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      09-22-2011, 06:02 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blue2fire View Post
Did you call BMW of Austin for a quote?
Nah haven't had a chance, I did send them an email though. No response yet.

IDK for the price with install I think I might opt for the Performance exhaust instead.
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      09-22-2011, 06:15 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublevanosrc View Post
Nah haven't had a chance, I did send them an email though. No response yet.

IDK for the price with install I think I might opt for the Performance exhaust instead.
My understanding is that while exhaust mods (opening up the flow) can give you more power at the high rev end, it does nothing or even worsen the low end torque (some restriction is needed to generate torque at low revs).
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      09-22-2011, 06:16 PM   #25
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How would you know if you even need Version 2 ? Woulden't Version 1 be good enough?
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      09-22-2011, 06:17 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by New21er View Post
How would you know if you even need Version 2 ? Woulden't Version 1 be good enough?
Not sure if serious...

Answer these...
How do you know if you have enough money?
How do you know if you have enough memory (for your computer)?
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      09-22-2011, 09:08 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by New21er View Post
How would you know if you even need Version 2 ? Woulden't Version 1 be good enough?
V2 is added cooling, no extra power.
It's the SAME software.

The extra cooling is for those who want extra cooling for potentially longer engine life, and extra peace of mind.
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      09-22-2011, 09:20 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blschaefer1 View Post
Hi all,

This is a mini review of the BMW Performance Power Kit, Stage 1. I had this kit installed today on my 2012 (N55) 135i M Sport with DCT.

This is the software only version of the PPK. Special pricing is now available on this kit until year end, MSRP now $599.00. The part number for my car was 11 12 2219 489. The kit is really just a software update, and a BMW Performance Power Kit sticker that is applied under the hood. Also, there are ‘warning’ stickers that get applied in various places under the hood to alert technicians to the existence of the kit so they don’t accidentally overwrite it or something during service.

I was in and out of the dealership in about two hours today. The car was hooked up to the ISIS computer almost the whole time. No issues whatsoever though. My dealer gave me a deal on the kit, total price out the door including installation and tax was $728.36.

I obviously only have limited time in the car since the upgrade was performed, but early ‘seat of the pants’ impressions are that it certainly feels like more than a 20hp / 17ft. lb. gain. Throttle response is much improved, and not there was a turbo lag issue before, but now there is literally none. Part of this could be placebo effect having just shelled out the $$$, but I don’t think so. The car feels much more responsive, particularly in Sport and S modes. I also think the new software re-mapped the shift logic in the DCT, gears seem to be held a little longer, and shifts are quicker and crisper. Idle seems a little lumpier perhaps. Also, noticed that oil temperature has increased about 5-10 degrees, no biggie, just an observation. Feels great.

I will report back if I have additional insights. Overall, I am very happy with the upgrade. Money well spent in my book, and having full BMW warranty support is good peace of mind.

Update 9/22/11

Having spend more time in the car, the difference in midrange pull is SUBSTANTIAL. Certainly feels like much more than 17 lb ft gain in torque. Would love to see before and after dyno graphs. I would say BMW's figures are very conservative indeed. Waste gate is working harder, presumably from increased boost. I notice no difference in exhaust note. I think the 'burble' people are referring to is supposed to occur in overrun situations, and I have not faced that yet. For daily driving, no difference.
Thanks for the write up.

Have you driven an N54?

I've not driven an N55, so I don't can't compare them.
Given that the N55 doesn't have a throttle plate to suck air past, I would think that it already has better throttle response than an N54.
Please comment on your experience between the two, if you've driven the N54.

It's great if throttle response has improved.
I do want to hear from N54 owners though, as my N54's throttle response went from OK to "what the FK?", after last years software update. There have been a number of us N54 drivers who don't like what that software did to throttle "response".

I'm not talking about turbo lag, as these engines (N54) do have some lag, but not much. I'm talking about throttle response, how the engine responds to subtle changes in throttle application when the engine is at mid rpm, and the turbo's are spooled, say around 4000rpm.

If this software fixes that that's a positive.
But, I don't want to have to shell out $700 to fix something that shouldn't be happening in the first place.
If I decide to keep my 135i after next year I might do it, more for the throttle fix than the modest 17lb ft.
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      09-22-2011, 09:51 PM   #29
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      09-22-2011, 11:57 PM   #30
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I am interested in the fix for throttle/ turbo lag issue. When I went to the CCC here in Seattle I got to do things that would be a "ticket" any where else. One of the drills was to acclerate (floor it) and then stop with in a certain spot. DCT btw. When I floored my car there was a delay of a second or two, which to me was disappointing. I wonder if Version 1 might help this ??
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      09-23-2011, 03:50 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianf2002 View Post
Can't see how this is worth it. Stock the car is 306HP. THE PPK takes it to 320HP.

So 14HP @ $700!!
Reviews that have the dyno put the gain at 25-30 HP. The torque is the bigger story, 35 lb ft! Either way, it keeps the refinement that you expect from a BMW I6 and is engineered to be reliable in all conditions you might encounter in the US.

