BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)
 





 

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-26-2018, 10:34 AM   #67
Run Silent
Run Deep
Run Silent's Avatar
United_States
8290
Rep
2,459
Posts

Drives: Back and Forth To Work
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: The Mountains

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Why would you call me a straw man? My statement was factual, and should be enlightening to you.

straw man
ˌstrô ˈman/
noun
1.
an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.
"her familiar procedure of creating a straw man by exaggerating their approach"
2.
a person regarded as having no substance or integrity.


You are barking up the wrong tree, sir. I've provided him with multiple sources with respect to the atrocities perpetuated by the DPRK as well as unbiased historical resources regarding the concerns that the United States and then current leadership had with respect to dropping the bomb.

If he is still arguing his point, he is either a troll or unable to grasp reality.
Appreciate 1
      09-26-2018, 10:35 AM   #68
Schwarzschild Radius
Field Marshal of the Cosmos
Schwarzschild Radius's Avatar
United_States
6269
Rep
7,755
Posts

Drives: 135i DCT
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Agua Caliente

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 135  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
A straw man is not a "person", therefore I can't call you a straw man.

The straw man argument you're making is answered by the definition number 1 of your own posted straw man dictionary words.

Now, to my question, what was the second country to use nuclear weapons?
You are quite the contrarian!
Answer my question about Truman first. Talk about a strawman.....
__________________
Renegade of Funk
Appreciate 1
Run Silent8290.00

      09-26-2018, 10:36 AM   #69
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Why would you call me a straw man? My statement was factual, and should be enlightening to you.

straw man
ˌstrô ˈman/
noun
1.
an intentionally misrepresented proposition that is set up because it is easier to defeat than an opponent's real argument.
"her familiar procedure of creating a straw man by exaggerating their approach"
2.
a person regarded as having no substance or integrity.


You are barking up the wrong tree, sir. I've provided him with multiple sources with respect to the atrocities perpetuated by the DPRK as well as unbiased historical resources regarding the concerns that the United States and then current leadership had with respect to dropping the bomb.

If he is still arguing his point, he is either a troll or unable to grasp reality.
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Appreciate 1
      09-26-2018, 10:37 AM   #70
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
A straw man is not a "person", therefore I can't call you a straw man.

The straw man argument you're making is answered by the definition number 1 of your own posted straw man dictionary words.

Now, to my question, what was the second country to use nuclear weapons?
You are quite the contrarian!
Answer my question about Truman first. Talk about a strawman.....
Ok.
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 10:38 AM   #71
bbbbmw
Major General
2343
Rep
6,083
Posts

Drives: 135i
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Southwest

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ard5040 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Benefactor? Do you mean beneficiary?

I don't see his comments in that light. I think he more drove the message that we are more focused on the US, and that we won't let non-Americans (the UN) control American resources, drag us into war, not defend our interests, etc:

"The United States will not tell you how to live or work or worship," Trump said. "We only ask that you honor our sovereignty in return."

"Trump described a U.S. foreign policy he called "principled realism" that would at times reject conventional thinking about international relations. He said U.S. foreign aid would go only "to those who respect us and who are, frankly, are our friends."

"We will not be held hostage to old dogmas, discredited ideologies and so-called experts who have been proven wrong over the years, time and time again," he said."

Can anyone argue that we should end foreign aid to countries that aren't our friend?

The laugh was when he said in summary "my administration has undone Obama's agenda" - which they undoubtedly have witnessed, and to some extent seen their gravy train end. I think it's most likely the laugh signifies their understanding- which I see as very positive.

He also talked about the Human Rights and war-mongering of Iran:

"The country's regime used proceeds from the [moronic Obama/Kerry] accord to increase its military budget 40 percent and strengthen the repression of its people, Trump said, calling the deal "a windfall" for the country's leaders.

"Iran's leaders sow chaos, death and destruction," Trump said. "Iran's leaders plunder the nation's resources to enrich themselves and to spread mayhem in the Middle East and far beyond."

Frankly, why didn't the UN put a stop to Obama/Kerry's deal? It clearly propped up Iran's military and increased their aggression globally.

I was a bit surprised he stopped short of saying "and where the fuck were you in trying to control these rogue countries - isn't that why you exist? If you won't do it on a global scale, the US will at least protect our interests."

