Mini cooper S or wait for 135i

eMINI · 07-02-2007, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

really leaning towards the mini at this point, wonder why they made the 135 so wide & tall, safety?

I'll be more happy in a smaller car, mini + my 74 2002 should do the fix for a few years, by then the 1 series should be bug free

mega, like you, I've come to realize that I prefer small cars. If you can wait until the 135 is available to test drive, you can be sure. Honestly, there's just no other way to know. You could listen to me. I dumped my E36 M3 for an '05 MCS and have zero regrets. I did tweak it a bit to get the power I wanted, but I've never had a car I loved as much as the MINI. That said, I've has my eye on the 135 for several years now. And as soon as it's available in the US, I'll test drive it to see how much fun it's going to be to drive. The bar's pretty high as far as I'm concerned. If the 135 is so refined that I have to do triple digit speeds to enjoy the sensations, I'll just keep the MINI. That was part of my issue with the M3; it was so accomplished that it was sometimes a bit of a bore unless you ignored the law completely. Bottom line, you probably can't go wrong with the MINI or the 135, but only a side-by-side comparison will answer the question you're asking.

krassanova · 07-03-2007, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eMINI

mega, like you, I've come to realize that I prefer small cars. If you can wait until the 135 is available to test drive, you can be sure. Honestly, there's just no other way to know. You could listen to me. I dumped my E36 M3 for an '05 MCS and have zero regrets. I did tweak it a bit to get the power I wanted, but I've never had a car I loved as much as the MINI. That said, I've has my eye on the 135 for several years now. And as soon as it's available in the US, I'll test drive it to see how much fun it's going to be to drive. The bar's pretty high as far as I'm concerned. If the 135 is so refined that I have to do triple digit speeds to enjoy the sensations, I'll just keep the MINI. That was part of my issue with the M3; it was so accomplished that it was sometimes a bit of a bore unless you ignored the law completely. Bottom line, you probably can't go wrong with the MINI or the 135, but only a side-by-side comparison will answer the question you're asking.

I hear you on living it up in the R53 go-kart...it's definitely a great driving experience. I doubt the 135 is going to match the characteristics of the MINI, but his choice is between the R56 and the 1er...I'd wait to see what the 1 is like...

TMK001 · 07-03-2007, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krassanova

This is the first model year of the MINI R56. I'm not really a fan of the changes they have made. I think they hit the nail on the head with the R53 and took a step backwards with the R56.

I had an R53 as well... I am not sold on the R56 either. There is something about it that looks a goofy cartoon version of the original.

imported_mega · 07-03-2007, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMK001

I had an R53 as well... I am not sold on the R56 either. There is something about it that looks a goofy cartoon version of the original.

I could go buy a R53 right now, but I'm not sure I'll be happy with the engine, I have a feeling the R56 will have a lot more power

that and it's extremely hard to find a r53 with an LSD

GrFa · 07-03-2007, 09:12 AM

The LSD is a must. I had two R53s an 03 and 06, both without it. I remember going through a set of front tires on the 03 in 5k miles. If you take a tight turn on the throttle it just burns up the inside front tire. Also, the brakes of an R53 are no where near an e36 M3. I also had two e36 M3s a 95 and a 97. My father currently has a 98. It is one of my favorite cars of all time. Now that they are almost 10 years old, I haven't found something newer to replace it with.

The R53 MINIs are not BMWs. They are raw, and rattly, and twitchy. But they are incredible fun. My problem with the R53s was they always felt like toys, and were a bit too extreme as an everyday driver. I have been seriously looking at the R56 and drove both the Cooper and the S. The new S is really really quick, 0-60 in the high 5s stock. And the basic Cooper without the sport suspension still handled incredibly.

I'm at a loss of what to get. If the 1 is anything like the rest of the newer BMWs it won't be satisfying at all. In which case I should just order one of the first 08 R56s and be done with it.

eMINI · 07-03-2007, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by krassanova

I hear you on living it up in the R53 go-kart...it's definitely a great driving experience. I doubt the 135 is going to match the characteristics of the MINI, but his choice is between the R56 and the 1er...I'd wait to see what the 1 is like...

I'm hopeful that the 135 will provide equivalent fun to my slightly modded R53. If not... I dunno.:frown:

eMINI · 07-03-2007, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

I could go buy a R53 right now, but I'm not sure I'll be happy with the engine, I have a feeling the R56 will have a lot more power

that and it's extremely hard to find a r53 with an LSD

I had the same worries. A reduction pulley, JCW injectors, a piggyback computer and a dyno tune took care of the power even with stock exhaust. Don't compromise on the LSD. The R56 has more power out of the box and more tuning potential, but no supercharger sound.:frown:

eMINI · 07-03-2007, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrFa

I'm at a loss of what to get. If the 1 is anything like the rest of the newer BMWs it won't be satisfying at all. In which case I should just order one of the first 08 R56s and be done with it.

