Best coilovers in the 1500-2k range

[mfindigital]

Hi Everyone,

So I'm done with power mods, for now and am ready to make this thing handle correctly.

I'm looking at a range of about 1500-2000$ for the coilovers. I want as minimal of a drop as possible, car is already so damn low that I scrap all over the place.

Performance wise, I'm looking for a very capable sport driving focused setup that can be used on road/backroad/track without compromise that doesn't sacrifice comfort.

Right now I'm looking at the KW V1, V2, Bilstein B16. Any other recommendations?

[asbrr]

Originally Posted by mfindigital

Hi Everyone,

So I'm done with power mods, for now and am ready to make this thing handle correctly.

I'm looking at a range of about 1500-2000$ for the coilovers. I want as minimal of a drop as possible, car is already so damn low that I scrap all over the place.

Performance wise, I'm looking for a very capable sport driving focused setup that can be used on road/backroad/track without compromise that doesn't sacrifice comfort.

Right now I'm looking at the KW V1, V2, Bilstein B16. Any other recommendations?

Check out the ST line, they are owned by KW but a more budget focused setup. YOu can probably get adjustable dampening for the price of a KW V1 I think...

[Driven5]

Have you considered YCW? I can't speak to the actual product quite yet, as my completely custom spec'd set is still in line to be built, but so far they've been top notch to work with.

[mfindigital]

Originally Posted by asbrr

Check out the ST line, they are owned by KW but a more budget focused setup. YOu can probably get adjustable dampening for the price of a KW V1 I think...

I've read everything is exactly the same between the two kits except body material of the KW won't rust. I live in Los Angeles so that's no worry. Are these very high quality coilovers as far as ride and dampening go? I want something high quality, I might spring for Ohlins if none of the other sets provide comfortable street driving.

[Driven5]

One of the reasons YCW won my business for spec'ing out my attempt at a (minimal drop) daily drivable fast road and light track use suspension, is their standard use of double (compression and rebound) digressive pistons. This allows higher low speed damping for good handling, as well as lower high speed damping for good ride. They also don't go overkill on rebound damping, which may not 'feel' as fast, but is actually better for both ride and handling.

[asbrr]

Originally Posted by mfindigital

I've read everything is exactly the same between the two kits except body material of the KW won't rust. I live in Los Angeles so that's no worry. Are these very high quality coilovers as far as ride and dampening go? I want something high quality, I might spring for Ohlins if none of the other sets provide comfortable street driving.

Hm - can't say I've read too much about comfort specific ride characteristics, but if you found the KWs are quality then likely the STs are similar (there are different "levels" of ST, get the one that matches the KWs you're looking at).

Other than that, I think the consensus is the 1 series specific Ohlins R&T (they just came out with it like a year ago, before the M3 kit was being sold for the 1 series platform but wasn't a great match) kit is a nice quality and nice riding kit (the DFV dampers can provide this good balance). I can't comment on the YCW stuff as the other poster states....it may be an option but is expensive. I know a few folks have spoke with Barry Battle @ 3DM Motorsports, he can customize the Ohlins kit with a specific spring rate set of Swift springs to match your use case. Also Harold @ HPA is very knowledgeable and can speak to both Ohlins and other kits.

Others have had good results with Koni FSD (of wahtever they are called now) but they are not meant for lowering springs....


EDIT: I forgot to mention, if you're on stock/old/tired suspension, part of your scraping issue is likely due to worn dampers, where the suspension collapses/compresses fully when you hit a speed bump for example. With new dampers and even the same height you might be ok depending on where you are scraping. But of course, coilovers will solve it one way or another.

[Driven5]

Originally Posted by asbrr

I can't comment on the YCW stuff as the other poster states....it may be an option but is expensive.

Define expensive. List price on their website for what I ordered was $1650, but just by emailing for a quote I paid less than $1500 to my door. In fact I spent a bunch of time planning out a non-standard Koni/Eibach setup, but realized that after adding Dinan plates and all the miscellaneous mounts and stuff needed to install as complete replacement units, I could get something built directly to my specs for ultimately not much more.

