Serious Situation, Need Experienced Help

[jclaib7]

So, I dropped my car off at my local BMW dealer on Thursday for an oil change and spa treatment. I was planning on attending the BMW CCA Boston chapter event at the Larz Anderson museum.

BMW called me on Friday and told me that the vehicle would not start, and they could not figure out why. Long story short they ended up keeping the vehicle and I missed the show.

Today, the service rep called me to let me know that the service tech DID NOT PUT OIL BACK INTO THE VEHICLE! They did drive it from the tech area over to the spa area but I don't know how long it was run.

As you may have guessed, the engine is damaged. The dealer is telling me the lower half of the engine is fine but the cylinder heads and some other items need to be replaced.

Again I have no idea how long they drove it for or how extensive the damage is.

I bought this car as a long term car meant to last 5 to 6 years and I've taken extra good care of it.

What should I be doing? Demanding a new engine? Do they still make the N51 engine.

The fact is, my confidence in the engine is permanently compromised and I'm not sure what my options are....

Any advice would be appreciated.

[NorthernDancer]

Obviously BMW will fix it but the question is how long will they warranty it for. Should be fixed "good as new" so you should get a good warranty, likely longer than you plan on owning it. If you're not happy with what dealer proposes, make sure BMW NA knows about it; they may back the dealer but again, what warranty will they give you.

[hau_nguyen91]

Wow...


I heard that sometimes it's kind of risky to get free oil changes from dealership because you never know if they even change the oil in the first place.


I hope they been changing mine every time I take it in for service..

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by NorthernDancer

Obviously BMW will fix it but the question is how long will they warranty it for. Should be fixed "good as new" so you should get a good warranty, likely longer than you plan on owning it. If you're not happy with what dealer proposes, make sure BMW NA knows about it; they may back the dealer but again, what warranty will they give you.

The service manager called me and admitted that it was totally their mistake and they would do whatever needs to be done to fix the engine. They will be taking the engine apart and inspecting over the next day or so.

My biggest fear is that they come back to me and say that A, B, & C need to be fixed when D & E are compromised as well and should be replaced.

I told him in no uncertain terms that I wanted a new engine but would wait to see what they find.

If they do come back and suggest fixing it, an extended warranty would definitely be part of the discussion.

They said the tech drove it 200 yards from the service bay to the detailing place, but I have no idea how long the engine actually ran. Did it idle awhile? did he rev it up?

[MZWIE]

No way the engine broke in 200 yds. There is enough oil left in there to run engine for quite some time. When I was a teenager we would find old junkers and run them dry just to see what would happen.

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by e34m5

No way the engine broke in 200 yds. There is enough oil left in there to run engine for quite some time. When I was a teenager we would find old junkers and run them dry just to see what would happen.

I tend to agree with you but the service rep did tell me that the cylinder head was ruined and upper engine was damaged, but the bottom half is fine. He said he was surprised how much damage occurred in such a short time. He said these exact words to me.

Also, how can he know that the bottom half of the engine is fine?

I'm far from being a mechanic so I don't exactly know what "upper" and "lower" engine even means.

[jdlivxx]

Find a local independent bmw mechanic to look over the parts once the engine is taken apart and give you a non-biased opinion. While BMW will probably fix it properly, paying someone a few hundred dollars for piece of mind to me is worth it.

[Helltime]

That's pretty bad. I don't blame you on not trusting it as I wouldn't either. I would be concerned about the rings and bearings being damaged or severely worn at minimum.

[Dackelone]

You need to tell them you want a BRAND NEW ENGINE. Either they can pony up for one or you can go thru your insurance company and then THEY will go after this dealership.

You might just want to contact your agent for advise and not this forum. I mean we are all well meaning... but you really need epert advice and not advice from the "peanut gallery".

I agree with @e34m5 I have seen first hand techs get a phone call in the middle of doing an oil change. For what ever reason... no oil gets put back in. What usually happens is the engine will run fine for awhile - before it starts to make noises. Bad noises. I remember one car that went 400 miles and one week, before coming back for the "rest" of its oil - after an oil change. This was on Subaru and VW engines. Those things only held 4.5 quarts. So they only really had maybe less than a quart inside the engine. In subbie's the oil pump dies first - before the engine siezes. The German's make a better oil pump... so by the time they start making noises - the engine is a gonner.

