1M options and impact on projected future value

[PRTSB1M]

Originally Posted by gmx

I never understood the "weight" argument, despite the fact that no-nav for instance wasn't even an option in a lot of markets. I do get the no gimmick, driver focused cockpit. Except that's the E9x M3 with the sleek dash. The non-nav dash in a 1 series, is just that. Suitable for a 1 series designed and sold on a budget. The weight of an idrive controller plus the screen is about 400grams.

Recaros > any 1 series seat. Better if original BMWP or even retrims. Manual only saves 7 imperial units. Some report that more needs to be changed to actually sit lower. As is the reluctance of most 1M owners, knowledge is thin hence the lack of documentation.

"Lightest" build code is often a fallacy in modern manufactured cars. It really only applies to obvious things like no sunroof or cf roof for M2CS/3/4 models etc. The guy that slaps on a set of light 18s, since, M359s are a heavy wheel or just a section of exhaust has already outdone your "stripper" effort. Cue the incoming "but mah original is lighter" which entirely fails to appreciate the car imho along the same vein that some believe it's perfect from factory. Which begs the question, was this their first car?. That's really obvious with those that don't know how to drive 3 pedals too.

Running 18x10.5 Apex VS5RS (~19lb) on 295/30 PS4S and carbon fiber driveshaft. MHD 1+ w/B58 coils/plugs, maddad mid, Akra slip-on.

Pulled from behind a Model X on a sweeping on-ramp before, driver’s face was priceless.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by gmx

I never understood the "weight" argument, despite the fact that no-nav for instance wasn't even an option in a lot of markets. I do get the no gimmick, driver focused cockpit. Except that's the E9x M3 with the sleek dash. The non-nav dash in a 1 series, is just that. Suitable for a 1 series designed and sold on a budget. The weight of an idrive controller plus the screen is about 400grams.

Recaros > any 1 series seat. Better if original BMWP or even retrims. Manual only saves 7 imperial units. Some report that more needs to be changed to actually sit lower. As is the reluctance of most 1M owners, knowledge is thin hence the lack of documentation.

"Lightest" build code is often a fallacy in modern manufactured cars. It really only applies to obvious things like no sunroof or cf roof for M2CS/3/4 models etc. The guy that slaps on a set of light 18s, since, M359s are a heavy wheel or just a section of exhaust has already outdone your "stripper" effort. Cue the incoming "but mah original is lighter" which entirely fails to appreciate the car imho along the same vein that some believe it's perfect from factory. Which begs the question, was this their first car?. That's really obvious with those that don't know how to drive 3 pedals too.

Sir, I see you are from Australia so me try to clarify some things as an original, actually even two years before 1M came out, asking BMW for a lighter weight, smaller, more focused M car. First off, in the USA all NAV cars came loaded with not just a 400 gram screen, but also power motorized seats, powered folding mirrors, screen, idrive controller, hard drive unit, parking sensors and additional lighting inside and in door. So you can hopefully see this was more than 400 grams. Secondly, the manual seats also had the additional benefit of being much lower than the heavier motorized ones. This afforded you a lower seating position for those that wanted it. While this might not make a difference to you, if you can imagine to those of us that begged and pleaded with BMW, the 40 or so pounds were not just extra weight but weight for things that many of us did not want. As an autocrosser, the first thing I do is move my mirror out of the way for the longest visibility, I don't want a hump on top of dash. I don't want an idrive controller and motorized folding mirrors. I am blessed with Thor like arms and can fold my mirrors with ease when I feel like it. So you might not care about some extra weight but some of us bought into the 1M because it was a return to basics. There are millions of cars out there that are bloated so why bloat the one special on that M put out? You mention the M2, BMW in the usa only offered the M2 with motorized seats UNTIL they came out with a lightweight edition which they fitted with the manual seats for a premium....which is what the low options 1Ms come with standard.

So sorry you don't get people wanting to keep their sports cars as light as possible, as unobstructed. I am aware that in other countries the NAV is a standalone option and few cars here in NA were delivered that way accidentally, but by and large the NAV cars are loaded with fluff that a few of the diehards do not want. I have purchased two 1Ms and I passed on many that had nav and before I purchased my 2nd one. During this voyage I met many others that also passed on buying NAV 1M....not only where they not willing to pay more for one, on the contrary, some us refused to buy one that way. So as I said there are so few 1Ms and in the US most are either premium or loaded with NAV. Few of them are strippers with manual seats. While most are like you and want the fluff and don't care about extra weight, since there are so few of the low option cars that that options are really irrelevant on the 1M. So few manual seat cars but plenty that want one because they care about the lower seating position, weight and want an old school cockpit. So I hope that explains it somewhat as to the American market. 1M prices depend primarily on miles and condition not options. There are more people of the NAV and NO NAV camp that want one then there are NAV and No NAV cars to go around: Just like you won't buy a no nav car without power seats, I wouldn't buy one with nav and powered seats.

[gmx]

Further to my point, most such harnesses still exists in cars that don't have such options. That thread floating around from eons ago claiming 40lbs isn't accurate, ETK weights aren't trustworthy for a lot of components. 135s/1M were popular and class leading once upon a time for local production car & endurance racing like this one right here: https://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=684308 Asking those that have been there done that are far better than the "maybes" posted on forums.

Already made my point about the seats. Recaros > *. Manual/motorised/this/that argument in the bin.
I specifically mentioned the M2CS, not M2.
To conclude, I technically can't buy road-registered no-nav. There is only 1 spec here and that's it. I'm also not going to bother removing it, that'd make me 1/1 right? You are so stuck in your own region and think the globe revolves around you.