I want that over a product made in a garage. I also would like my dealer to fix problems when they arise instead of asking fellow 18-24 year olds on a forum and banging my head to the wall.

If you have a procede, it is 100% not aimed at you, honestly.
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      09-23-2011, 10:02 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianf2002 View Post
Can't see how this is worth it. Stock the car is 306HP. THE PPK takes it to 320HP.


So 14HP @ $700!!
Hey, people are buying exhuast for $1K+ for minimal gains if any except noise. So on the retail price for BMW PE at $1250 for 5hp (MAAAYBE) now that's hardly worth calling a performance product. It's really more like auditory stimulation.

Power Kit V1 look to actually provide real improvements especially to those of us that have had BMW's SW update for the fuel pumps that appears to have dulled the car some and plan to keep that car for an extended period of time.

Yes there are more powerful tunes and that point has been made. However none are factory backed. As previous people have stated it's a hassle free bump in power/response with piece of mind.
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      09-23-2011, 10:44 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM90 View Post
Thanks for the write up.

Have you driven an N54?

I've not driven an N55, so I don't can't compare them.
Given that the N55 doesn't have a throttle plate to suck air past, I would think that it already has better throttle response than an N54.
Please comment on your experience between the two, if you've driven the N54.

It's great if throttle response has improved.
I do want to hear from N54 owners though, as my N54's throttle response went from OK to "what the FK?", after last years software update. There have been a number of us N54 drivers who don't like what that software did to throttle "response".

I'm not talking about turbo lag, as these engines (N54) do have some lag, but not much. I'm talking about throttle response, how the engine responds to subtle changes in throttle application when the engine is at mid rpm, and the turbo's are spooled, say around 4000rpm.

If this software fixes that that's a positive.
But, I don't want to have to shell out $700 to fix something that shouldn't be happening in the first place.
If I decide to keep my 135i after next year I might do it, more for the throttle fix than the modest 17lb ft.
I have driven an N54-based 335i 6MT Coupe, albeit briefly. You are correct, in that there is inherently less turbo lag in the N55, and it is quite noticeable. It is difficult (for me at least) to separate throttle response from turbo lag, but what I have paid attention to since the PPK install is the crispness / quickness and urgency of the engine response to subtle changes in throttle has clearly improved.
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      09-23-2011, 11:09 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blue2fire View Post
Reviews that have the dyno put the gain at 25-30 HP. The torque is the bigger story, 35 lb ft!
Links?

This is what I expected, based on dynos of stock vehicles and one dyno I found for the 335is.
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      09-23-2011, 12:57 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBK View Post
First of all, it's 20HP.
Here's my problem with aftermarket software.
Say you take your car to BMW for a fix, say the fuel pump for example.
Now, if you cared enough to ask, you might find out that they re-flash your software as part of that fix. If you didn't ask, you'd just lost your money on the aftermarket... you'd drive around thinking you have a super dupper modded engine when it's just a plain old Jane. Ignorance is bliss, I guess.
Now what? You take your car back to Dinan/Cobb/etc and ask them to re-apply their tune? Even if they were accepting and did it for free, you'd lose half of your fuel pump fix (BMW reflashed your software for a reason, after all).
What do you do?
Couple things...first off, you'd definitely know your tune was overwritten when you got behind the wheel of your car again. The Cobb/JB4/Dinan/etc tunes give a serious bump in power and you'd certainly notice if it went missing.

Secondly, while I agree that you could lose some added functionality from a BMW reflash that helps out a specific component(s) (i.e. fuel pump is a big one), those non OEM tunes are constantly updating as well. I'm definitely not saying they're going to be as effective as a BMW tune, but just pointing out they're not stagnant. Also, some of those tunes are easily reapplied anyway. Cobb has a handheld tuner that you can do from your house and Dinan customers have been known to get free reflashes if their software gets overwritten, but I think that policy varies by location. I've heard some say Dinan always has done it for them for free and others say they get charged ~$50 to put back the software they already bought (pretty crappy IMO).

I prefer the BMW route which is why I got the PPK, but just thought I'd elaborate on the aftermarket tunes a little.

Quote:
Originally Posted by New21er View Post
How would you know if you even need Version 2 ? Woulden't Version 1 be good enough?
As mentioned before: version 2 = better cooling hardware and that's it. No hard and fast rule for who "needs" this, guess it depends on how hard you push your car.

If BMW thought the hardware was a requirement for the V1 tune they wouldn't sell them separately.
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      09-23-2011, 01:02 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blschaefer1 View Post
Also, noticed that oil temperature has increased about 5-10 degrees, no biggie, just an observation. Feels great.
Has your oil temperature stayed 5-10 higher than normal? My initial guess was the temp spike came from you enjoying your new mod, but if they're still staying that high under normal cruising conditions that might not be the case.