First thing that wears out when there is not oil are your camshaft bearings. Then your rod and pistons and then your lower bearings on your crankshaft/engine block.

Nothing short of a new engine will fix/put your car back to 100% like before. Do you really want this dealer to "learn" on your car how to repair this? Because that is what will be happening. Maybe you should ask them how many other times this has happended bc how do they know only the head is bad. EVERYTHING inside that engine is seized/worn. Perhaps it will run another 50K miles after they repair things "their way" but when you throw a rod or have a spun bearing... you will then know the full extent of this "oil change".

Get a new engine. Or maybe another car. I hate to say it but its the truth.

Good Luck,
Dackel

[GR1P]

Absolutely demand a new engine and don't take "no" for an answer. Damage has been done to the block as well as the head.

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by GR1P

Absolutely demand a new engine and don't take "no" for an answer. Damage has been done to the block as well as the head.

That is my preference but I need to give the dealership a few days to "assess" the situation. I like the idea of having an independent tech inspect the engine and will make some calls tomorrow. Not sure how that will pan out as it is an odd situation.

Is it even possible to get a new N51 SULEV engine at this time?

I've already contacted BMW North America and they are aware of the situation. I did not sick them on the dealer yet because they are saying all of the right things and taking ownership of the situation. For now. We'll see what happens.

[Obi Wong Kenobi]

Which BMW dealership is this so I can make sure I never service my car there.

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by Obi Wong Kenobi

Which BMW dealership is this so I can make sure I never service my car there.

I'm not going to name them now openly on this forum. They made a mistake, they are owning it, and are saying they will completely fix the vehicle. So i'm going to give them that opportunity. Maybe i'm too nice.

If they don't do what they say, then I will unleash the napalm.

PM me and i'll give you the info.

[TheSt|G]

New engine, plain and simple.

Dackelone laid it out perfectly as per usual. Accept nothing less.

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by TheSt|G

New engine, plain and simple.

Dackelone laid it out perfectly as per usual. Accept nothing less.

Think I can shoehorn an M3 engine in there?

[BBBluey]

Definitely call your insurance and let them know what happened. A new engine period...with an extended BMW warranty. Hopefully they gave you a loaner in the meantime?

[Hops128i]

this really sucks! hope this gets sorted out in your favor and hope you can keep us posted on the final outcome.

[Deutsche-Broke]

That is just amazing... I constantly keep hearing of this at BMW dealerships on forums and other places..

Personally, I would do exactly what you have been doing so far, and be cool, to see what they do.. They are VERY aware of the issue and have probably also read this thread..

Give them a chance to make it good..

As soon as they even HINT of "underperforming", I would light them up with an insurance agent and as a last resort, in any media I could find..

I have great fears of exactly what you described and am very wary of taking my car in for it's one year check in with the mothership..

You have my respect for your level headed pursuit through this nightmare.. I hope the best for your situation and that they fall on the sword and truly make it right.

[jclaib7]

Originally Posted by BBBluey

Definitely call your insurance and let them know what happened. A new engine period...with an extended BMW warranty. Hopefully they gave you a loaner in the meantime?

Yes, an X3 sDrive28i or something. Wow stop/start is terrible. I disabled it.

About the same horsepower as my128i but god it feels awfully slower.

[inline sex]

Indeed I would demand a new motor. Of course they will want to keep the cost of their mistake low.
while the short block might be 'ok' how many thousands of miles were scrubbed off its life???

[Chunner]

Dakelone is right. Demand a new engine and an extended warranty. They must make it right.

[amyracecar]

Originally Posted by jdlivxx

Find a local independent bmw mechanic to look over the parts once the engine is taken apart and give you a non-biased opinion. While BMW will probably fix it properly, paying someone a few hundred dollars for piece of mind to me is worth it.

I totally support this move - have an independent mechanic go over it at least after the fact to make sure they did the job 100%; the cost = the peace of mind to me as well especially if you are going the long term keeper route [perhaps the dealer would even pay the ~200$ just to keep you happy..]

New engine [block and head] and extended warranty -

STILL - sounds like ALOT of damage for 200yds... and this just goes back to me seriously not trusting dealerships unless i can watch my car the entire time..