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| 05-01-2010, 12:22 PM | #221 |
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Sorry, I am not sure why my post was deleted. There was no reason given, it was not spam, and obviously I'm still here.
I bought my wheels as part of this group buy back in January just like all of the rest of you. I did not know about this forum at the time. I was excited about putting these Forgestar rims on my C30. My car will be the first C30 with Forgestars. Very few aftermarket suppliers make products for my car so, I was happy to find wheels that look unique. Kevin told me I would have my wheels in 4-6 weeks. I then asked, what if things went wrong? What is the absolute longest it could take? Kevin said 8 weeks. This sounded acceptable to me. In March, I was concerned about not hearing anything from **********s about my wheels and sent them an email. I was told my wheels would be delivered in 5-6 weeks. This was not good. I had things planned and paid for involving my car but, what can you do? After 5-6 weeks, I was again concerned that I had heard nothing about my wheels. I emailed **********s again to inquire about them. I was told my wheels would be here in yet another 5-6 weeks. I again had planned and paid for things involving my car with new wheels on it and would have to lose my money and miss out. I was pretty angry and emailed Kevin my concerns. Like many others who have complained, I was now apparently on **********s ignore list. That final email has never been responded too even to this posting. Fast forward to yesterday and 2 different BMW friends of mine who I've shared my wheel troubles with told me about this forum and the refund post by Kevin. While I was dissappointed that I wouldn't get my unique forgestar wheels, at least I could get my funds back, carry on with some much less unique equipment, and stop destroying my winter tires. I called and requested my funds back. I figured it wouldn't be a problem since Kevin posted it. He also posted that our wheels wouldn't be in production until at least next week. So, I felt it was a win win for everyone. On the phone, I was treated poorly. I was denied my refund. I was tranferred to multiple people, I was put on hold multiple times. I was told I could only have 50% of my money back and **********s considered my wheels "custom" as soon as the generic, uncut, undrilled, unmodified blanks were put on a boat in China. I explained my position to multiple persons, referenced the plain facts and details posted by Kevin on this site, and was still denied. **********s will not return your money once they have it, for any reason. It has nothing to do with being stuck with custom wheels. It has everything to do with greed at their customers expense. I was told by Kevins manager that he would only cancel the order with forgestar if I spent the money on something else from **********s. He would not return money. Unfortunately **********s does not carry any products for my car except coilovers that I already have or another custom wheel order. This time with HRE for $5K-$6K I'd imagine. So there you have it, my experience with the complete lack of customer service at **********s. |
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| 05-01-2010, 04:06 PM | #222 |
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Welcome to my world. It's too bad you didn't look me up first. I experienced similar customer disservice. The people at Forgestar were reasonable, but **********s - I won't don't do business with them again either.
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135i, SGM, Coral, Sport Package, Auto, Premium Hifi, USB/ipod, Apex EC-7s, PPK Stage II
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| 05-01-2010, 08:44 PM | #223 | |
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Colonel
 
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Quote:
Ima go ahead and delete any bookmarked items I have from them right aways, thanks for the clarification Wow  |
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| 05-01-2010, 10:33 PM | #224 |
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I am a Pontiac G8 guy...and the few of us who have ordered Forgestars from **********s have had issues too.