Of course the UN won't like that message. The last time I looked, they are still as corrupt and ineffective as ever. We don't need to foot their bills either; we've been their enabler Sugar Daddy for way too long.

And of course, the media can only wail about "Trump is a laughingstock." How typical, and how foolish.

I'm happy they responded, even with a laugh. Maybe they will understand someday, and change their ways. "Hope and change" - for the UN.
Beneficiary, thanks. But drag us to war. Who followed us into Afghanistan and Iraq? You’re right, Iran is a bad actor. But so is North Korea. So is Russia. The North Koreans won’t let anyone in to verify their “denuclearization” and continue to starve their own citizens. Russia poisons ex agents on foreign soil and aids Assad in gassing his own people and all trump can do is heap praise on Kim and Vladimir. In the mean time his calling neo nazis and the Klan “a lot of fine people” at home. He is the last person who should be talking about human rights. One more point, I saw only minor mention, if any, on the major networks last night or this morning. I don’t consider Fox a major network. State Television but not a major network.
You're a bit all over the place here.

Trump didn't call the Neo-Nazis "very fine people." Here's a transcript of what he said:

"You had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people—on both sides—you had people in that group—excuse me. Excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue, and the re-naming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

<here's the second part of the same speech:>

"You're changing history. You're changing culture, and you had people—and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, OK? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly."

Fox News consistently leads cable news in viewership by a mile - and they have for many years. You may not like what they say, but they are definitely a major news network - it's insane to say they are not?
__________________
<OO (llll)(llll) OO>
Appreciate 1
________2130.00

      09-26-2018, 10:40 AM   #72
Schwarzschild Radius
Field Marshal of the Cosmos
Schwarzschild Radius's Avatar
United_States
6269
Rep
7,755
Posts

Drives: 135i DCT
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Agua Caliente

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 135  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Usually, when someone argues "Learn to read", "learn to talk", etc, etc, they have usually already lost the argument.

You stated that the US used atomic weapons "without hesitation". I asserted that Truman had reservations. You then replied that I was using a strawman argument.
__________________
Renegade of Funk
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 10:42 AM   #73
Schwarzschild Radius
Field Marshal of the Cosmos
Schwarzschild Radius's Avatar
United_States
6269
Rep
7,755
Posts

Drives: 135i DCT
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Agua Caliente

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 135  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
You're a bit all over the place here.

Trump didn't call the Neo-Nazis "very fine people." Here's a transcript of what he said:

"You had some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people—on both sides—you had people in that group—excuse me. Excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue, and the re-naming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name."

<here's the second part of the same speech:>

"You're changing history. You're changing culture, and you had people—and I'm not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, OK? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly."

Fox News consistently leads cable news in viewership by a mile - and they have for many years. You may not like what they say, but they are definitely a major news network - it's insane to say they are not?
FOX......
enough said.
Maybe you need to quote Hannity more.
__________________
Renegade of Funk
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 10:42 AM   #74
tuco44
Colonel
tuco44's Avatar
Canada
587
Rep
2,270
Posts

Drives: 2018 340i xDrive M Perf Edtn
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Western Canada

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Pot calling the Kettle................
__________________
2018 340i xDrive M Perf Edtn Sunset Orange
Previous BMWs - 19 others since 1971.
Appreciate 1
Run Silent8290.00

      09-26-2018, 10:48 AM   #75
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Usually, when someone argues "Learn to read", "learn to talk", etc, etc, they have usually already lost the argument.

You stated that the US used atomic weapons "without hesitation". I asserted that Truman had reservations. You then replied that I was using a strawman argument.
That could be the majority of cases yes.
I was simply saying I can't (or won't) have a conversation with someone who only resorts to name calling and the assertion that they are right and others are stupid.
I have no need to discuss with someone like him. You don't have to come to his aid, he seems mature enough to take care of himself.

Now, as it pertains to you, I posted that the US was the only one to use nukes without hesitation.

The straw man argument you wanted to start was that "that saved more lives than it destroyed", which is ok I guess but nothing I said had agreed or disagreed with that. And that is not the discussion at hand.

You completely skipped my question (define hesitation) and focused on the hesitation part of using nukes. And used a straw man argument to say I do not know it saved more lives (next one will be that I hate Americans, watch and see).

