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      05-03-2021, 05:07 PM   #1
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I went to a square wheel and tire setup for track use a few years ago and have used 3 different square tire setups now. I have 6 wheels, so I mount all 6 and rotate them front-rear-off so they remain relatively balanced on heat cycles. That allows me to have spares in case of mishap, and also to run them until they cord. Also relevant: current geometry is -2.7 camber front and -2.2 camber rear.

My wheels came with BFG Rivals (4 tires, two wheels in boxes) which were used for some autocrosses and about 3 track days. They wore at the inner tread blocks even with predominantly track/autox use, and never felt anywhere near as grippy as the RE71r's I had used on my stock wheels previously. They have been superceded by the Rival S and Rival S1.5, neither of which have a load rating that meets requirements for the 1M.

Last year I used 6 Toyo RA1's (TW100) rotated as described and got 7 track days out of them. They were heat cycled but NOT shaved from the Tire Rack. When new, they were very squirmy from the thick tread blocks, but as they wore they became brilliant. Their reputation is that they get progressively better until they cord....I confirmed that! Even with my alignment, they corded at the inner treads, which surprised me.

This year, I decided to try the Goodyear Supercar 3R which also has a TW100 because it appeared to have a more stable tread pattern and I hoped they wouldn't be squirmy when new. That proved correct, and they were grippy (good for lap times 2 seconds faster than last year in similar conditions), BUT I delaminated 4 of the 6 tires by the time I had done 11 sessions, about a day and a half. The outer tread blocks were gone. Inner tread blocks showed very little wear. It seems these tires wanted a LOT more negative camber. This was despite targeting hot pressures of 43-44 front and 42 rear which the T1R thrived at. I had temp readings to confirm that those pressures were spot on for the RA1's last year, but did not have access to a pyrometer this weekend. Because I was fully expecting to get a season out of them, I rotated them each half day for the weekend to get them all scuffed in. Sunday morning, a front tire delaminated on its 3rd session of the day. I thought it was a defective tire. I replaced it, then started watching closely. I replaced another (other front) after the 1st afternoon session. After my second afternoon session, both of the tires on the rear at that time had signs of starting to delaminate all the way around the outer edge. I drove my sons Rx-8 for the remaining two sessions. (Always bring extra tires, and in case that fails, bring an extra car, can I get an Amen?)

I'll post some pictures later.

So, now I look at my options. RE71r has gone extinct. Rivals don't meet load requirement. I would prefer to stay with 275 width so the options Direzza ZIII or Falken Azenis 615 or 660 if I want a "street" tire. Everyone agrees RA1 is better than R888 if going the tw100 route, and I have heard good theory that they may last at least as long when shaved, which would eliminate the squirm when new.

If I drop down to 265 width, there are a few more options including Hancock Ventus V12, Yoko AO52, PSC2 connects. Not sure I want smaller tires especially at the rear.

What says the hive mind?
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      05-03-2021, 10:22 PM   #2
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Why not the Nitto NT01? Like the RA1 they are commonly felt to get progressively better and good down to the cords.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarJunkie View Post
I went to a square wheel and tire setup for track use a few years ago and have used 3 different square tire setups now. I have 6 wheels, so I mount all 6 and rotate them front-rear-off so they remain relatively balanced on heat cycles. That allows me to have spares in case of mishap, and also to run them until they cord. Also relevant: current geometry is -2.7 camber front and -2.2 camber rear.

My wheels came with BFG Rivals (4 tires, two wheels in boxes) which were used for some autocrosses and about 3 track days. They wore at the inner tread blocks even with predominantly track/autox use, and never felt anywhere near as grippy as the RE71r's I had used on my stock wheels previously. They have been superceded by the Rival S and Rival S1.5, neither of which have a load rating that meets requirements for the 1M.

Last year I used 6 Toyo RA1's (TW100) rotated as described and got 7 track days out of them. They were heat cycled but NOT shaved from the Tire Rack. When new, they were very squirmy from the thick tread blocks, but as they wore they became brilliant. Their reputation is that they get progressively better until they cord....I confirmed that! Even with my alignment, they corded at the inner treads, which surprised me.

This year, I decided to try the Goodyear Supercar 3R which also has a TW100 because it appeared to have a more stable tread pattern and I hoped they wouldn't be squirmy when new. That proved correct, and they were grippy (good for lap times 2 seconds faster than last year in similar conditions), BUT I delaminated 4 of the 6 tires by the time I had done 11 sessions, about a day and a half. The outer tread blocks were gone. Inner tread blocks showed very little wear. It seems these tires wanted a LOT more negative camber. This was despite targeting hot pressures of 43-44 front and 42 rear which the T1R thrived at. I had temp readings to confirm that those pressures were spot on for the RA1's last year, but did not have access to a pyrometer this weekend. Because I was fully expecting to get a season out of them, I rotated them each half day for the weekend to get them all scuffed in. Sunday morning, a front tire delaminated on its 3rd session of the day. I thought it was a defective tire. I replaced it, then started watching closely. I replaced another (other front) after the 1st afternoon session. After my second afternoon session, both of the tires on the rear at that time had signs of starting to delaminate all the way around the outer edge. I drove my sons Rx-8 for the remaining two sessions. (Always bring extra tires, and in case that fails, bring an extra car, can I get an Amen?)