In my case, the wheels were delivered within 6-7 weeks which I was quoted, but I had some finish issues. I told **********s, and they said they told Forgestar. MB told me that FS wanted nothing to do with it. I then contact FS, and they said MB didn't tell them anything. Forgestar made the issue right directly by refunding me $100 in order to cover half of the cost to have the F14's powdercoated, which I requested from them. So I put the blame 100% on MB now for thier crappy customer service. The told me they'd give me $50 for my troubles in store credit, but they don't carry anything for us G8'ers. So I just asked for a couple shirts that I use for rags in the garage  .LOL, in summary, I am very happy with my Forgestars.....and next time I'll work definately with a different vendor like pyspeed or anyone else. I get so many compliments on these wheels it's not even funny! Good luck to you guys waiting for these, I hope you get them before winter. -Ryan |
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| 05-03-2010, 08:27 PM | #226 | |
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Quote:
So, I'm back here again because of some car enthusiast buddies. We were discussing how this GB went so horribly wrong this weekend. I have taken part in dozens of group buys over the years and sometimes things go wrong but, I've never seen one get this far off track. The reason is communication and the desire to actually keep customers. Let's forget about the original promises of 4-6 week deliveries and "barrels to cover this GB already in house" and discuss... In every other problem GB the vendor made contact with the customers, not the other way around. The vendor explained the problem, outlined what was being done to correct it, and made concessions to keep the customer happy. **********s has done nothing. Even the one or two apologies appear to have been forced. **********s didn't come here and announce any delays, they didn't even email anyone about it. We had to go to them even though the products original ship date is now in triple over time. **********s didn't outline how the problem was being resolved, they just posted form letters again and again with the dates changed. Lastly, they didn't offer any concessions. They never did anything but blame someone else. Every other vendor gave up small gift certificates or made the shipping free, anything to demonstrate they were willing to make the customer feel wanted. **********s posts read like we should feel lucky they are letting us buy wheels from them. With ship dates now in the 4-6 month range instead of the originally promised 4-6 week range. **********s should be upgrading everyone to overnight delivery free of any extra charges in order to insure customers are getting their wheels as soon as humanly possible. It frightens me to think they actually think people will keep being their customers. |
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| 05-03-2010, 11:47 PM | #229 | |||
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Quote:
Again, ETA .... Estimated Time of Arrival everything given to you was an ETA. Again, I do not forecast for Forgestar, I do not ship these wheels from overseas to the U.S, I do not cut and shave the offsets of these wheels, and I do not personally see them ship to your doors. I am a **********s Sales Representative, I represent **********s and Forgestar. It's unfortunate that I have to wake up to this every day and think of different ways to tell you the same thing. I relay ETA's that are given to me and these are all beyond my control. You guys make is seem like in February I intentionally sold you products that I knew were not going to be delivered on time. THAT IS NOT THE CASE, my hands are tied here all I can do is do my best to make things right, but only in the guidelines that I am allowed to. We are a legitimate buisness, and we have policies and procedures that I must follow or I lose my job. In regards to your impression of our customer service, I believe that I have gone above and beyond to provide you and anyone else with customer service. I've always been respectful and never cursed to anyone. Do you agree that maybe both sides of the story should be told? I don't think I deserved a verbal lashing over the phone and threats that you will purposely make a user name on various forums to discredit me. Why should I stand for this libel? Again you are welcome to your store credit or the refund that you agreed to on your Special Order Form. Quote:
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Now I appreciate the suggestions you've made here. Yes, I could have notified you guys about the delays on the forums and yes, that original response was an e-mail sent to a customer that I thought explained the situation so well that it was worth me copying and pasting. Basically the same information I don't know how many different ways I have to tell you guys the same thing. Again, I don't want to point fingers here and just dump the blame on Forgestar. BUT AGAIN, everything I relay to you guys is information that I'm being told by Forgestar. I can't help that you guys don't want to hear what I have to say. It's beyond my control, I don't own either of the companies, I can't make executive decisions, so feel free to continue to BASH, FLAME, and SH*T on me all you want, it's not going to change anything. Kevin************.com |
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| 05-04-2010, 12:12 AM | #230 | |
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Quote:
–verb (used with object) 1.to give back or restore (esp. money); repay. 2.to make repayment to; reimburse. –verb (used without object) 3.to make repayment. You transferred me to Ron, your manager who offered to put my money towards coilovers (already got 'em) or HRE wheels (extremely expensive). I declined and told HIM If I was not given the refund you stated was available, I would then just join these GB forums and tell everyone honestly how I was treated, and that the statement made about refunds was false. This is what I did in 100% honest fashion. I did not lie. I did not embelish. My statement is what happened. What was the purpose of you stating a refund is available if it is not? Does this make sense to any one? |
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| 05-04-2010, 01:09 AM | #231 | |
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For now, as all deadlines have passed for me, all I can do is wait. Slap the wheels on my car when they arrive, send you a snapshot, and hope that if we ever do meet again it will end as well as it began. Please keep me as updated on my wheels as you can. Last edited by 1Buster; 05-04-2010 at 01:36 AM.. Reason: spelling and grammar |
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| 05-05-2010, 02:17 PM | #232 | ||
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Hey 1Buster check this thread...
