CS Deals, Steals, and Three-yulls on Wheels!

trendy26 · 07-11-2019, 08:25 AM

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Originally Posted by Tonyfsu21

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Originally Posted by trendy26

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Originally Posted by TAL2GK

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Originally Posted by jmg

The lease residuals are based on MSRP which means you will be paying much much less than if you purchased and sold down the line. If you leased and decided to sell the car down the line because the depreciation was much lower than expected, you still can. However, you would be SOL if you leased and the market depreciation turns out to be worse than the lease depreciation. You would be making a bet with a very small reward and a lot of risk.

The lease residuals are based on MSRP, which also means your buyout at lease end is also based on MSRP. So if you plan on keeping this vehicle long term, that killer deal you negotiated or fell into is essentially gone at lease end.

All that leasing does is allow people to get into cars at cheaper payments than if they financed the same vehicle. That's because they're only paying for the portion of the cars life they are using. If you prefer to buy and hold, like I do, then you'll have the benefit of upfront negotiations forever, but you won't have to pay the bank or BMW FS the privilege of borrowing money. Yes, I know The opportunity cost of tying up money, but operating debt free is a better chance at long term wealth preservation.

My question originally was to try and uncover some kind of overwhelming incentive from BMW. Maybe they create that by inflating their residual percentages allowing all the leasers to have cheap payments. But if you planned on keeping the vehicle, you'll be paying for that inflated residual at buyout time.

The residuals are actually set pretty accurately for the ///M cars in general (2,3, and 4 series atleast) so I'd say that 57% value retention after 3 years is pretty spot on for a CS so long as it wasn't loaded up with options such as CCB's, performance exhaust, etc.

In other words, the $104K - $107K CS's should hold their value just fine. It's the $110K and up MSRP's that are going to get killed from a Residual perspective.

Case in point, I've had my M4CS for a little over a month and a local dealer already offered to buy my car above what my current Buyout is. Given I got a $30K discount on the car from the dealer I purchased from, but to be in an equity position on the car right off the bat, I'd say that's pretty good.

For reference, I've kept other ///M cars until lease end and instead of turning the car in, I ended up selling the car to a dealer and pocketing cash from it. Again, I'd say BMW is pretty damn good about their residuals.

You sold your CS already? I just got mine this afternoon and freaking love it!

Nope, still have it. I'm open to transferring the lease to someone, but by no means am in any rush.

Best car I've ever owned!

Glad you got that BS tax stuff worked out!

Merlin_83 · 07-11-2019, 08:59 AM

Interesting, why so many of the M3 CS ?

Besides costing more than $100,000 - is it just in a weird pricing category ?

I mean you have to really want the CS version to pay so much.

f80er · 07-11-2019, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3GymNut

Financing is not a bad idea if you do the select plan or the payment saver from penfed. At the end of the 4 or 5yr term when you reach your balloon payment the vehicle (one like this one that will keep its value) will be worth more than the balloon payment. So financing is not out of the question if you want to put a down as well.

Sure but who the hell keeps a car that long?!

M3GymNut · 07-11-2019, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f80er

Sure but who the hell keeps a car that long?!

4yrs is a long time? That's not that long, just 1 more than a typical lease.

spool twice · 07-11-2019, 11:31 AM

Financing does make sense from an interest rate perspective.

On a lease, you are paying that MF on the Net Cap Cost + the residual.

In my case, my net capital cost = 77,756
My residual is 60,274

add them up $138,030. My 3.96% interest just became 3.96% interest on $138,030 and not on $77,756 or even the total depreciation amount $17,781. Total "rent charge" (aka interest) is $8,248, and if you take that rent charge amount in comparison to the actual fee of the car ($17,781), the effective interest rate is about 27.11%...

New2Roundel · 07-11-2019, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merlin_83

Interesting, why so many of the M3 CS ?

Besides costing more than $100,000 - is it just in a weird pricing category ?

I mean you have to really want the CS version to pay so much.

I think the average person feels that anything beyond the competition package cars is overpriced for an M3/4. I don't recall any of the higher end version of the F8x cars getting really great review either---which certainly doesn't help things. Once you get to ~$100k, the options for new and used performance cars are substantial. Seems like the CS and GTS are really for the hardcore BMW folks. For me, if I had $100k burning a hole in my pocket an automatic F8x would not be in contention. My interest quickly ends once you get past $75k for these cars.

f80er · 07-11-2019, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3GymNut

4yrs is a long time? That's not that long, just 1 more than a typical lease.

Yes and a lot of people who lease these cars get out of them in favor of a newer one, myself included. 2 M3s in the span of 3 years. There are guys here who are on 3rd and 4th cars.

Clark_Kent · 07-11-2019, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f80er

Yes and a lot of people who lease these cars get out of them in favor of a newer one, myself included. 2 M3s in the span of 3 years. There are guys here who are on 3rd and 4th cars.