With the "Version 2" PPK my running temps have consiistently dropped by about the same amount under normal driving conditions. If I drive aggressively, the temp will go higher of course, I'm just talkin averge oil temp.
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      09-23-2011, 01:16 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wings0fRed View Post
Has your oil temperature stayed 5-10 higher than normal? My initial guess was the temp spike came from you enjoying your new mod, but if they're still staying that high under normal cruising conditions that might not be the case.

With the "Version 2" PPK my running temps have consiistently dropped by about the same amount under normal driving conditions. If I drive aggressively, the temp will go higher of course, I'm just talkin averge oil temp.
Actually, having driven the car more now, the temp is about the same as it used to be on the highway. Around town it runs a few degrees hotter, and yes, that could be easily explained by the increased 'grin factor' of me playing with the extra power.
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      09-23-2011, 02:53 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBK View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublevanosrc View Post
Nah haven't had a chance, I did send them an email though. No response yet.

IDK for the price with install I think I might opt for the Performance exhaust instead.
My understanding is that while exhaust mods (opening up the flow) can give you more power at the high rev end, it does nothing or even worsen the low end torque (some restriction is needed to generate torque at low revs).
This is wrong. 1960's engine theory does not apply here. An engine is an air pump. More in more out more power.
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      09-23-2011, 03:08 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L8*Apex View Post
This is wrong. 1960's engine theory does not apply here. An engine is an air pump. More in more out more power.
The (simplistic) analogy to an air pump is the true 1960's reference.
Two engines sucking in the exact same amount of air. One changes ignition point based on rpm (essentially VANOS), and the other doesn't. One generates more HP than the other.
There's so many little tweaks a modern engine can make... to call it simply an air pump is naive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aftermarket_exhaust_parts
Free-flowing exhaust systems may maximize peak horsepower; this is typically accomplished by making the path as straight as possible, using a consistent diameter throughout the system and eliminating obstacles such as catalytic converters and pre-catalytic converters or by replacing the muffler with a less restrictive (and usually louder) one. In a naturally aspirated engine, this may result in the use of oversized piping which may negatively affect low-end torque (forced induction engines are not as susceptible to this side effect). Furthermore, despite the potential (albeit generally slight) performance increases possible by eliminating catalytic converters and other emissions control hardware, doing so will often render the vehicle illegal for street use in many jurisdictions. Other aftermarket modifications that bypass the catalytic converters and/or mufflers, such as electric or cable activated exhaust cutouts—which open and reroute the exhaust flow to bypass restrictions in the system—can similarly increase performance, though would likely be illegal in areas where tampering with emissions devices is prohibited, particularly when placed in front of the catalytic converters.
Show me your source.

Last edited by MPBK; 09-24-2011 at 03:23 PM..
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      09-23-2011, 03:39 PM   #40
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Did you over look this part?

(forced induction engines are not as susceptible to this side effect).
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      09-23-2011, 03:43 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaC-N54-E82 View Post
Did you over look this part?

(forced induction engines are not as susceptible to this side effect).
Not as susceptible doesn't mean the effect doesn't exist.
My original point stands: free flow exhausts have negative effect on low end torque.
Most people don't redline their engines. Even if they do, it's a fraction of a second. Most of the time, low end torque is more important, especially for city driving.
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      09-23-2011, 03:43 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blschaefer1 View Post
Actually, having driven the car more now, the temp is about the same as it used to be on the highway. Around town it runs a few degrees hotter, and yes, that could be easily explained by the increased 'grin factor' of me playing with the extra power.
Ok good, that's what I expected. Thanks for the feedback, hope you enjoy the tune!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaC-N54-E82 View Post
Did you over look this part?

(forced induction engines are not as susceptible to this side effect).
Was about to say the same...Granted it IS wikipedia, but still...
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      09-23-2011, 04:15 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPBK View Post
Not as susceptible doesn't mean the effect doesn't exist.
My original point stands: free flow exhausts have negative effect on low end torque.
Most people don't redline their engines. Even if they do, it's a fraction of a second. Most of the time, low end torque is more important, especially for city driving.
Your own source, Wiki, contridicts your statement and you follow it up with your opinion. Solid!
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      09-23-2011, 05:47 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianf2002 View Post
Doubt the gains would be more than what BMW market them as. It would have been worth it if it was 40HP increase instead of 14HP, but then that would compete with the 1M.

I understand the PPK for those wanting to keep their cars original in all respects, but other tunes release so much more power and don't seem to give any issues if set at recommended settings.

The one appealing point of the kit is the the stage 2 added cooling. BMW came VERY short on effective oil/water cooling on these cars.
Not sure about the HP gain, but I am fairly certain the torque gains are more than the 17 ft lbs states. The car has MUCH more torque with this tune, no doubt about it.

Bear in mind that part of BMW's marketing strategy with this SW only kit is to retain would be buyers of 1M's that can't get their hands on a car. Easier to sell them on a moderately priced, upfitted 135i in theory.
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