[mfindigital]

Originally Posted by Driven5

Define expensive. List price on their website for what I ordered was $1650, but just by emailing for a quote I paid less than $1500 to my door. In fact I spent a bunch of time planning out a non-standard Koni/Eibach setup, but realized that after adding Dinan plates and all the miscellaneous mounts and stuff needed to install as complete replacement units, I could get something built directly to my specs for ultimately not much more.

What was the turnaround time on these?

[asbrr]

Originally Posted by Driven5

Define expensive. List price on their website for what I ordered was $1650, but just by emailing for a quote I paid less than $1500 to my door. In fact I spent a bunch of time planning out a non-standard Koni/Eibach setup, but realized that after adding Dinan plates and all the miscellaneous mounts and stuff needed to install as complete replacement units, I could get something built directly to my specs for ultimately not much more.

My bad - I was under the impression these were much more money.

[PcarDefector]

Originally Posted by Driven5

One of the reasons YCW won my business for spec'ing out my attempt at a (minimal drop) daily drivable fast road and light track use suspension, is their standard use of double (compression and rebound) digressive pistons. This allows higher low speed damping for good handling, as well as lower high speed damping for good ride. They also don't go overkill on rebound damping, which may not 'feel' as fast, but is actually better for both ride and handling.

Thanks for the info on YCW.

Which valving and spring rate did you get?

[Driven5]

Originally Posted by mfindigital

What was the turnaround time on these?

I ordered mid December. Based on my discussions with them, and factoring for the holidays, I expect it should be on its way soonish.

Originally Posted by asbrr

My bad - I was under the impression these were much more money.

I think most of what I've seen around here was for their "Reference" valving, which is probably what you were thinking of. It includes use of more accurate calculations in setting valving targets, generally a little firmer valving, some options to narrow and more finely tune the range of adjustability, and an included rebuild/revalve. List on those was like $2450, and I think my quote was a little over $2k delivered. If I wanted to be more serious about track use, I might have been able to justify it. However, I figure their base 'Aeris' valving is already going to be more dialed in than a set of OTS Koni's. So that's what I went with.

Originally Posted by PcarDefector

Which valving and spring rate did you get?

They call it Aeris. Basically, the target is 65% critical (low speed) damping at the middle rebound adjustment setting. I'll detail it all out when I can actually start doing a proper review of these, but long story short I went with 5 kg/mm front and 18 kg/mm rear spring rates for my E88 128i... However, there are a few very important caveats to this.

First being that this would probably use more like a 5 kg/mm front and 15 kg/mm rear spring on an E82 to achieve similar ride rates.

Next being that I had to change the damper body and shaft lengths called out. Based on my math, I wouldn't go less than 6 kg/mm on the body and shaft used in their 'standard' E8X/E9X setup, which just so happens to be their baseline spring rate. I also changed the rear body/shaft lengths, but that's more of a secondary concern to prevent coil bind with the springs I chose.

Last being that the body and shaft length changes reduces the lowering potential, which is why they went to the 6 kg/mm setup for the general (coilovers = lowering) public. IF my math and measurements all work out correctly, I still won't be able to lower more than maybe .5 inch or so...And if not, it's possible I'll be stuck at slightly higher than stock (sport) ride height.

I did also make a compromise on front spring length in the name of wheel/tire fitment, that I'll detail the in my final review as well. This is something I may or may not change once I've had a chance to actually test-fit everything.

[tsk94]

ST XTA's, hands down.

[sibanez]

Redshift Motorsports rebuilds BC Coilovers with Bilstein components. Paired with Swift springs, you are getting struts and shocks that are much closer to Penske or Moton than you expect. Several national winning autocross and time trial winning drivers use them.