I hope you're wrong about the 135. If not, I'll keep my R53. Raw and twitchy? Not IMO. Incredibly fun? Oh yeah.

Dear BMW: Please give us a 135 that's satisfying enough to bring us over from MINI! We know you're listening. Don't screw this up, please.

fishbulb · 07-03-2007, 11:03 AM

R53 MCS....the gateway BMW. Psssttt...tell your friends!

I agree - give it the size and feel of an R53, with that TT 6 and RWD...sold!

mikeo · 07-03-2007, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishbulb

R53 MCS....the gateway BMW. Psssttt...tell your friends!

I agree - give it the size and feel of an R53, with that TT 6 and RWD...sold!

I agree as well, but it will never be. Why would they build a BMW badged competitor to the MINI? It wouldn't make marketing sense to them.

imported_mega · 07-03-2007, 11:18 AM

isnt the current hatch sold in europe direct competition to the mini?

mikeo · 07-03-2007, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

isnt the current hatch sold in europe direct competition to the mini?

Perhaps, but it is bigger, heavier, doesn't have the turn-in (handling), and with the 4 cyl gas engine under performs an R56 MCS. I wouldn't call that direct competition. That said, I'll agree that BMW probably doesn't mind a 'little' brand/model overlap, but I'll quarantee that it is ALWAYS on their minds.

Propagator · 07-03-2007, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

isnt the current hatch sold in europe direct competition to the mini?

No. They compete in different class. MINI competes in the B (mini) segment, with the likes of VW Polo, Renault Clio, Peugeot 207, Opel Corsa, Honda Fit, Toyota Yaris, etc.

The 1 competes in the C (family hatch) segment, with the likes of VW Golf/GTI, Renault Megane, Peugeot 307, Opel Astra, Honda Civic, etc.

Propagator · 07-03-2007, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eMINI

Dear BMW: Please give us a 135 that's satisfying enough to bring us over from MINI! We know you're listening. Don't screw this up, please.

But you just gave them a reason NOT to make it too much fun!

Drillslinger · 07-03-2007, 05:54 PM

Well, I'd love to be able to afford BOTH my R53 and a 135. I see the MINI as my "cruise through back-roads, mid-speed, let's just have some fun" car. And I foresee the 135 as my Bahn-burner, cruisin down the freeway, balls-to-the-wall red-light rally cruiser/bruiser

imported_mega · 07-03-2007, 06:18 PM

ordered a mcs tonight, red with black roof & bonnet stripes, now the wait begins

mikeo · 07-03-2007, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

ordered a mcs tonight, red with black roof & bonnet stripes, now the wait begins

We ordered our MCS May 23 and will take delivery 7/11. If you have'nt visited northamericanmotoring.com it's worth a look.

GearDriven · 07-03-2007, 09:52 PM

Skipping over the Focus when looking for a daily beater is a bit of a sin. Either get a 2005+ ST or an older SVT... or as an alternative, buy a 2001+ and spend less than $200 for the SVT shocks and springs. It might not be as funky as the mini, but it makes for an affordable beater until you can get the car of your dreams. For me that's either the 128/135 or maybe the next EVO with it's DSG-like system... who knows...

Deutsch · 07-03-2007, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

ordered a mcs tonight, red with black roof & bonnet stripes, now the wait begins

Congrats, you won't regret it!

Though I very much love the 1er coupe I'm a huge fan of the MINI car and brand. Sooner than later there will be a JCW Cooper and Clubman, more like what you see with BMW and M cars, though parts will still be available for purchase by the "do-it-yourself" crowd.

krassanova · 07-03-2007, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spinzero

No. They compete in different class. MINI competes in the B (mini) segment, with the likes of VW Polo, Renault Clio, Peugeot 207, Opel Corsa, Honda Fit, Toyota Yaris, etc.

The 1 competes in the C (family hatch) segment, with the likes of VW Golf/GTI, Renault Megane, Peugeot 307, Opel Astra, Honda Civic, etc.

Europe definitely has some hot hatches. I was in London and Geneva last month and I needed a bib to keep the drool off my shirt. In the US the 1-hatch will compete with the R56 MINI. The good thing that MINI has going for it custom manufacturing, but will that be enough? I think BMW stole the soul from MINI in it's current form, maybe the Clubman will make things better. If not, the BMW 1 (3 or 5 door) is going to look better than the R56.

krassanova · 07-03-2007, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mega

I could go buy a R53 right now, but I'm not sure I'll be happy with the engine, I have a feeling the R56 will have a lot more power

that and it's extremely hard to find a r53 with an LSD

It doesn't sound as if you've driven the R53.