http://www.planet-9.com/site-vendors...wheels-16.html Post#311 Quote:
Quote:
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| 05-05-2010, 11:16 PM | #233 |
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Second Lieutenant
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If you haven't received your wheels, be happy.
If you haven't received your wheels, be happy. Here is my story. Keep in mind that this is my only opinion, as I am just a person who feels aggrieved.
The good: I was very fortunate to have been one of the first recipients of the Forgestar F14 wheel group buy. As written in my positive review, I praised them for relatively quick delivery of product, and what seemed to be a quality wheel. See here: http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showpos...&postcount=133 The bad: Well, two and a half months and 1,200 miles later, the rear driver's side wheel developed a hairline crack. You can see it in the pictures at the bottom. There was no trauma to the wheel, no potholes, and good roads in my part of Maryland. The wheel could be sold as brand new - that is how pristine and clean it is. The wheel is round, and has no scars or abrasions that would indicate misuse. But, it leaks air through this crack that has been verified with soapy water and a wheel shop. They stated that it is likely that I could claim the wheel was defective, although it can be difficult, because the wheel shows no signs of damage anywhere, is round, but cracked. So I called **********s and Forgestar to seek an answer. They initially stated that they could not help because the wheel was damaged through my use. I continued to assert that the wheel was not damaged through my negligence, and that I took it to a shop, and would have it inspected by other shops if necessary, to prove that the wheel was not damaged through the normal signs of misuse such as an out-of-round wheel or with visible damage. Plus, even under normal use, in just over two months and 1,200 miles??? I am now stuck without the use of my car, and had to purchase a new set of wheels because I need to get around, and I am genuinely skeptical about the strength of the wheels. I talked to a person at **********s/Forgestar who initially seemed like a reasonable person, but I learned that I don't like the way he approached business when he told me the following: (1) that I should not have sold my old wheels (I sold them to help pay for these), (2) that I should either use my spare (Idon't have one - convertible came with runflat tires) or get a temporary wheel for the months until the new wheel came in (I don't want to drive my car the whole summer on a donut or mismatched wheel), and (3) that if I wanted money for the wheel that my best bet would be to find a pothole in my city and run my car over it and seek recourse with the city. That last item really made me question the quality of person and organization that I was dealing with for many reasons. I am not a lawyer, I am a professional in another industry, but very familiar with the law and legal theories, and told Mod Bargains that I felt that they may have breached a few rules which include: (1) Breach of the implied warranty of merchantability. This is a warranty for goods that are sold, and is the default. It says that if you buy something, that it must be fit for the use it is being sold for. (2) Breach of explicit warranty. The warranty states the following: "Forgestar warrants that wheels manufactured by Forgestar will be free from structural failure as long as the original retail purchaser owns the product. Forgestar further warrants to the original purchaser that products manufactured by Forgestar will be free from defects in material and workmanship under normal and intended use for a period of one year from retail purchase." They initially (up to now actually when they changed their minds) stated that because it cannot be proven that the wheel had a defect, that they are not responsible for the warranty, but might "do me a favor." (3) Breach of contract. For not adhering to the agreement to consider a wheel warrantable. First of all, the language of the explicit warranty was theirs to create, and they had the liberty to do whatever they wanted with it. The thing is, when you make a promise, and people make a purchase in reliance on that promise in purchasing the product, and at that point you cannot renege. Forgestar was free to say "no warranty once mounted to a wheel." That is fine. It would also attract less customers. Rather, they provided a reasonable "warranty" on paper and fail to adhere to it. This is illusory, in bad faith, and a breach of contract. (4) Fraudulent Misrepresentation. If a company knows that defects will not be provable by the purchaser, it knows that the warranty is illusory. It misrepresented the product. Part of a product is the service, warranty, and support that comes with it. Many people would not have purchased the wheels without the security of knowing that if the wheel fails with no signs of user negligence, and as long as, per the contractual "under normal and intended use" that they would be safe. (5) Failure