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07-31-2018, 12:45 PM | #1 |
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DME tuning renaissance, why the hell do we still use JB4?
So I've noticed that a few people, who will remain nameless, insist on running a JB4 in conjunction with the refined remaps now available, or even as a standalone, but without any of the special-case uses listed below.
I have yet to hear a SINGLE good argument for why this is a good idea. Reasons to use JB4 when you have access to all the maps necessary to recalibrate boost fuel ignition vanos CEL etc: --To run a meth system or other auxiliary fueling --To run a nitrous system --To change your boost levels marginally more quickly than would be possible with a 3 minute reflash Reasons not to use JB4 when you have a remappable ECU: --Adds several additional points of failure between the various connections and the box itself. --It's redundant, but not in a good way. You're duplicating functionality that can be better had with a good remap. --It's like throwing $300, or whatever they cost nowadays in the garbage --Using JB4 for boost control on a big turbo that doesn't work with the stock boost control tables just means your tuner is too lazy or stupid to properly calibrate the feedback control. Drivability suffers. --For logging or codes. If you have your JB4 enabled it spams the hell out of the canbus and you can't use the OBD port, which is very silly. Flash solutions like MHD offer wireless logging and code clearing now, obviating the need for a JB4 even to do this. Change my mind. |
07-31-2018, 01:59 PM | #2 |
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Agreed. Why add 100 potential wiring failure points to your car. You are just asking for trouble. Would never install a JB4 in my car.
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The Wind Breezes911.50 FrostyDC476.50 |
08-01-2018, 12:19 PM | #3 |
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Sold my JB4 a few weeks after buying it, MHD flash only. The Junk Box 4 doesn't even compare to a flash only tune.
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2006 Z4 M Roadster Black/Imola Red, FBO VF-Engineering, e85 Flex Fuel-Sold
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The Wind Breezes911.50 |
08-01-2018, 04:11 PM | #5 |
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I love it, and will be stealing that from you. The good old days...they were terrible! Full authority digital engine control is basically the best thing to happen to cars. |
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08-01-2018, 04:14 PM | #6 | |
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2006 Z4 M Roadster Black/Imola Red, FBO VF-Engineering, e85 Flex Fuel-Sold
2012 BMW 135i N55 DCT Alpine White/Coral Red, FBO, TBI, Full e85, JB4 BEF-Sold 2006 Z4 M Roadster Black/Black-Sold 2021 M2 Competition DCT Hockenheim Silver |
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low1352209.00 |
08-02-2018, 09:32 AM | #7 |
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I can't wait to go MHD 2+ followed by a custom tune from Twisted Tuning once I do inlets/outlets and PI
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The Wind Breezes911.50 1slo_135i16.00 |
08-02-2018, 06:35 PM | #8 |
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Or some of us had late E-series DME's that were locked. And tunes weren't available until recently. The ideal reason to add JB4 (years) is because it's better than Cobb. MHD wasn't an option.
Clearly some of you think all BMW's have unlocked DME's. Not the case. What would you do? Obviously you'd buy the JB4 instead of waiting a year for the 'hopes' of a flash and unlocking the DME. I kept the JB4, recently unlocked the DME, added the BEF. So I use both. I noticed you didn't mention BEF or any of the above in your thread. You make it sound like someone had a choice between JB4 or MHD. And went JB4. Don't be silly |
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08-02-2018, 06:53 PM | #9 | |
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Someone just doesn't get it:
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Please, give us a reason. Your DME is now flashable so the fact that it wasn't at some point in the past is not a valid reason to still run a JB4. You may have read the OP, but you clearly do not understand it. For your own good, go back and study it before you post a reply. |
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WeekendWarriorz670.00 |
08-02-2018, 07:37 PM | #10 | |
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08-02-2018, 07:54 PM | #11 |
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Dinan and PPK both suck cuz they're weak-ass and have no support for pulling a bin to edit yourself, so that's really quite irrelevant. This thread is about why people TODAY would use a Junk Box Fourth Edition, when we have full access to all the tables necessary to create a great flash tune.
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08-02-2018, 08:37 PM | #12 | |
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08-02-2018, 10:43 PM | #13 |
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I would agree with him, because those two tunes are crap and not worth considering. Also, his DME may have been bench flashable by some obscure and rather expensive tuners at the time (I remember figures of $1000 for a canned remap) but I don't have proof of that.
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08-03-2018, 10:15 AM | #14 | |
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The more and more you talk, the more and more you expose yourself as a fanboi |
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08-03-2018, 12:29 PM | #15 | |
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08-03-2018, 01:58 PM | #17 |
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Completely happy with my Dinan tune. Just wanted a small tune that I wouldn't have to ever to bother with once it was flashed. 355 hp and 401 lb-ft is plenty for my needs.
Also have PPK and love the sound. And yes, you can stack Dinan on PPK and still get all the wonderful PPK sounds. Proof is here. I know you can get burbles with MHD, but again, you have to fiddle with the settings to get just you want. With my tunes, absolutely no fiddling. Completely flash and forget. Just want I wanted. OP, I know you like to argue and will probably tell me I paid too much and I can get better for less, but as I said, I'm completely happy. You love to tell people they're wrong and your choices are the only right ones, so please, go right ahead if you want to. I stated my case and have nothing left to contribute to this thread.
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Last edited by Esteban; 08-03-2018 at 03:03 PM.. |
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08-03-2018, 02:10 PM | #18 | |
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Why are you so dead on JB4 at all costs? Fanboi? Some of the quickest cars out there use the BEF combo. No issues. |
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08-03-2018, 02:31 PM | #19 | |
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A fanboi is someone who supports a particular product or brand. I say, use whatever is best...and in your situation that is definitely NOT a JB4 for reasons explained in the OP. I have no issues with people choosing the flash tune of their choice. I do have an issue with a deceptively marketed product which has no place in the current N54 / N55 tuning scene except for the special cases noted above. As for the fast cars, many of those cars are running special-case things like auxiliary fueling or water/meth, which are situations where a JB4 makes sense, since the stock ECU is not setup to run that stuff. You're not running auxiliary fueling, meth, nitrous or anything like that, so why you would spend more money to make your car less reliable is still beyond me. |
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08-03-2018, 02:59 PM | #20 | |
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Your argument is with people who claim it's better than a tune, and would buy it today and argue it as such. I'm not sure there are any of those people. |
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08-03-2018, 03:04 PM | #21 | |
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I would add, however, that it probably makes more sense to take the thing out for reliability purposes alone if nothing else. No point in having additional points of failure in the form of unnecessary connections, and another computer, any of which will cause problems if they fail. |
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08-03-2018, 03:14 PM | #22 | |
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I have the Cobb. I liked it over the JB4 for a variety of reasons. There's better out now, but not back then. It works well enough and is good enough I have just been keeping it. I'm interested in something else but have other hobbies to tend to and my car budget is exhausted for a while (no pun intended) after swapping every fluid and filter throughout, as well as tires. |
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