I'll post some pictures later.

So, now I look at my options. RE71r has gone extinct. Rivals don't meet load requirement. I would prefer to stay with 275 width so the options Direzza ZIII or Falken Azenis 615 or 660 if I want a "street" tire. Everyone agrees RA1 is better than R888 if going the tw100 route, and I have heard good theory that they may last at least as long when shaved, which would eliminate the squirm when new.

If I drop down to 265 width, there are a few more options including Hancock Ventus V12, Yoko AO52, PSC2 connects. Not sure I want smaller tires especially at the rear.

What says the hive mind?
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      05-03-2021, 10:41 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ayao View Post
Why not the Nitto NT01? Like the RA1 they are commonly felt to get progressively better and good down to the cords.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarJunkie View Post
I went to a square wheel and tire setup for track use a few years ago and have used 3 different square tire setups now. I have 6 wheels, so I mount all 6 and rotate them front-rear-off so they remain relatively balanced on heat cycles. That allows me to have spares in case of mishap, and also to run them until they cord. Also relevant: current geometry is -2.7 camber front and -2.2 camber rear.

My wheels came with BFG Rivals (4 tires, two wheels in boxes) which were used for some autocrosses and about 3 track days. They wore at the inner tread blocks even with predominantly track/autox use, and never felt anywhere near as grippy as the RE71r's I had used on my stock wheels previously. They have been superceded by the Rival S and Rival S1.5, neither of which have a load rating that meets requirements for the 1M.

Last year I used 6 Toyo RA1's (TW100) rotated as described and got 7 track days out of them. They were heat cycled but NOT shaved from the Tire Rack. When new, they were very squirmy from the thick tread blocks, but as they wore they became brilliant. Their reputation is that they get progressively better until they cord....I confirmed that! Even with my alignment, they corded at the inner treads, which surprised me.

This year, I decided to try the Goodyear Supercar 3R which also has a TW100 because it appeared to have a more stable tread pattern and I hoped they wouldn't be squirmy when new. That proved correct, and they were grippy (good for lap times 2 seconds faster than last year in similar conditions), BUT I delaminated 4 of the 6 tires by the time I had done 11 sessions, about a day and a half. The outer tread blocks were gone. Inner tread blocks showed very little wear. It seems these tires wanted a LOT more negative camber. This was despite targeting hot pressures of 43-44 front and 42 rear which the T1R thrived at. I had temp readings to confirm that those pressures were spot on for the RA1's last year, but did not have access to a pyrometer this weekend. Because I was fully expecting to get a season out of them, I rotated them each half day for the weekend to get them all scuffed in. Sunday morning, a front tire delaminated on its 3rd session of the day. I thought it was a defective tire. I replaced it, then started watching closely. I replaced another (other front) after the 1st afternoon session. After my second afternoon session, both of the tires on the rear at that time had signs of starting to delaminate all the way around the outer edge. I drove my sons Rx-8 for the remaining two sessions. (Always bring extra tires, and in case that fails, bring an extra car, can I get an Amen?)

I'll post some pictures later.

So, now I look at my options. RE71r has gone extinct. Rivals don't meet load requirement. I would prefer to stay with 275 width so the options Direzza ZIII or Falken Azenis 615 or 660 if I want a "street" tire. Everyone agrees RA1 is better than R888 if going the tw100 route, and I have heard good theory that they may last at least as long when shaved, which would eliminate the squirm when new.

If I drop down to 265 width, there are a few more options including Hancock Ventus V12, Yoko AO52, PSC2 connects. Not sure I want smaller tires especially at the rear.

What says the hive mind?
Good point....I usually shop tire rack and forgot there are a few brands I represented!

Here is the worst of my delaminated beauties....
Attached Images
 
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      05-19-2021, 08:12 PM   #4
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Considering you're already on the 9.5" width wheels, I would go with 265/65 Yoko A052 for a season. PSC2 connect sounds cool, but not sure they're worth the extra spend... maybe you try them and let me know
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      05-19-2021, 09:40 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UN1CORM View Post
Considering you're already on the 9.5" width wheels, I would go with 265/65 Yoko A052 for a season. PSC2 connect sounds cool, but not sure they're worth the extra spend... maybe you try them and let me know
May consider that, although I really liked the Toyo RA1, and may just try them shaved.
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      05-21-2021, 12:30 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UN1CORM View Post
Considering you're already on the 9.5" width wheels, I would go with 265/65 Yoko A052 for a season. PSC2 connect sounds cool, but not sure they're worth the extra spend... maybe you try them and let me know
Do we know if anyone has used AO52's on a 1M for track use yet? I have a feeling they would not last as long as the RA1....even if I shave the RA1.
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      05-22-2021, 11:42 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarJunkie View Post
Do we know if anyone has used AO52's on a 1M for track use yet? I have a feeling they would not last as long as the RA1....even if I shave the RA1.
Here’s a thread from over at M3Post…
https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1524335
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      05-23-2021, 11:03 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ayao View Post
Here’s a thread from over at M3Post…
https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1524335
Thanks, jusat read the whole thing . . . I may actually go that route next time to save a few bucks. I ordered a set of RA1's (which worked great for me last year) shaved and heat cycled . . . I expect to get about 4-5 days out of them rotating 6 tires. We will see.
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      05-25-2021, 01:54 PM   #9
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Look into the nankang ar1. Have tried most 100-200tw tires (including the a052, skip that unless you autox) and have really been liking the 'kangs. Got 25 heat cycles out of the rears on my gt3 compared to 10 out of the a052. Fronts last a good bit longer on my car. I miss the 1m days of running square setups!

