeting a low, low price to fielding numerous calls to setting up Performance Delivery to follow-up after-the-sale on your wheel & tire concerns--you hammer us on CSI.

We didn't deserve anything but 'Excellent' on that call. Your answers to BMW hurt us and were unfair and untrue.

Name
Sales manager
Dealership
************************************************** *******

MY RESPONSE

************************************************** *******
Name:

I myself am confused. To the best of my knowledge I rated you guys a 4 on nearly every question. I think I gave you a 5 on two of them and then one 3 for one of the questions. I was told the rating system was 5 being the best and 1 being the worst. Was this not correct?

Best,
Name
************************************************** *******

The thing I don't like most about his e-mail is that he's calling me a liar when he states the ratings I gave were "untrue."

[Ghunger]

It's been discussed ad nauseam (sp?) on the other thread but the 5=pass, 1,2,3,4=fail system they use is rediculous. That's how I'm going to look at though. A 5 excellent, 4 good, 3 average, 2 poor, 1 unacceptable, system would make sense but I guess we just have to play their game.

[325Driver]

It is unfortunate BMW NA (along with just about every other manufactuer) has adopted this rating system, but they have and there is not much we can do about it. As I understand it, unless you rate the dealership and the salesman excellent in every respect, they make very little if any money on the deal. To the dealer/salesman if you don't give a 5 then you might as well give a 1 as it really doesn't matter much after that.

I know every time my car is in for service my SA writes something to the extent of "Please give us 5's across the board" on the work order. Most times the service I get at Momentum warrants it, however there have been occasions when that is not the case but I have given 5's anyway and simply worked out the issue face to face with my SA.

[dejav0o]

It almost requires us to put 5s on all the scores.... but I the service better show that it's worthy of that score. My local dealer is horrid, and even after numerous complaints it still hasn't improved!!!!

[F32Fleet]

I'd forward the email to BMWNA because the tone used by the manager is inexcusable.

Another thing, if you want to really make the dealer pay for giving him poor service, give them all 3's/4's. The dealer is allowed to throw out the bottom X% of reviews, so giving them a mediocre review is worse than all 1's.

[JSpira]

They're right - you failed them and cost them on CSI money.

If you were happy with them overall, they should have gotten all 5's.

The way the system works is unfortunate, but it's been discussed so often and is common across all vehicle mfr's that it's pretty straight forward: it's either pass (5) or fail (4-3-2-1).

[RPM90]

They expect "exceptional" ratings on "average" service.
BMW needs to cut that system out. If I bring my car in for service and I get a "no problem found", they will never get a 5 rating, ever.

As far as the sale, they want the 5 to get the added bounus money.
The whole system has created "beggers" in my opinion as they stress how important it is to give them the highest and most perfect score.
You almost feel sorry for them. Since getting a 4 is considered as bad as a 1 why not just use a + - system where + means it all went as best as can be expected, and a - means you were not happy.

[txusa03]

it could also be that they fail to explain to them that anything less than 4 means fail...if that is the case, bmw screw themself with their cryptic rating system.

[gohawks23]

I give all 5's and use it as a negotiation factor...


I let them know they didn't deserve a 5 and I will bring it up when I need a favor!

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by JSpira

They're right - you failed them and cost them on CSI money.

If you were happy with them overall, they should have gotten all 5's.

The way the system works is unfortunate, but it's been discussed so often and is common across all vehicle mfr's that it's pretty straight forward: it's either pass (5) or fail (4-3-2-1).

If the customer didn't feel a 5 was deserved, then the dealer and/or staff failed themselves. Writing to a customer and chastising them for giving a less then perfect rating is quite pathetic.

[LEDZEP]

My CA always got all 5's. Service gets all 5's unless they piss me off. I purposely gave them a low score once, and then I told them why. My wife accidentally gave them a low score (because she thought 1-5 really meant 1-5, not 5 or zero). I apologized to them for that one, but they were a bit upset about it.

Here's the bottom line: If you want to have a relationship with your dealer, then always give them 5's and TALK to them if you feel like giving less. We can argue how stupid a system it is all day, but if you like your dealer at all you need to play the game.

[MoreCowbell]

Keep us posted. I want to know if there is any reply. This system is utterly ridiculous.