Deutsch · 07-03-2007, 10:33 PM

Equating numbers with performance potential seems to be, by and large an American phenomenon, perhaps a huge contribution to the reasoning used by BMW to ban 4 cylinder BMW's from the U.S. market. Of course I'm being presumptious since there was no mention of the fact.

A car of the MINI's size does not need a helping of HP to be quick, the R53's 4 cyl. provides more than sufficient thrust for getting around town and on the track. i'ts obviously not going to be hugely torquey but that's what the JCW kit is for. The current R56 should be a nice improvement upon the old car, it's important to understand that small cars don't need a lot of power for satisfying performance and handling, more with less should be the thinking here. Frankly I think the 135i is going to prove too much to handle by some, surely many will be lost to novice exploitation of the N54's power.

07-03-2007, 09:12 AM	#27
GrFa Enlisted Member 0 Rep 32 Posts Drives: Mazda3 Rangie Lincoln MGB Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: MA iTrader: (0)	The LSD is a must. I had two R53s an 03 and 06, both without it. I remember going through a set of front tires on the 03 in 5k miles. If you take a tight turn on the throttle it just burns up the inside front tire. Also, the brakes of an R53 are no where near an e36 M3. I also had two e36 M3s a 95 and a 97. My father currently has a 98. It is one of my favorite cars of all time. Now that they are almost 10 years old, I haven't found something newer to replace it with. The R53 MINIs are not BMWs. They are raw, and rattly, and twitchy. But they are incredible fun. My problem with the R53s was they always felt like toys, and were a bit too extreme as an everyday driver. I have been seriously looking at the R56 and drove both the Cooper and the S. The new S is really really quick, 0-60 in the high 5s stock. And the basic Cooper without the sport suspension still handled incredibly. I'm at a loss of what to get. If the 1 is anything like the rest of the newer BMWs it won't be satisfying at all. In which case I should just order one of the first 08 R56s and be done with it.
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07-03-2007, 11:03 AM	#31
fishbulb Private First Class 6 Rep 123 Posts Drives: Join Date: Jul 2007 iTrader: (0)	R53 MCS....the gateway BMW. Psssttt...tell your friends! I agree - give it the size and feel of an R53, with that TT 6 and RWD...sold!
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07-03-2007, 11:18 AM	#33
imported_mega Colonel 122 Rep 2,199 Posts Drives: various bmw's Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: neverland iTrader: (0)	isnt the current hatch sold in europe direct competition to the mini?
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07-03-2007, 05:54 PM	#37
Drillslinger Captain 22 Rep 908 Posts Drives: BSM 1M / R53 / E91 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: No. VA iTrader: (0) Garage List 2011 BMW 1 Series M ... [9.00] 2006 MINI Cooper S [9.60] 2010 328i Wagon [9.60]	Well, I'd love to be able to afford BOTH my R53 and a 135. I see the MINI as my "cruise through back-roads, mid-speed, let's just have some fun" car. And I foresee the 135 as my Bahn-burner, cruisin down the freeway, balls-to-the-wall red-light rally cruiser/bruiser __________________ *Vorsprung durch Gas Geben!!* 172 of 740
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07-03-2007, 06:18 PM	#38
imported_mega Colonel 122 Rep 2,199 Posts Drives: various bmw's Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: neverland iTrader: (0)	ordered a mcs tonight, red with black roof & bonnet stripes, now the wait begins
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07-03-2007, 09:52 PM	#40
GearDriven Registered 0 Rep 1 Posts Drives: Join Date: Jul 2007 iTrader: (0)	Daily Beater Skipping over the Focus when looking for a daily beater is a bit of a sin. Either get a 2005+ ST or an older SVT... or as an alternative, buy a 2001+ and spend less than $200 for the SVT shocks and springs. It might not be as funky as the mini, but it makes for an affordable beater until you can get the car of your dreams. For me that's either the 128/135 or maybe the next EVO with it's DSG-like system... who knows...
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07-03-2007, 10:33 PM	#44
Deutsch Second Lieutenant 50 Rep 249 Posts Drives: Join Date: Nov 2006 iTrader: (0)	Equating numbers with performance potential seems to be, by and large an American phenomenon, perhaps a huge contribution to the reasoning used by BMW to ban 4 cylinder BMW's from the U.S. market. Of course I'm being presumptious since there was no mention of the fact. A car of the MINI's size does not need a helping of HP to be quick, the R53's 4 cyl. provides more than sufficient thrust for getting around town and on the track. i'ts obviously not going to be hugely torquey but that's what the JCW kit is for. The current R56 should be a nice improvement upon the old car, it's important to understand that small cars don't need a lot of power for satisfying performance and handling, more with less should be the thinking here. Frankly I think the 135i is going to prove too much to handle by some, surely many will be lost to novice exploitation of the N54's power.
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