Advice on upgrade sequence for 135i for tracking

[WhatsADSM]

DCT is a beast on the track .

I actually like tracking my DCT cars more than manual cars. Although the opposite is true on the street.

[houtan]

Originally Posted by WhatsADSM

DCT is a beast on the track .

+1. Had no issues with DCT at buttonwillow. Engine oil temp was a problem though.

[John_01]

The DCT is good for quick lap times, but you will need to consider the cooling system of the car. The DCT transmission puts additional load on the cooling system, that is probably marginal anyway. When the DCT transmission gets hot, the shift because a bit slower and delayed. Eventually the DCT will shut itself down and shift into neutral. There are some options:

* Use higher % of water, and less antifreeze that can increases the heat transfer efficiency of the cooling system.
* Use BMW PPK2 cooling solution that includes a separate water radiator on the left hand side of the car.
* Install a custom transmission cooler that fits in the left hand side of the car.
* Install an aftermarket alloy heatsink transmission sump.

I did the first two items on the list, and performance was sometimes marginal but basically functional. IOW, The Toyo R888 tires overheated before the transmission did.

[houtan]

Originally Posted by John_01

The DCT is good for quick lap times, but you will need to consider the cooling system of the car. The DCT transmission puts additional load on the cooling system, that is probably marginal anyway. When the DCT transmission gets hot, the shift because a bit slower and delayed. Eventually the DCT will shut itself down and shift into neutral. There are some options:

* Use higher % of water, and less antifreeze that can increases the heat transfer efficiency of the cooling system.
* Use BMW PPK2 cooling solution that includes a separate water radiator on the left hand side of the car.
* Install a custom transmission cooler that fits in the left hand side of the car.
* Install an aftermarket alloy heatsink transmission sump.

I did the first two items on the list, and performance was sometimes marginal but basically functional. IOW, The Toyo R888 tires overheated before the transmission did.

You could upgrade to a csf radiator as well.

[WhatsADSM]

Originally Posted by John_01

The DCT is good for quick lap times, but you will need to consider the cooling system of the car. The DCT transmission puts additional load on the cooling system, that is probably marginal anyway. When the DCT transmission gets hot, the shift because a bit slower and delayed. Eventually the DCT will shut itself down and shift into neutral. There are some options:

* Use higher % of water, and less antifreeze that can increases the heat transfer efficiency of the cooling system.
* Use BMW PPK2 cooling solution that includes a separate water radiator on the left hand side of the car.
* Install a custom transmission cooler that fits in the left hand side of the car.
* Install an aftermarket alloy heatsink transmission sump.

I did the first two items on the list, and performance was sometimes marginal but basically functional. IOW, The Toyo R888 tires overheated before the transmission did.

Use a CSF radiator.

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by WhatsADSM

Use a CSF radiator.

Dumb question...which radiator for a car with DCT (manual or auto)? Thx!

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by houtan

+1. Had no issues with DCT at buttonwillow. Engine oil temp was a problem though.

Do all 135's come with the passenger side oil cooler? Or just M-Sport?

[houtan]

Originally Posted by AndyW

Dumb question...which radiator for a car with DCT (manual or auto)? Thx!

Auto.

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by houtan

+1. Had no issues with DCT at buttonwillow. Engine oil temp was a problem though.

Were you there today in the black 135i with NCRC? I was in the silver 135i

[AndyW]

OK, biased question on this forum but, you look like a trustworthy bunch...

Quick poll...

2012 135i M-Sport with DCT with 70K miles for $17K

or

2007 Porsche Caymen S Manual with 120K miles for $21K

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by AndyW

OK, biased question on this forum but, you look like a trustworthy bunch...

Quick poll...

2012 135i M-Sport with DCT with 70K miles for $17K

or

2007 Porsche Caymen S Manual with 120K miles for $21K

Coin toss for me... dual purpose or track only?

[WhatsADSM]

Originally Posted by spxxx

Coin toss for me... dual purpose or track only?

X2

what is the purpose of the car?

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by spxxx

Coin toss for me... dual purpose or track only?

Dual purpose.

[WhatsADSM]

Originally Posted by AndyW

Dual purpose.

In general I would say the 135 if dual purpose. However IMO you need to budget time/money to ensure their track worthiness (many of the parts listed here).

The Cayman is a better track car although I would be worried about the IMS bearing on a 2007 if it hasn't been already addressed.

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by WhatsADSM

In general I would say the 135 if dual purpose. However IMO you need to budget time/money to ensure their track worthiness (many of the parts listed here).

Yep. My initial actions will be simple since i will probably not stress the M-sport suspension or the brakes for a while with my entry level skill:

1. Fluids replacement (oil, DCT, brake, PS, coolant)
2. Drop in K&N air filter
3. Aftermarket FMIC (this was the upgrade on my 335i that was most impactful IMO)
4. Replace water pump and thermostat (these fail at 75-85K on 335i's...assume these are the same design.)

Toying with the idea of getting a tune from WedgePerformance right away if I get the 135i, just to have the ability to turn off the brake nannies more than power, for now.

Originally Posted by WhatsADSM

The Cayman is a better track car although I would be worried about the IMS bearing on a 2007 if it hasn't been already addressed.

<googles IMS bearing failures>

Proves that every car has an Achilles heel. Except the 1993 Toyota Camry, apparently.

http://www.theonion.com/article/toyo...really-s-50480

Thx for the tip. I did some reading and, the only bit of good news is that the 06-08MY's IMS's are much less prone to failure. The bad news is that they are not user-servicable...