to adhere to the implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing. When a contract has terms that give one party a lot of discretionary power, it must be used wisely. I feel that by misleading or constructively misleading people with respect to the wait times for the wheels, that they are not being fair. All of (our) money is tied up at **********s and we have little recourse but to wait. If that is not enough, consider that you can still make an order on their website right now for some of these wheels. A reputable company would state something like "back ordered" or "out of stock - check back in 60 days" or the like. Again, the company is attempting to get the best of both worlds. To take the money, prevent competition from receiving the business, and to ship whenever, although I bet they have a really good idea of why these wheels have not been created that they are not telling us. The same "having it both ways" applies to the attracting people through an illusory warranty and then changing it like they initially did to me to include "only the hub and spokes." (I questioned where the representative got that one, and apparently he dropped his made-up rule). (6) Failure to create a strong wheel? I am not sure what the numbers mean on the wheels, but I now have doubts as to the strength of these wheels because I did not perform in any way outside of the normal use of the wheel. I am concerned that if I had hit a pothole, or bump at 60 miles per hour or more, that the wheel would shatter, or whatever happens when a wheel cracks at that speed. I am going to look into how wheels are made and certified. Some of this legal stuff might be better suited for a lawyer to opine on, but I think a lot is valid. Especially the common sense stuff like five months is too long to consider a valid warranty replacement period, or that if it takes you five months to provide a product quoted for delivery in less than two months, that the buyer is entitled to a refund. To conclude, I'm just a guy who wants to drive his car this summer, and has now purchased two sets of wheels, and all the mounting/balancing and what not to do. I am upset, but I still feel that my story and opinion can be helpful to others who have had similar occurrences. To **********s/Forgestar, I think you would be better off if you had a better relationship with your manufacturer in China or wherever. Alternatively, you could stock certain sizes, or at least collect only part of the money from buyers until their orders shipped. There must be a way to offer custom wheels without the mess you have created. I just wanted my money back because to wait several months for a replacement is unacceptable, especially after having to fight for that, and knowing that there is nothing preventing the new wheel from being damaged through normal use either.     |
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| 05-06-2010, 12:17 AM | #234 |
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Colonel
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Drives: 2017 Audi A4
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 Looks like the shit is just piling higher n higher against these guys... Hate to sound like an ass but goddamn am I glad I havent tried buying anything from these guys. The wheel thing might just be a fluke, but either way, this is a warranted product, def should have received money back for the one, or maybe they could front you the money it would take to repair the wheel so you could atleast drive the car while forgestar was sending you a new one.. That would make the most sense, you go to a shop, get a quote for the repair and fax it to MB's, they send you the money ASAP so you can repair it. I suppose if you were to have it repaired there wouldnt be much need for a replacement..but that would be the most efficient and easiest alternative for you so you could get back on the road the fastest, assuming the repair might take a few days. |
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| 05-06-2010, 12:19 AM | #235 |
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Colonel
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Drives: 2017 Audi A4
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Oh and btw ..
http://www.wheelcollision.com/index.html Great rep wheel shop in central PA, not sure how far a drive would be for you, but supposedly they are very fast and great at what they do.  |
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| 05-06-2010, 12:26 AM | #236 |
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Second Lieutenant
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Thanks, That is one of two large locations near here that does this type of repair. The other is "Ye Olde Wheel Shop" in Maryland, who I visited (among others). I may be sending them a wheel and then selling my set of four with a big disclaimer "wheel repaired." I just know that I did not overstress the wheel, and I have read a lot about wheel cracks, and wheel integrity. I feel that I don't want my wheels, and also feel that to sell them to someone and not tell them would be nearly criminal.