+1. Same. 3 M3s in 39 months. It's not uncommon around here at all.

jmg · 07-11-2019, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spool twice

Financing does make sense from an interest rate perspective.

On a lease, you are paying that MF on the Net Cap Cost + the residual.

In my case, my net capital cost = 77,756
My residual is 60,274

add them up $138,030. My 3.96% interest just became 3.96% interest on $138,030 and not on $77,756 or even the total depreciation amount $17,781. Total "rent charge" (aka interest) is $8,248, and if you take that rent charge amount in comparison to the actual fee of the car ($17,781), the effective interest rate is about 27.11%...

I think in terms of 36 months. That's the longest I would plan on keeping any M car. If you can finance for a 36 month this might offset the optimistic RV of the lease because you would be paying less interest. However, your monthly payment will be more than double that of a lease. Not many people can swing that comfortably. You could take out a 60 month loan, but then your principle balance might still be in the red in 36 months.

L1FHR · 07-11-2019, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New2Roundel

I think the average person feels that anything beyond the competition package cars is overpriced for an M3/4. I don't recall any of the higher end version of the F8x cars getting really great review either---which certainly doesn't help things. Once you get to ~$100k, the options for new and used performance cars are substantial. Seems like the CS and GTS are really for the hardcore BMW folks. For me, if I had $100k burning a hole in my pocket an automatic F8x would not be in contention. My interest quickly ends once you get past $75k for these cars.

That's so true. Plus the new M3 G series will be available in a year or two so why bother buying a F8X series for $100K+ LOL.
I can get a Porsche or a use Lambo or R8 for that kind of money.
M3 shouldn't cost more than $75k-80k. If it's over $100k I rather buy a M5.

Clark_Kent · 07-11-2019, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmg

I think in terms of 36 months. That's the longest I would plan on keeping any M car. If you can finance for a 36 month this might offset the optimistic RV of the lease because you would be paying less interest. However, your monthly payment will be more than double that of a lease. Not many people can swing that comfortably. You could take out a 60 month loan, but then your principle balance might still be in the red in 36 months.

You can insulate yourself from this exposure if you negotiate very well on the front end. I took out a balloon loan on my first M3 and a 72 month loan on my second and "made money" when I disposed of both within 24 months of ownership.

IB M · 07-11-2019, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by L1FHR

Quote:

Originally Posted by New2Roundel

I think the average person feels that anything beyond the competition package cars is overpriced for an M3/4. I don't recall any of the higher end version of the F8x cars getting really great review either---which certainly doesn't help things. Once you get to ~$100k, the options for new and used performance cars are substantial. Seems like the CS and GTS are really for the hardcore BMW folks. For me, if I had $100k burning a hole in my pocket an automatic F8x would not be in contention. My interest quickly ends once you get past $75k for these cars.

That's so true. Plus the new M3 G series will be available in a year or two so why bother buying a F8X series for $100K+ LOL.
I can get a Porsche or a use Lambo or R8 for that kind of money.
M3 shouldn't cost more than $75k-80k. If it's over $100k I rather buy a M5.

Hate to bite on this hook
but FYI most folks bought the CS for less than many paid for a ZCP.

Also separate the CS and GTS into totally different categories. The CS is way more usable as a daily driver with less stiff suspension, higher front splitter and seating for 4 plus the 3CS has 4 doors. The GTS is a track focused car and much harder as a daily driver.

spazzyfry123 · 07-11-2019, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IB M

Hate to bite on this hook
but FYI most folks bought the CS for less than many paid for a ZCP.

Say wha???

I’m interested in numbers.

rmizzle101 · 07-11-2019, 07:55 PM

Opinion on killer deals for the few brand new CS's left on the market? Potentially looking to grab one

IB M · 07-12-2019, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

Quote:

Originally Posted by IB M

Hate to bite on this hook
but FYI most folks bought the CS for less than many paid for a ZCP.

Say wha???

I’m interested in numbers.

Yeah true maybe a bit of an overstatement. Don't have a lot of data but look at the few CS lease takeovers listed in the $800s, with ZCP lease takeovers same or higher.
CS cars were going for $15k to $18k off in the end which put them around $84-87k which isn't too far from a 2016 or 2017 loaded up ZCP with a typical 10% discount.

ckortane · 07-12-2019, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

Quote:

Originally Posted by E36 PWR

Anybody looked into this demo M3CS? What would be a good deal on it?

https://www.bmwofpeoria.com/inventor...8m9c58j5l71892

In my opinion there would be no good deal on this because you can't lease it. As I mentioned before, I would not recommend buying this vehicle. Lease is the only game in town. If buyout at lease end becomes a viable endeavor then you could pursue a purchase at that point but not today. Explore lease transfer options.