All in, I’m at $1650 for my setup. https://store.redshiftmotorsports.com/

I co-drove a WRX with Motons and these are really close. Chris, the owner, revolves them based on your car and weight, they are magical. My friend trophies in CSP with these, says these are worth over a second.

[PcarDefector]

Originally Posted by Driven5

I ordered mid-late December. Based on my discussions with them, and factoring for the holidays, I expect it should be on its way soonish.

I think most of what I've seen around here was for their "Reference" valving, which is probably what you were thinking of. It includes use of more accurate calculations in setting valving targets, generally a little firmer valving, some options to narrow and more finely tune the range of adjustability, and an included rebuild/revalve. List on those was like $2450, and I think my quote was a little over $2k delivered. If I wanted to be more serious about track use, I might have been able to justify it. However, I figure their base 'Aeris' valving is already going to be more dialed in than a set of OTS Koni's. So that's what I went with.

They call it Aeris. Basically, the target is 65% critical (low speed) damping at the middle rebound adjustment setting. I'll detail it all out when I can actually start doing a proper review of these, but long story short I went with 5 kg/mm front and 18 kg/mm rear spring rates for my E88 128i... However, there are a few very important caveats to this.

First being that this would probably use more like a 5 kg/mm front and 15 kg/mm rear spring on an E82 to achieve similar ride rates.

Next being that I had to change the damper body and shaft lengths called out. Based on my math, I wouldn't go less than 6 kg/mm on the body and shaft used in their 'standard' E8X/E9X setup, which just so happens to be their baseline spring rate. I also changed the rear body/shaft lengths, but that's more of a secondary concern to prevent coil bind with the springs I chose.

Last being that the body and shaft length changes reduces the lowering potential, which is why they went to the 6 kg/mm setup for the general (coilovers = lowering) public. IF my math and measurements all work out correctly, I still won't be able to lower more than maybe .5 inch or so...And if not, it's possible I'll be stuck at slightly higher than stock (sport) ride height.

I did also make a compromise on front spring length in the name of wheel/tire fitment, that I'll detail the in my final review as well. This is something I may or may not change once I've had a chance to actually test-fit everything.

Thanks very much for your detailed feedback.

I was leaning towards the Reference but it sounds the Aeris would be a better choice for a street car that does some track duty. And 5/15 was what I was thinking based on comments on the front/rear ratio/balance.

I didn't see what options were available for body length. I would prefer more of a drop than you, maybe 1.25-1.5" in total over stock. I'm currently at about an inch lower with BMWPS springs.

[Driven5]

Redshift seems great too, although I'd tend to consider their tuning philosophy better suited to a streetable track suspension than a trackable street suspension.

The fundamental problem with our front suspension design (beyond being struts) is that it's compromised by multiple interrelated packaging constraints, which all need to be pretty tightly balanced. Focus too much on any one thing, and others get thrown out of wack. I originally wanted to run 4/14 spring rates at stock 'sport' ride height, but I don't think that would be likely without going to something akin to stock non-sport ride height. Well, I guess it would be possible, but it would be slamming into the bump stops or coil binding half the time. The same goes for moderate lowering from stock sport ride height with 5 kg/mm springs up front.

We'll see how my rough measurements and math compare to the real world results, but if I end up being at least close, I don't think it's probable to get a good functioning 2-piece (adjustable length) style damper body to provide decent travel functionality at moderately lowered ride height, without going to at least 6 kg/mm springs in the front. The OD threaded damper bodies plus ID threaded mounts simply aren't small enough in diameter to allow the end of the damper to extend through into the spindle mount... Which would be necessary to get both more travel and more lowering.

Solid body dampers could potentially be built like this, but even then still need the body length and shaft travel sized according to the specific desired ride height and spring rates, and vice versa... But I'm not sure whether or not any on the market will actually do moderate lowering with 5 kg/mm springs and decent travel either. I know some of the Ohlins guys did run into some coil binding issues as they tried to balance it all out too.