[JSpira]

Originally Posted by txusa03

it could also be that they fail to explain to them that anything less than 4 means fail...if that is the case, bmw screw themself with their cryptic rating system.

It's anything less than 5, not anything less than 4.

[Zenit77]

I once gave all [0]s to service department at DiFeo BMW in NJ - they suck! I never went back after that

[canucklion]

they should've made every question a "pass or fail" type of question, why bother with 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 and 0 if they don't even care about 4,3,2 and 1?? that's a lot of number wasted

[shadowcoder]

I don't see the BMW rating system are ridiculous. It's the dealers that have
misunderstood it. And in any case they should be trying and going
above and beyond for a 5 which is what BMW wants them to do. But they
don't want to do that, yet they want a 5. Wrong. It doesn't work like that.
And BMW's system has nothing wrong with it. Every rating system has a
reward/benefit attached to it depending on the rating grade. BMW has chosen
to not have a normalized reward across the board of 1-5 but have put a
higher weight on the 5. And that is correct since that is one of their ways
in making the dealers care for their customers and always push to do
excellent job. Don't blame BMW or the rating system. Blame the dealer who
has been educated and been told about this, but still chooses to go its own
way. There are dealers out that who strive for 5, give you 5, deserve 5 and
get 5. They are worth it because they "get it". And that's what sets them
apart from the rest. Not fair to change the system. They have the means,
the resources and everything they need to get a 5 so they better get on
with it. Simple.

[ChrisPA]

I just wonder how the majority of the BMW drivers out there (meaning those not on this forum) have a clue that a "5" is the only passing grade? When I bought my Audi (which I assume has a similar system), they did explain briefly that rating were important, but I had no clue the way things really work until I started frequenting these forums. I would've guessed a good rating is important, but not that a "4" is essentially a failing grade. Does the average buyer (non-forum reader) really give "5" scores routinely?

[BMW F22]

let's put it this way- if we were salesmen and want all 5's, how would it make us feel if we get less than that? Especially when we think we deserve 5's. THat's the reason why salesmen ask to see what else they can do to get all 5's. Sometimes it's hard to see what you've done wrong unless you look at it from another point of view.


Honestly though, I see no reason for giving them less than 5's unless they were being dicks throughout the entire process. Dont punish them for one or two little mistakes. No negotiation process is perfect unless you just walk in and pay MSRP for the car.

One thing I really hate is the fact that some people would actually tell their friends that they got a better deal than they really did. It makes them look good because they were able to get a better deal. Their friends, in turn, get pissed at the dealership for "ripping them off" so they decide to give the dealer bad CSI scores.

Bottom line: GIVE THEM ALL 5's UNLESS THEY WERE DICKS THE ENTIRE TIME!!

[ga-bmwdrvr]

Originally Posted by BMWE90

let's put it this way- if we were salesmen and want all 5's, how would it make us feel if we get less than that? Especially when we think we deserve 5's. THat's the reason why salesmen ask to see what else they can do to get all 5's. Sometimes it's hard to see what you've done wrong unless you look at it from another point of view.


Honestly though, I see no reason for giving them less than 5's unless they were being dicks throughout the entire process. Dont punish them for one or two little mistakes. No negotiation process is perfect unless you just walk in and pay MSRP for the car.

One thing I really hate is the fact that some people would actually tell their friends that they got a better deal than they really did. It makes them look good because they were able to get a better deal. Their friends, in turn, get pissed at the dealership for "ripping them off" so they decide to give the dealer bad CSI scores.

Bottom line: GIVE THEM ALL 5's UNLESS THEY WERE DICKS THE ENTIRE TIME!!

I have to agree with this. I have been dealing with the same dealership for about four years and always gave them fives. On one occasion I gave them low scores because the mechanic left a bunch of grease stains in my interior. The OWNER called and asked how the service was (not why the low scores) and I told her what happened. She apologized and assured me things would be fixed. That's good service. They've always treated me well and I think part of it has been a give/take realationship.

[1sic06e90]

man i wish my dealership would of had the balls to do that to me .id be so pissed.who are they to waste your time with

[luckystrike]

is this rating only for the US does europe have the same arrangement?

[luckystrike]

i dont think its your fault for not giving him 5s., they should have inform you the process and ask you what they can do to achieve that score., how ca e know that giving them 4 is a failing mark? unless they told you right.