I have just had enough. I'm tired. I feel for you that have not heard anything yet. And I did suggest the repair thing to them. They were intent on receiving the wheel back. We had a long discussion about me sending the wheel to them because they were not going to fix it, just evaluate it, and I live in a townhouse community and know for a fact that my car will be towed in two days if I were to leave it in a disabled condition, let alone a few months. MB/FS just did not seem to understand that I am stuck. If anyone wants four 18x8.5 F14 wheels with one that will be repaired at some point in the future, let me know. |
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| 05-06-2010, 08:27 AM | #237 |
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Wow....another wheel drama. I really feel bad for you guys that are getting screwed on these deals, or waiting forever. I've been on the verge of jumping into one of these group buys several times, and it's only by (what I thought was bad) luck that I'm not in the same boat.
Everytime I see one of these threads promising wheels to fit our cars at a decent price I think "Wow that's a good deal!", and then I think "maybe just a little too good to be true". After seeing all the issues with Chinese wheels on these boards, I don't think I'd touch them, or deal with the vendors that are pushing them. Good luck. |
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| 05-06-2010, 08:39 AM | #238 |
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Fill out this form if you have a complaint that has not been adequately resolved
http://www.la.bbb.org/BusinessFind.aspx?Target=c
Better Business Bureau A company is free to do what it wants, but others should be aware of what involvement with the company entails. |
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| 05-06-2010, 11:53 AM | #239 | |
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Well this just keeps getting better and better.  Last edited by 1Buster; 05-06-2010 at 11:56 AM.. Reason: added quote to avoid confusion |
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| 05-06-2010, 01:21 PM | #240 |
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Delivery Issues
First I would like to issue a formal apology for the delay with the first group buy in the 18".
Forgestar Wheels was created to produce an affordable lightweight custom flow formed wheel. Flow Formed wheels were originally developed for Formula 1 racing wheels, and now we are bringing this technology to the marketplace. This demand has created back orders and Mod Bargains has been getting most of the heat for the delays but in reality those delays rely strictly on our shoulders. I am glad to announce that all of the orders from the first 18" groupbuy are currently in production as we speak, and we should be delivering those wheels in the next 3-4 weeks. We appreciate the support and patience that everyone has endured through the last few months, and we know when you finally get the product you will be in love. We have also tripled our stocking orders so that in the future all 18" orders placed from Mod Bargains can be delivered in a month. We want everyone that purchases Forgestar wheels to have a great experience, and when a thread like this pops up we realize that we need more improvement and communication with the dealers and customers. At the end of the day we want to offer you the best engineered product with all the features you want at the best price. That is what the entire team here at Forgestar Wheels strives for everyday. Thank you for allowing us to serve you. |
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| 05-06-2010, 01:25 PM | #241 |
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I'm getting this feeling that it's better if I just don't venture into this thread for a week or so, to calm my nerves.....
*edit Forgestar, could you please send me all of your contact info via PM please. Thanks |
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| 05-06-2010, 01:35 PM | #242 |
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nlink720,
I am so sorry to hear you are having problems with your Forgestar product. We do understand your inconvenience with having to send your damaged wheel back, but we do need the wheel back so we can send it to the lab for analysis. We are working to see if we can find you a priority replacement in our warehouse or on the next shipment. On the statement of testing, I don't not think that is a wheel manufacturer in the United States that stresses wheel testing more than Forgestar wheels. We are active members of the SEMA Wheel Tire Council and actively participate in discussions of new wheel testing standards. Forgestar wheels are thoroughly tested first in our own VIA verified LAB. Then the wheels are sent to Japan to be tested again by JWL and VIA and given a registration number. The wheels are again tested a third time in the United States by independent third-party test laboratory, Standard Testing Labs (STL) with the new SAE(J2530) test standards. I think we are one of the very few wheel companies that openly publishes wheel test results on our website. Results are located at http://www.forgestar.com/v1/testdata.php Last edited by Forgestar Wheels; 05-06-2010 at 04:49 PM.. |
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