Last edited by craina; 05-25-2021 at 02:00 PM..
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      05-25-2021, 03:52 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craina View Post
Look into the nankang ar1. Have tried most 100-200tw tires (including the a052, skip that unless you autox) and have really been liking the 'kangs. Got 25 heat cycles out of the rears on my gt3 compared to 10 out of the a052. Fronts last a good bit longer on my car. I miss the 1m days of running square setups!
I'll have to see if they come in 275/3518, and where to source them, thanks. I have already ordered RA1's (have worked well in the past) but I'm always willing to try something new next year. I rotate pretty regularly, so I really have no idea whether I wear them faster on the front or the rear of my car. Presumably the front, but not necessarily since the fronts are oversized for the chassis.
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      05-31-2021, 07:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craina View Post
Look into the nankang ar1. Have tried most 100-200tw tires (including the a052, skip that unless you autox) and have really been liking the 'kangs. Got 25 heat cycles out of the rears on my gt3 compared to 10 out of the a052. Fronts last a good bit longer on my car. I miss the 1m days of running square setups!
If you watch ring videos on YouTube, the Nankang AR-1 seems like a popular choice for those going “full send”.
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      06-28-2021, 07:24 PM   #12
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You'll kill things like A052 if you don't treat them correctly, IE thermal Deg from overinflation and not letting them come back. Depends on your goals, PB's or sticking it out for the entire session? Choose one.
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      09-29-2021, 07:53 AM   #13
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I use Hankook RS4 in 265/35/18 all around and love them. Plenty of grip and as soon as they start to go u just back off for a lap and they come right back. I'm getting around 10-12 days a season out of them (if I keep the bum tidy &#128521.

We run the RS4s on all our track/race cars, e30s, e36 & e46. Not as quick as the nankings but best bang for the back and last

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      09-29-2021, 09:00 AM   #14
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The RT660 is the best 200 tire I've ever run for HPDE. It may not have the outright pace the RE71 or A052 have but they feel very similar to the RE71s I ran previously and the RT660 holds on better lap after lap. The wear on them has blown me away... They look like they're wearing like an R-S4 too. They're also dirty cheap which is always nice.

I really wanted to try to the Goodyears but, yikes. Were you cording them like that on the front, rear, or both? What are you camber and alignment specs?
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      09-29-2021, 05:21 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amg6975 View Post
The RT660 is the best 200 tire I've ever run for HPDE. It may not have the outright pace the RE71 or A052 have but they feel very similar to the RE71s I ran previously and the RT660 holds on better lap after lap. The wear on them has blown me away... They look like they're wearing like an R-S4 too. They're also dirty cheap which is always nice.

I really wanted to try to the Goodyears but, yikes. Were you cording them like that on the front, rear, or both? What are you camber and alignment specs?
It seemed to be the front that was the worst, but I did have one that had only been on the rear when it started showing those signs. To be clear, they weren't really cording in the traditional sense. There was plenty of tread thickness left, they were simply delaminating and peeling away.

I don't know if maybe I was pushing them too hard from the second lap and wasn't getting them warmed up all the way through, but I have never had to be careful with Toyo RA1's which seem to be indestructible. I have gone back to the RA1's. I may try the RT660s next year especially if they are cheap and last a while.

Current alignment specs:
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      09-29-2021, 05:43 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ayao View Post
Here’s a thread from over at M3Post…
https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1524335
I pulled the trigger on sport cup 2s in 265/35 on 18x9.5 et27 front and 295/30 on 18x10.5 et22 rear; backordered and won’t be on the car until spring, though.
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      09-11-2023, 03:23 AM   #17
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Do you have more pictures with the silver arc8's on VO?
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      09-12-2023, 06:18 PM   #18
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Do you have more pictures with the silver arc8's on VO?
This might not be quite what you are looking for as far as silver goes, but here are some anthracites on VO.

https://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=631811
https://www.1addicts.com/forums/show...=614448&page=4
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      10-02-2023, 09:01 PM   #19
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Do you have more pictures with the silver arc8's on VO?
Here are a few….FYI this color is “race silver” not their standard silver and I bought the last 6 they had.
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