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      06-09-2010, 04:02 PM   #23
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Where is BMW NA when one of their crappy run flat tires catches a nail and has to be replaced for 400 a piece? let's say you replace your tires with non RFTs and something goes wrong with an axle or something close to the wheel ..what happens next?
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      06-09-2010, 04:39 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrackRat View Post
And that's why we have court rooms to separate personal opinion from legal interpretation of law. You can argue your POV all day long and it means nothing unless the court rules in your favor. Feeling lucky?
Not really. Courts don't 'separate personal opinion from legal interpretation of law. Attorneys (private and District) are charged with that. By the time a case hits a docket and a judge, it better be a case. That's why the warrantor typically backs down if they know their 'case' is really just their 'wish'.

Precendence is your friend my man....

Along with an expert opinion or two every now and then...
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      06-09-2010, 04:55 PM   #25
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It's rather long but here is a site that I refer people to who want to become familiar with their rights and the process steps that could be ahead of them:

http://www.autoguide.com/buyers-guid...enied-881.html

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Originally Posted by Matador View Post
Where is BMW NA when one of their crappy run flat tires catches a nail and has to be replaced for 400 a piece? let's say you replace your tires with non RFTs and something goes wrong with an axle or something close to the wheel ..what happens next?
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      06-09-2010, 05:33 PM   #26
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is this the same in Canada. The MM Act and all that? Or do we have our own Act and interpretation?
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      06-10-2010, 08:35 AM   #27
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Well are ya feeling lucky? If so then take your case to court and see if the car maker wins or if you do. I'd say the manufacturer's expert witnesses, (engineers), might have the technical edge on a so called expert with no scientific test data to support their POV on engineering changes resulting from alterations - if it ever got beyond alterations, which is unlikely as it's a conditional term of a voluntary product warranty. More than likely the alterations effecting Federal auto emissions would also stop Modders dead in their tracks on warranties also as they are likely to be fined $50K per offense. But that's why we have a judicial system to sort out all the POVs.
1) I'm feelin lucky.
2) I win. But I don't get involved with cases where a consumer/owner action has actually damaged a covered part or system. That would not be fair to the manufacturer. However I love helping to call bluff on manufacturers who try to intimidate and deny responsibility by blaming defects and failures on other parts, actions or persons without just cause and adequate evidence.
3) Do you believe that engineers with knowledge, credibility and experience only work for a manufacturer?
4) Do you believe that it is cost effective for a manufacturer to engage the process?
5) Do you believe that current sentiment in the courts is pro manufacturer or pro consumer?
6) The maximum civil penalty for a violation of the auto emissions section by a manufacturer or dealer is $25,000; for any other person, $2,500. Accordingly, any change from the original certified configuration of a vehicle or engine, or the manufacture or sale of a non-original equipment aftermarket part or system could be considered a violation of section 203(a)(3) of the Act. This would include modifications to the fuel delivery system. However this is totally independent of the warranty and MM issue.
7) Have you participated in any legal process or action related to automotive (or other consumer product) warranty and liability issues whereby a manufacturer attempted or threatened to deny coverage dues to a modification?
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      06-10-2010, 10:32 AM   #28
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Right. I'll wait to see all the posts on here with case decisions showing that people with Modded engines have sued the car maker and gotten a court ruling in their favor.
For every one you post where a consumer was denied warranty coverage by a car manufacturer over modifications made to the automobile which was upheld in a court without proof that the consumer-added non-oem part caused the covered oem part to fail, I'll post summary findings of a consumer prevailing in a similar situation.
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      06-10-2010, 12:55 PM   #29
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If I were a manufacturer I would definitely take this case to trial. I want to see the court that makes a manufacturer warranty a product in a form they didn't sell it. I also want to see where the terms and conditions of a warranty can be changed to suit a person who knows from the get go that alterations to the product void the warranty. I'd definitely take that bet in a court of law.
And I absolutely agree with you.

But the mitigating factor here is that an automobile is not a singular product. It is a sum of many different individual parts that are judged, warranted and viewed from a legal perspective as the many parts they are.

If your house comes with a warranty that covers the roof. You change the plastic wall plates on your electrical outlet to a different color and brand than what the builder installed and sold you - you STILL have a roof warranty.

Now if the plastic outlet plates somehow short out the outlets and a fire destroys part of the roof. You have NO warranty because a part you installed caused the damage.

Now if your new outlet plates have NOT caused anything to go wrong in your house and you make a claim to the builder that your roof leaked last time it rained. They just cannot deny your claim on the grounds that you have changed things in the house since you bought it.

Same with the car. Do what you want. You will have a warranty UNLESS something you did actually damages something else in the car that the manufacturer installed as part of the original purchase.
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      06-10-2010, 01:06 PM   #30
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Just let this thread die. It's clear who knows his sh_t and whose just arguing for the sake of argument. I think most readers of this thread got the right message after reading 44 long posts.

Thanks for all the info btw, even tho none of these might even apply in Canada and I don't even do non-OE mods.
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      06-11-2010, 08:21 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BiscottiGelato View Post
Just let this thread die. It's clear who knows his sh_t and whose just arguing for the sake of argument. I think most readers of this thread got the right message after reading 44 long posts.

Thanks for all the info btw, even tho none of these might even apply in Canada and I don't even do non-OE mods.


Thanks for pulling the plug. My fingertips are beginning to heal quite nicely.

Funny thing is the OP had his situation handled long ago and posted it in #31 and then quietly went on his way.

audi2bmw1: "Ok guys after a long convo with the service manager he said I will be fine. "
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      06-11-2010, 11:13 AM   #32
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It's common knowledge that modifying your car with non-BMW parts can and will void your warranty. Why do you think so many here try to *hide* their chips and other mods before taking their car to the dealer?

Why do you think BMW designs software/components that specifically search/identify non-BMW aftermarket equipment?

BMW warrantees apply to stock cars or stock cars with BMW-aftermarket parts.
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      06-11-2010, 12:29 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roundel View Post
It's common knowledge that modifying your car with non-BMW parts can and will void your warranty. Why do you think so many here try to *hide* their chips and other mods before taking their car to the dealer?

Why do you think BMW designs software/components that specifically search/identify non-BMW aftermarket equipment?

BMW warrantees apply to stock cars or stock cars with BMW-aftermarket parts.
?
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