I will ask the dealer with the Cayman about whether the car has had the IMS replaced. If not, I will pass. Thx for the heads up.

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by AndyW

Yep. My initial actions will be simple since i will probably not stress the M-sport suspension or the brakes for a while with my entry level skill:

1. Fluids replacement (oil, DCT, brake, PS, coolant)
2. Drop in K&N air filter
3. Aftermarket FMIC (this was the upgrade on my 335i that was most impactful IMO)
4. Replace water pump and thermostat (these fail at 75-85K on 335i's...assume these are the same design.)

Toying with the idea of getting a tune from WedgePerformance right away if I get the 135i, just to have the ability to turn off the brake nannies more than power, for now.

<googles IMS bearing failures>

Proves that every car has an Achilles heel. Except the 1993 Toyota Camry, apparently.

http://www.theonion.com/article/toyo...really-s-50480

Thx for the tip. I did some reading and, the only bit of good news is that the 06-08MY's IMS's are much less prone to failure. The bad news is that they are not user-servicable...

I will ask the dealer with the Cayman about whether the car has had the IMS replaced. If not, I will pass. Thx for the heads up.

I also build custom tunes too, they perform pretty damn well. Email me at spx.tuning@gmail.com


Also for y'all CA based folks, I'm working on partnerships with track day groups for this page I threw together (def work in progress) catrackdays.com

[AndyW]

Thx, all! Was very helpful. Got this one: http://caseattle.com/2012-BMW-135i-C...-98109/6136806

Very fun! And definitely feel more "connected" to the road than my 335i (and it feels pretty good). Also, initial impression is that DCT is awesome.

Only thing I can't figure out so far is how to get bluetooth music to work with my phone...

[WhatsADSM]

Originally Posted by AndyW

Thx, all! Was very helpful. Got this one: http://caseattle.com/2012-BMW-135i-C...-98109/6136806

Very fun! And definitely feel more "connected" to the road than my 335i (and it feels pretty good). Also, initial impression is that DCT is awesome.

Only thing I can't figure out so far is how to get bluetooth music to work with my phone...

Congrats!

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by AndyW

Thx, all! Was very helpful. Got this one: http://caseattle.com/2012-BMW-135i-C...-98109/6136806

Very fun! And definitely feel more "connected" to the road than my 335i (and it feels pretty good). Also, initial impression is that DCT is awesome.

Only thing I can't figure out so far is how to get bluetooth music to work with my phone...

https://www.amazon.com/Tune2Air-WMA3.../dp/B00R3ABHXY

[spxxx]

Originally Posted by John_01

The DCT is good for quick lap times, but you will need to consider the cooling system of the car. The DCT transmission puts additional load on the cooling system, that is probably marginal anyway. When the DCT transmission gets hot, the shift because a bit slower and delayed. Eventually the DCT will shut itself down and shift into neutral. There are some options:

* Use higher % of water, and less antifreeze that can increases the heat transfer efficiency of the cooling system.
* Use BMW PPK2 cooling solution that includes a separate water radiator on the left hand side of the car.
* Install a custom transmission cooler that fits in the left hand side of the car.
* Install an aftermarket alloy heatsink transmission sump.

I did the first two items on the list, and performance was sometimes marginal but basically functional. IOW, The Toyo R888 tires overheated before the transmission did.

I personally run:
- Distilled water + water wetter (plus a smidge of coolant)
- FMIC
- Dinan Oil Cooler
- Custom ATF cooler
- Little 50/50 methanol
- e30 tune

** I've never gone into limp mode due to oil, ATF or water temp and I've been tracking this car for ~2yr now (generally in ~100* weather)

[John_01]

Originally Posted by spxxx

I personally run:
- Distilled water + water wetter (plus a smidge of coolant)
- FMIC
- Dinan Oil Cooler
- Custom ATF cooler
- Little 50/50 methanol
- e30 tune

** I've never gone into limp mode due to oil, ATF or water temp and I've been tracking this car for ~2yr now (generally in ~100* weather)

Interesting to hear of your setup with the custom ATF cooler. The upgraded oil cooler is also helping to improve the overall cooling capability, and I'm sure that's a good idea.

Your car has DCT transmission, right? Do you know if your car retains the stock 'Heat exchanger unit' that couples the AFT fluid temp to the radiator water temp?

I previously ran Redline water wetter in my car (2 bottles of water wetter + 10% BMW coolant + demineralised water). However I noticed there was some solid precipitant floating in the coolant reservoir after only 6 months. I start to have some doubts whether the water wetter is compatible with BMW coolant. In general you need to be careful about mix different coolants, due to risk of incompatibility of the anti-corrosion additives in the coolant. These days my car has standard 50/50 BMW coolant mix and is not being used for track usage. The issue in the coolant reservoir seems to have cleared up after a coolant flush.

[AndyW]

Originally Posted by spxxx

I also build custom tunes too, they perform pretty damn well. Email me at spx.tuning@gmail.com

Thx, but I am already on team WedgePerformance .

Originally Posted by spxxx

https://www.amazon.com/Tune2Air-WMA3.../dp/B00R3ABHXY

Cool...guess I was hoping it would have been "baked in"...

What is your custom ATF cooler setup, if you don't mind me asking?