Impossible electrical issue? No start no crank lots of down ecus

[JacobND]

I've got a 2012 135i n55 dct 04/2011 manufacture date.

I got in my car a few weeks back and drove about 25 minutes, stopped car, got out for 5 minutes, got back in and went to start and got nothing. It was a very rainy day if this changes anything. When I clicked the start button the ignition seemed to turn on and it seemed like the starter solenoid fired but no crank or anything and then my dash lit up like a Christmas tree.

I scanned with MHD immediately and got a 36FD - DME main relay plausibility: prematurely dropped out code. Then reconnecting the battery to see if that would change anything, no luck. Tried jumping, no luck as well. Called a tow to my house.

While waiting for the tow, I was sitting in the car and continuing to try to scan codes to see if any more came up. After the first time I pulled the 36FD, I no longer could scan any codes. It was saying the DME was offline essentially. Also I was hearing a clicking coming from the glovebox area which I now know was the ignition relay firing on and off. Then 15 minutes later, the battery had drained enough to make it so I couldn't close the door all of the way since the window wouldn't go up. As if no battery was connected.

I get the car back to my house and remove the battery, charge it all the way and put it back in and still cannot scan for codes and that relay is clicking on and off constantly still. Also, the starter solenoid fires randomly back and forth every once in a while.

I took my battery to the parts store and had it tested which read back healthy. Put it back in the car and noticed a crazy parasitic draw on the battery of 0.1V every few seconds meaning the battery would be dead in only a couple of minutes if left plugged into the car.

I poorly decided that the issue must be the starter and replaced the starter entirely. This didn't resolve anything. So now I've eliminated the starter and battery. Still unable to scan with MHD I started pulling fuses. I checked basically all of them at this point and didn't find a single bad fuse. I also checked all relays in the glove box and the electronics box inside the engine bay and they were all good. I replaced the ignition relay (KI-30g) just to make 100% sure it wasn't the issue since I was still hearing the clicking coming from it.

With the new relay in, I turned on the ignition and the clicking seemed to be gone. On the nav screen I could see the message that the ignition was on and staying on. I also had downloaded ISTA at this point and scanned the car. Unfortunately, I didn't record what modules ISTA found to be offline at this time but it was reporting two faults with testing procedures to follow.

First was an energy consumption test plan which tested the IBS and found no faults and same with the battery. The next part of the procedure suggested I check the positive power terminal on the fuse box for discoloration. I did this and it was not discolored. I know this was an issue with the old model of power cable but it looks like mine already had the positive cable replaced before I owned the car.
The second fault was in the FRM module which suggested I check the voltage to it. If the voltage was fine, then I would need to replace the FRM. But I noticed that enough modules were offline that the FRM would not be the cause of this. It had to be something else.
By the way, at this point if I had the battery connected, I also had my battery box charging the battery so that the parasitic draw didn’t turn the car off during my testing. Then, I disconnected the battery and took a break, and a few hours later resumed troubleshooting on ISTA. When I went to reconnect, the clicking was back and now even more modules were not responding on ISTA. Things like the JBE were showing offline but then I would scan again, and it would be online again. The offline modules are inconsistent.
Another thing I’ve checked is the ground strap. I connected a jumper to my oil filter housing and grounded it to the strut tower. I did notice that when I connect the oil filter housing end of the jumper it sparks. Not sure if this means my ground strap is bad but either way the car still doesn’t start. Also, the nav says DTC fault, transmission fault, fuel pump fault. Another thing is that when the ignition is turned on now, the fuel pump just runs constantly draining the battery even faster. I know that the reason the pump runs like that is because the fuel pump module is not communicating.
Honestly, I have spent upwards of 40 hours on this issue and made basically 0 actual progress to getting my car running again. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. I will also entertain any suggestions that you think will work because at this point if I haven’t tried it yet then I would be surprised.

[iminhell1]

My 3rd thought was Alternator. You covered the first 2 well enough. Though pulling fuses you should have kept an eye for what circuit killed the amp draw, if any.


But pull the + from the alternator and the plug for the regulator.
Test for the amp draw.
See if the car starts or acts weird.

[Lester]

There was a positive battery cable/ fuse terminal recall a few years ago, it applies your your prod date 04/2011. It was intended to prevent electrical problems.

SUMMARY:

BMW is recalling certain model year 2008-2012 1-Series coupes and convertibles manufactured December 2007 through July 2011; and 2007-2011 3-Series coupes and convertibles manufactured March 2007 through July 2011; 2007-2011 3-Series sedans manufactured March 2007 through October 2011; 2007-2011 3-Series sports wagons manufactured March 2007 through June 2011; and 2009-2011 Z4 vehicles manufactured March 2009 through June 2011.

The connector for the positive battery cable connector and the corresponding terminal on the fuse box may degrade over time. Over time, the high current flow and heat from electrical resistance may lead to a breakage of the connection, and a loss of electrical power to the vehicle.