This is a car that you need 2 balls to drive. Arguing about garage queens that are the upteenth lighter than their driven optioned counterparts is an incredible disservice to the potential this car offers. It's a shame that so many owners aren't even close yet rather bicker about forecasted, projected values based on options. Unless you're collector status, this car isn't for you.
With the same tyre but green advantage, I can take away some circuit chassis records from those racecars I mentioned earlier. And I'm doing it with street spec trim, same power, original clutch (lul) inc nav ... without the cage, $10k+ dampers, drexler/spool diffs.

PRTSB1M Pretty much my point. Akra slip on isn't that light for titanium but it's lighter none the less (1kg only IIRC). I have one too, it sounds good. Ultimately, you can build a pretty nice 1M that offers a better experience than the lack of options ever would. It's good but far from perfect from factory.

Another one to get the party started? The OE dampers while alumunium bodied, are underwhelming. Or shall we "option" the aftermarket and jump on the Ohlins bandwagon adding the worst form of weight.
Farcical argument.

[PRTSB1M]

Originally Posted by gmx

PRTSB1M Pretty much my point. Akra slip on isn't that light for titanium but it's lighter none the less (1kg only IIRC). I have one too, it sounds good. Ultimately, you can build a pretty nice 1M that offers a better experience than the lack of options ever would. It's good but far from perfect from factory.

Another one to get the party started? The OE dampers while alumunium bodied, are underwhelming. Or shall we "option" the aftermarket and jump on the Ohlins bandwagon adding the worst form of weight.
Farcical argument.

Yes, 1M is fanboy favorite because you still get to tune out the little imperfections. Also, after installing the Akra myself, I can say that this is the only exhaust I would recommend as it has the largest diameter piping after the mid-pipe. I am currently waiting on the Akra mid-pipe to replace the MadDad, because it has a larger diameter union into the rear section (not because it is lighter).

The stock rear section does seem to weigh about the same as the Akra, but stock is definitely a restriction for turbos in terms of pipe diameter. I also have ohlins waiting in a box, because they seem like best option for mostly street car, with few track days. I think it's mostly brits obsessed with shedding kilos.

Unfortunately, there are folks who emerge at this price-point who just want a taste to find out if they agree with the market.

[BMW Gator]

Originally Posted by nachob

Sir, I see you are from Australia so me try to clarify some things as an original, actually even two years before 1M came out, asking BMW for a lighter weight, smaller, more focused M car. First off, in the USA all NAV cars came loaded with not just a 400 gram screen, but also power motorized seats, powered folding mirrors, screen, idrive controller, hard drive unit, parking sensors and additional lighting inside and in door. So you can hopefully see this was more than 400 grams. Secondly, the manual seats also had the additional benefit of being much lower than the heavier motorized ones. This afforded you a lower seating position for those that wanted it. While this might not make a difference to you, if you can imagine to those of us that begged and pleaded with BMW, the 40 or so pounds were not just extra weight but weight for things that many of us did not want. As an autocrosser, the first thing I do is move my mirror out of the way for the longest visibility, I don't want a hump on top of dash. I don't want an idrive controller and motorized folding mirrors. I am blessed with Thor like arms and can fold my mirrors with ease when I feel like it. So you might not care about some extra weight but some of us bought into the 1M because it was a return to basics. There are millions of cars out there that are bloated so why bloat the one special on that M put out? You mention the M2, BMW in the usa only offered the M2 with motorized seats UNTIL they came out with a lightweight edition which they fitted with the manual seats for a premium....which is what the low options 1Ms come with standard.

So sorry you don't get people wanting to keep their sports cars as light as possible, as unobstructed. I am aware that in other countries the NAV is a standalone option and few cars here in NA were delivered that way accidentally, but by and large the NAV cars are loaded with fluff that a few of the diehards do not want. I have purchased two 1Ms and I passed on many that had nav and before I purchased my 2nd one. During this voyage I met many others that also passed on buying NAV 1M....not only where they not willing to pay more for one, on the contrary, some us refused to buy one that way. So as I said there are so few 1Ms and in the US most are either premium or loaded with NAV. Few of them are strippers with manual seats. While most are like you and want the fluff and don't care about extra weight, since there are so few of the low option cars that that options are really irrelevant on the 1M. So few manual seat cars but plenty that want one because they care about the lower seating position, weight and want an old school cockpit. So I hope that explains it somewhat as to the American market. 1M prices depend primarily on miles and condition not options. There are more people of the NAV and NO NAV camp that want one then there are NAV and No NAV cars to go around: Just like you won't buy a no nav car without power seats, I wouldn't buy one with nav and powered seats.

Some will never understand - as an original owner of a stripper and only 1 of 2 produced with my build - its a keeper and a far departure from any recent BMW offerings.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by BMW Gator

Some will never understand - as an original owner of a stripper and only 1 of 2 produced with my build - its a keeper and a far departure from any recent BMW offerings.

Original owner as well. Yeah, I didn't make your 1 of 2 solely because I did add Sirus XM as only option or I would've been the 1 of 3 with you. Dang. Kudos for keeping it bare. I would've skipped that too but I figured it didn't add any weight.

Yes for those of us that were there before the beginning asking bmw for a smaller lighter more focused and less techno-loaded M car, it's a lost perspective. Now with M2s around people forget how special and different the 1M was compared to the bloated M cars before and the reason we still have some small bmw sports cars today.