[dleccord]

Originally Posted by asbrr

Hm - can't say I've read too much about comfort specific ride characteristics, but if you found the KWs are quality then likely the STs are similar (there are different "levels" of ST, get the one that matches the KWs you're looking at).

Other than that, I think the consensus is the 1 series specific Ohlins R&T (they just came out with it like a year ago, before the M3 kit was being sold for the 1 series platform but wasn't a great match) kit is a nice quality and nice riding kit (the DFV dampers can provide this good balance). I can't comment on the YCW stuff as the other poster states....it may be an option but is expensive. I know a few folks have spoke with Barry Battle @ 3DM Motorsports, he can customize the Ohlins kit with a specific spring rate set of Swift springs to match your use case. Also Harold @ HPA is very knowledgeable and can speak to both Ohlins and other kits.

Others have had good results with Koni FSD (of wahtever they are called now) but they are not meant for lowering springs....


EDIT: I forgot to mention, if you're on stock/old/tired suspension, part of your scraping issue is likely due to worn dampers, where the suspension collapses/compresses fully when you hit a speed bump for example. With new dampers and even the same height you might be ok depending on where you are scraping. But of course, coilovers will solve it one way or another.

I thought springs control the height of cars and dampers keep the springs under control. If the car is scraping shouldn’t it be the springs and the spring pads that collapse over time?

[asbrr]

Originally Posted by dleccord

I thought springs control the height of cars and dampers keep the springs under control. If the car is scraping shouldn’t it be the springs and the spring pads that collapse over time?

You're right, but what I mean is if the dampers are tired/worn, when there is a sudden compression motion like coming off a bump, the damper will help "slow down" that compression in a smooth and controlled way. If the damper is dead, there's more chance of you using up all the travel for even small impacts like a speed bump = more chance of scraping.

Last but not least, the strut mounts do compress over time, so on a tired/worn suspension you're actually losing ground clearance/ride height if the strut mount is compressed. So when you replace dampers, you should really look to rebuild the entire strut assembly and replace top mounts, all the small spring pads and hardware (it's relatively cheap stuff).

[wantmymoneyincash]

Originally Posted by tsk94

ST XTA's, hands down.

Care to expand on this, really looking at these.

[tsk94]

Originally Posted by wantmymoneyincash

Care to expand on this, really looking at these.

You have a KW damper, in a slightly less fancy body. So you get the performance and reliability of KW in a cheaper option. It comes single rebound adjustable, with linear springs and a camber plate - all for ~1400$. Nothing comes close to the bang for the buck of these.

[Driven5]

I can't speak to things like durability and longevity, but from a technical standpoint I don't see anything that makes XTA appear overall even as good (let alone better) of a value as some of the other options out there. While not 'bad' per se, especially compared to some of the crap out there, none of the KW shock dynos that I have seen make me particularly desire a set either.

Originally Posted by Driven5

I ordered mid December. Based on my discussions with them, and factoring for the holidays, I expect it should be on its way soonish.

The tracking number was created the day after I posted this, and the shipment picked up by FedEx the following day. Scheduled to arrive by Wednesday, but is already at the local sorting facility...So possibly sooner.

Edit: Definitely sooner...Delivered!

[mfindigital]

Originally Posted by Driven5

Redshift seems great too, although I'd tend to consider their tuning philosophy better suited to a streetable track suspension than a trackable street suspension.

I know some of the Ohlins guys did run into some coil binding issues as they tried to balance it all out too.

This is my fear, I have no interest in a hardcore race setup, or a racing coil over tuned for the street. I want a high performance coilover with OEM level comfort (which isn't that high in our cars stock to be honest). Any chance you can send me the specs you used to get your set built? I don't have a suspension knowledge base wide enough to create specs for a costume build.

[Driven5]

Originally Posted by mfindigital

Any chance you can send me the specs you used to get your set built?

I plan to detail pretty much everything in its own thread, and make it public knowledge, but only after I am able to fit it up and prove it out first. Unfortunately I'm also not sure how quickly I'll be able to get to it.