CONSEQUENCE:
If there is a loss of electrical power to the vehicle, the vehicle may unexpectedly stall, increasing the risk of a crash.

REMEDY:
BMW will notify owners, and dealers will replace the positive battery cable connector and secure it with an improved method, free of charge. The recall is expected to begin in March 2013. Owners may call BMW at 1-800-525-7417 or email BMW at CustomerRelations@bmwusa.com.

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by Lester

There was a positive battery cable/ fuse terminal recall a few years ago, it applies your your prod date 04/2011. It was intended to prevent electrical problems.

SUMMARY:

BMW is recalling certain model year 2008-2012 1-Series coupes and convertibles manufactured December 2007 through July 2011; and 2007-2011 3-Series coupes and convertibles manufactured March 2007 through July 2011; 2007-2011 3-Series sedans manufactured March 2007 through October 2011; 2007-2011 3-Series sports wagons manufactured March 2007 through June 2011; and 2009-2011 Z4 vehicles manufactured March 2009 through June 2011.

The connector for the positive battery cable connector and the corresponding terminal on the fuse box may degrade over time. Over time, the high current flow and heat from electrical resistance may lead to a breakage of the connection, and a loss of electrical power to the vehicle.

CONSEQUENCE:
If there is a loss of electrical power to the vehicle, the vehicle may unexpectedly stall, increasing the risk of a crash.

REMEDY:
BMW will notify owners, and dealers will replace the positive battery cable connector and secure it with an improved method, free of charge. The recall is expected to begin in March 2013. Owners may call BMW at 1-800-525-7417 or email BMW at CustomerRelations@bmwusa.com.

My car already had this recall done. I actually just replaced the fuse box and JBE module and still no luck on starting. ISTA says replace the FRM now... I'll do that tomorrow (I have parts from a parts car on the cheap).

Pretty sure it isn't the alternator because I have modules offline aside from no start no crank. I should probably replace the alternator anyways because it has a pulley squeak though.

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by iminhell1

My 3rd thought was Alternator. You covered the first 2 well enough. Though pulling fuses you should have kept an eye for what circuit killed the amp draw, if any.


But pull the + from the alternator and the plug for the regulator.
Test for the amp draw.
See if the car starts or acts weird.

Yeah last night I was looking at the Terminal 15 wake up diagram and noticed that all the modules in this circuit diagram are the ones I am having issues with. Not sure exactly how I can resolve it though. From my research the CAS wakes the modules up individually to which they will attempt to communicate back. If a few seconds have passed and they do not give the "all clear and communicating" command then they shut off and are then woken back up. I have a feeling this process is where my battery draw is coming from.

[Gangplank]

If the FRM is bad there was a recall on it that I think got extended to 10 yrs & 15k mines.

https://bimmerscan.com/wp-content/up.../B012016-1.pdf

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by Gangplank

If the FRM is bad there was a recall on it that I think got extended to 10 yrs & 15k mines.

https://bimmerscan.com/wp-content/up.../B012016-1.pdf

Unfortunately that requires taking the car to BMW and them charging me $200 for diagnostic and then giving me the free part. I am paying $75 for it though. Gotta love parts cars.

[Gangplank]

Originally Posted by JacobND

Unfortunately that requires taking the car to BMW and them charging me $200 for diagnostic and then giving me the free part. I am paying $75 for it though. Gotta love parts cars.

You can take it to an Indy and get reimbursed by submitting receipts to BMW NA. Hope you are able to figure out the gremlin you got going on there. Very weird issue.

Link to FRM reimbursement page.
http://www.bmw-rp.com/production/bmw...bmw_portal.nsf

[mad1stgen]

Check power cables and terminals on the right shock tower where you connect the positive jumper cable.
The ring terminals have a tendency to corrode on those heavy gauge wires.

[iminhell1]

Originally Posted by JacobND

Yeah last night I was looking at the Terminal 15 wake up diagram and noticed that all the modules in this circuit diagram are the ones I am having issues with. Not sure exactly how I can resolve it though. From my research the CAS wakes the modules up individually to which they will attempt to communicate back. If a few seconds have passed and they do not give the "all clear and communicating" command then they shut off and are then woken back up. I have a feeling this process is where my battery draw is coming from.

Not remotely close to what I'd said.

Give this a shot:

[dtla1]

I had relay clicking noises and similar issue to you. Replaced the relay, removed the JB4 I had (OP, any mods?) and replaced the battery, issue went away. Not really sure which one fixed it, but a combo of all 3 got me there. I'm pretty certain the root cause was the JB4 having a fault, and causing everything else to act weird.

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by dtla1

I had relay clicking noises and similar issue to you. Replaced the relay, removed the JB4 I had (OP, any mods?) and replaced the battery, issue went away. Not really sure which one fixed it, but a combo of all 3 got me there. I'm pretty certain the root cause was the JB4 having a fault, and causing everything else to act weird.

No JB4. I have mhd 1+ tune and charge pipe only. Also my relay clicking is gone after replacing the fuse box and jbe units but still have down modules and no start.