I tried to bring the discussion back to topic (albeit off topic already) of: what was the second country to use nukes?

Honestly, let me jump the gun and say: you guys are getting emotional because you know the answer is no one, and are grasping for straws shooting all over the place, and resorting to name calling.

Remember the vitriol thread? Try to live by that and I'll reply to every question directed at me. I won't entertain discussing with people who think they have it right because of their "background" and everyone else is stupid, troll, trumpsters, libturds and what have you.

Did I lose my argument and therefore am saying someone should learn discussion manners before engaging in said discussion? Maybe, suit yourself.
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 10:49 AM   #76
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuco44 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Pot calling the Kettle................
How so?
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 10:52 AM   #77
Run Silent
Run Deep
Run Silent's Avatar
United_States
8290
Rep
2,459
Posts

Drives: Back and Forth To Work
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: The Mountains

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Real Dodger View Post
Usually, when someone argues "Learn to read", "learn to talk", etc, etc, they have usually already lost the argument.

You stated that the US used atomic weapons "without hesitation". I asserted that Truman had reservations. You then replied that I was using a strawman argument.
Not sure why I was linked in his quote, either, so I am unsure of who his comment was directed at - me or you.

I find it funny that he is calling out both of us with respect to discussions on a forum. I feel that both of us present our points in a logical manner - and I believe that you and I diverge on most political stances.

More folks need to learn to disagree without being disagreeable.
Appreciate 1
      09-26-2018, 10:55 AM   #78
NicoleLusts4BMW
BeachBitch
NicoleLusts4BMW's Avatar
United_States
61
Rep
118
Posts

Drives: 2018 540i M Package 20" wheels
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Palo Alto, California

iTrader: (0)

Like everything in todays political environment your opinion of Trump are based on your political views. FWIW Trump is an embarrassment to this great country. I dont care if the economy is doing well. My wealth has never been impacted by the economy good or bad. The political climate in this country is pathetic. Our politicians have abandoned us. They are worthless.
Appreciate 2
________2130.00
kyoo295.50

      09-26-2018, 10:55 AM   #79
are0lies
Banned
United_States
4120
Rep
1,871
Posts

Drives: 2011 M3 E93
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Riverside

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Lol talk about a straw man...

What was the second country to use nuclear weapons in history?
Okay, you have me intrigued. Are you talking in war, or testing? The Soviet Union tested its first nuclear bomb on August 29, 1949.
Appreciate 1
________2130.00

      09-26-2018, 10:56 AM   #80
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by are0lies View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Lol talk about a straw man...

What was the second country to use nuclear weapons in history?
Okay, you have me intrigued. Are you talking in war, or testing? The Soviet Union tested its first nuclear bomb on August 29, 1949.
No, I'm asking about actual use (to kill enemies).
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 11:06 AM   #81
are0lies
Banned
United_States
4120
Rep
1,871
Posts

Drives: 2011 M3 E93
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Riverside

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
No, I'm asking about actual use (to kill enemies).
Okay, couldn't find any other instance of that.
Appreciate 2
________2130.00

      09-26-2018, 11:33 AM   #82
The0pportunist
Captain
The0pportunist's Avatar
United Kingdom
210
Rep
973
Posts

Drives: F13
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: London

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Yeah, you are going to have to pick another country to do this comparison with. The DPRK is probably the worst place for human rights violations on earth, and allowing them to obtain nuclear weapons would be detrimental to millions upon millions of people.

To say that it is comparable that the United States has nuclear weapons, so why can't the DPRK - that is just an indefensible comment and you should be ashamed. I spent many days whilst in the military running flights out of Misawa, Japan to areas 'north of South Korea' and have analyzed intel at length. The DPRK is an utter cesspool.

Some links for you, in case you really feel they should be allowed to gain access to weapons of mass destruction:

--------------------------------------------------------
Please stop with the arrogant shit! Asking if USA can have nuclear weapons - why can't others is a valid question.

Remember you might think USA is the greatest and can do nothing wrong but rest of the world remembers 1945 & it's impact on everyday people like you & me. Perhaps this part of history is not taught in US schools?

You would not ask a murderer to police & pass judgement on other murderers would you? So why do we let the country who has used nuclear weapons against civilians dictate who is allowed WMDs?