I talked to them and they actually got an extension from bmw to lease - but that option ended last week (monday or Tuesday)
I was able to get 20% off which included rebates which would of been a pretty good lease deal. If they had done 20% off plus the incentives I would of pulled the trigger.

But now I believe they can't lease unless of course bmw gives them another exception. I'm assuming they got the exception as a deal fell through at last minute and paperwork had potentially been started with bmw.

Merlin_83 · 07-12-2019, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

Say wha???

I’m interested in numbers.

Me too, how in the world would BMW sell a CS for less than a ZCP?

I'm confused

kerrit · 07-12-2019, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IB M

Hate to bite on this hook
but FYI most folks bought the CS for less than many paid for a ZCP.

Also separate the CS and GTS into totally different categories. The CS is way more usable as a daily driver with less stiff suspension, higher front splitter and seating for 4 plus the 3CS has 4 doors. The GTS is a track focused car and much harder as a daily driver.

how are people finding the CS that cheap?

IB M · 07-12-2019, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerrit

Quote:

Originally Posted by IB M

Hate to bite on this hook
but FYI most folks bought the CS for less than many paid for a ZCP.

Also separate the CS and GTS into totally different categories. The CS is way more usable as a daily driver with less stiff suspension, higher front splitter and seating for 4 plus the 3CS has 4 doors. The GTS is a track focused car and much harder as a daily driver.

how are people finding the CS that cheap?

A lot of calling around and a willingness to buy from out of state. Some dealers blew them out, other dealers wanted top dollar.

M3GymNut · 07-12-2019, 03:15 PM

Need some advice from the M3/M4 CS crew. Negotiating 2020 LRG CS with CCB's. From $119k to $91k. monthly payment in the mid 700's. What do you guys think? Possibility of going lower?

Andrae26 · 07-12-2019, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3GymNut

Need some advice from the M3/M4 CS crew. Negotiating 2020 LRG CS with CCB's. From $119k to $91k. monthly payment in the mid 700's. What do you guys think? Possibility of going lower?

Money down? If not, that's a great deal.

spool twice · 07-12-2019, 03:20 PM

try lower, you never know, but thats a great deal if you can't get it any lower.

07-11-2019, 08:59 AM	#992
Merlin_83 Merlin 474 Rep 730 Posts Drives: 2012 BMW M3 6MT w/ZCP Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: United States iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW M3 ZCP [0.00] 2008 BMW 335i [0.00] 2008 BMW 335xi [0.00]	Interesting, why so many of the M3 CS ? Besides costing more than $100,000 - is it just in a weird pricing category ? I mean you have to really want the CS version to pay so much. __________________ 2012 E92 M3 ZCP \| 2008 E90 335xi \| 2008 E90 335i \|
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07-11-2019, 11:31 AM	#995
spool twice Rainbow Racer 1008 Rep 2,539 Posts Drives: BMW M4cs Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Tampa Bay, FL Area iTrader: (7) Garage List 2019 M4cs [0.00]	Financing does make sense from an interest rate perspective. On a lease, you are paying that MF on the Net Cap Cost + the residual. In my case, my net capital cost = 77,756 My residual is 60,274 add them up $138,030. My 3.96% interest just became 3.96% interest on $138,030 and not on $77,756 or even the total depreciation amount $17,781. Total "rent charge" (aka interest) is $8,248, and if you take that rent charge amount in comparison to the actual fee of the car ($17,781), the effective interest rate is about 27.11%... __________________ -Loe P.- Prior Car:'14 Audi S5 3.0t DSG [ APR ECU/TCU \| Pullies + basic bolt-on mods \| 10.861@127.90mph ] Current Car: F82 M4cs \| TT-RS \| On Order: i4 M50
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07-11-2019, 07:55 PM	#1004
rmizzle101 First Lieutenant 157 Rep 367 Posts Drives: 2016 YMB M4 Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: Fresno iTrader: (0)	Opinion on killer deals for the few brand new CS's left on the market? Potentially looking to grab one
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07-12-2019, 03:15 PM	#1010
M3GymNut Major 908 Rep 1,211 Posts Drives: 2021 M3Comp Join Date: Oct 2017 Location: Miami, FL iTrader: (0)	Need some advice from the M3/M4 CS crew. Negotiating 2020 LRG CS with CCB's. From $119k to $91k. monthly payment in the mid 700's. What do you guys think? Possibility of going lower?
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07-12-2019, 03:20 PM	#1012
spool twice Rainbow Racer 1008 Rep 2,539 Posts Drives: BMW M4cs Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Tampa Bay, FL Area iTrader: (7) Garage List 2019 M4cs [0.00]	try lower, you never know, but thats a great deal if you can't get it any lower. __________________ -Loe P.- Prior Car:'14 Audi S5 3.0t DSG [ APR ECU/TCU \| Pullies + basic bolt-on mods \| 10.861@127.90mph ] Current Car: F82 M4cs \| TT-RS \| On Order: i4 M50
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