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by iminhell1

Not remotely close to what I'd said.

Give this a shot:

Yeah normally this would be something to check but since I can't even start the car the alternator isn't really involved. The modules not responding isn't related.

[dtla1]

Originally Posted by JacobND

No JB4. I have mhd 1+ tune and charge pipe only. Also my relay clicking is gone after replacing the fuse box and jbe units but still have down modules and no start.

I take back my previous reply, it indeed was the relay apparently, the JB4 failing was before this (I remember now).
https://www.1addicts.com/forums/show....php?t=1644085

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by mad1stgen

Check power cables and terminals on the right shock tower where you connect the positive jumper cable.
The ring terminals have a tendency to corrode on those heavy gauge wires.

What do you mean by ring terminals? Also, I read the full battery voltage at the jump point in the hood when grounded to earth.

[JacobND]

Originally Posted by dtla1

I take back my previous reply, it indeed was the relay apparently, the JB4 failing was before this (I remember now).
https://www.1addicts.com/forums/show....php?t=1644085

Interestingly enough replacing this relay didn't fix the issue fully. I replaced the fuse box because I am pretty sure either the k6700 relay or the Terminal 15 relay (which are soldered inside of the fuse box) were bad.

So now I have a new fuse box, new jbe, new FRM and still little to no progress. Someone suggested that I need a new CAS and trans controller but I don't want to think about that quite yet (even though they might be right). ISTA tells me that the FRM was the issue though so I will scan it again with the new FRM in an hour and see what ISTA wants me to buy now.

[RHERMAN335i]

Had all of the same issues as your describing and had me stumped as well.. had only purchased the car a couple of months prior and wasn't too happy about having a car that would not start or even try to. Just small clicks when I first turn ignition on coming from throttle body area. Took apart everything to be able to get to starter to have it tested and replaced if necessary. Pulled starter out of the car and tested it myself with jumper cables and turned over ok. Brought to a couple of different part stores to have them bench test and results came back as a working starter... put everything back together and boom. NOTHING... started testing voltages from battery to jump post under the hood. Had good voltage there. Checked voltage from wire leading to starter/alternator as they share the same wire. Boom 12.6... after reassembling everything just to have same results about 6 times I got tired of it and wanted to just see what would happen If I could get engine to start the old fashioned way of jumping power to my solenoid. Made my own little jumping wire to connect from power to jump post and go to my starter solenoid. I wanted to at least see if I could get my engine to crank over. BOOM... Cranked and started easy with no problems just like it was supposed to. Shut car off as everything top side of engine was unplugged and disconnected. Inspected wire feeding from my jump post to the starter and found a couple inches back from the copper ring connector on jump post I had some frayed and messed up little spot of wires underneath the wire wrap/cover... went to my shop and made my own peice of power wire with 2 new connectors for both sides of wire. (Jump post to starter) cut the connector on old wire going from starter to the alternator. Making it two separate wires instead of sharing the same wire. Installed on the car and never had an issue since... saved alot of money by not bringing it to a shop and doing it myself as it took alot of man hours to fix the issue. And saved $280 I believe it was that BMW wanted for that power wire. Hopefully that might help someone

[Gray_Panther]

My father's X3 had an electrical christmas party, but when he switched out the ground chassis cable underneath the car by the passenger front tire, everything worked great and started up immediately and no battery draining. He since sold the X3 but thing was tough as nails and once you have good grounds there shouldn't be electrical issues!

[Mr__Bond]

Hello Gents,

I'm not sure if anyone still needs this info but i had the exact same issue with OP: Error codes,clicks from JBE, the whole 9. One moment it was all sunshine and rainbows and couple seconds later it's Seattle on a sad day.
The cause? a corroded engine ground cable. Apparently these models are notorious for that particular cable corroding.

The test was simple (The assumption, you've verified you have a good battery/cables and connection right to the engine bay):

There are a few ways to test the integrity of the engine ground cable, you can use a light probe tester(Best IMO as you're testing under load) or a multi-meter to measure the readings are different points in the engine bay. In our case we're concerned about the readings coming from the engine block, since our starter and DME are tied to it.

In my case, when i tested for for voltage on the engine block, there was little to no reading/light. This explains why the DME threw all possible codes and finally went quiet. As you know the ground is important to complete the circuit in a car. when the circuit isn't complete all electronic components are basically dead or in a zombie state.

Moving on...

First, i spotted the cable and noticed that it was in a odd looking condition, all green and nasty as opposed the shinny silver color it's supposed to have.

Secondly, I created ground from the the engine mount to the chassis using heavy duty jumper cables.

As soon as i hooked up the battery all the clicking noise coming from the JBE vanished and more importantly the idrive screen displayed the glorious words "Ignition On" and that was it. Pushed the button, the car struggled(the jumper cables cannot replace a proper ground cable) but started.

Ground is important!

I really hope someone benefits from this knowledge

Cheers!

[Lester]

Thanks for the update! Yes, electrons have to flow unimpeded back to the source!