I believe all countries should be developing nuclear weapons because there will be a time we will need it like when an asteroid is hurtling towards our planet. Maybe not in our lifetime but its a statistical certainty.
Appreciate 1
________2130.00

      09-26-2018, 11:34 AM   #83
Schwarzschild Radius
Field Marshal of the Cosmos
Schwarzschild Radius's Avatar
United_States
6269
Rep
7,755
Posts

Drives: 135i DCT
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Agua Caliente

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 135  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by The0pportunist View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Yeah, you are going to have to pick another country to do this comparison with. The DPRK is probably the worst place for human rights violations on earth, and allowing them to obtain nuclear weapons would be detrimental to millions upon millions of people.

To say that it is comparable that the United States has nuclear weapons, so why can't the DPRK - that is just an indefensible comment and you should be ashamed. I spent many days whilst in the military running flights out of Misawa, Japan to areas 'north of South Korea' and have analyzed intel at length. The DPRK is an utter cesspool.

Some links for you, in case you really feel they should be allowed to gain access to weapons of mass destruction:

--------------------------------------------------------
Please stop with the arrogant shit! Asking if USA can have nuclear weapons - why can't others is a valid question.

Remember you might think USA is the greatest and can do nothing wrong but rest of the world remembers 1945 & it's impact on everyday people like you & me. Perhaps this part of history is not taught in US schools?

You would not ask a murderer to police & pass judgement on other murderers would you? So why do we let the country who has used nuclear weapons against civilians dictate who is allowed WMDs?

I believe all countries should be developing nuclear weapons because there will be a time we will need it like when an asteroid is hurtling towards our planet. Maybe not in our lifetime but its a statistical certainty.

Jeremy Corbin, welcome to Bimmerpost.
__________________
Renegade of Funk
Appreciate 1
      09-26-2018, 11:36 AM   #84
bbbbmw
Major General
2343
Rep
6,083
Posts

Drives: 135i
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Southwest

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
Nikki Haley Says United Nations Laughter Was Prompted By Respect For Trump's 'Honesty'

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...b0f143d10ee8f4

I suppose all the Trump minions believe that.
Do you know something the US Ambassador to the UN doesn't know?
__________________
<OO (llll)(llll) OO>
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 11:37 AM   #85
bbbbmw
Major General
2343
Rep
6,083
Posts

Drives: 135i
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Southwest

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kyoo View Post
immigrants are what made this country the powerhouse it is, but yea mocking globalism, smart.

clearly some of you have zero fucking knowledge about north korea
Did globalism make the US what it is?
__________________
<OO (llll)(llll) OO>
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 11:39 AM   #86
gonzo
Lieutenant General
gonzo's Avatar
United_States
5433
Rep
11,945
Posts

Drives: as many as possible
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: TeXXXas

iTrader: (0)

Who reads, much less trusts, the Huffington Post?
They and The Palmer Report are straight up whackos. Liberals call them whackos.
__________________
Crazy Diamond
Appreciate 1
________2130.00

      09-26-2018, 11:39 AM   #87
________
Lieutenant Colonel
2130
Rep
1,514
Posts

Drives: _
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: _

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tuco44 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by OnerDriver View Post
Dude, seriously, learn how to talk first before you come to a forum.

Your entitlement and sense of "piling up" on people has no place on this thread. Try to learn how to present your points without resorting to name-calling and straw man arguments, and someone will entertain answering your posts.

But go on as I know you will.
Pot calling the Kettle................
I'll ask again, hoping your post wasn't just some "flame":

Why do you say? Something I should be aware of and apologize if need be? Please let me know.

Thanks.
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2018, 11:40 AM   #88
Schwarzschild Radius
Field Marshal of the Cosmos
Schwarzschild Radius's Avatar
United_States
6269
Rep
7,755
Posts

Drives: 135i DCT
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Agua Caliente

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 135  [5.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by gonzo View Post
Who reads, much less trusts, the Huffington Post?
Them and The Palmer Report are straight up whackos. Liberals call them whackos.
Who posts stuff by Mark F and thepraying medic?

Be careful throwing rocks in a glass house.
__________________
Renegade of Funk
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:47 PM.




1addicts
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST