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      10-06-2007, 06:02 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
.
Vishnu is coming out with a PROceed "Dark" which seems like a PNP.
I want to know more about this..
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      10-06-2007, 08:23 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by tenxaday View Post
I want to know more about this..
http://www.vishnutuning.com/PROcede_Dark.htm
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      10-17-2007, 05:05 PM   #47
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2007 BMW 335  [4.50]
Right now I have Procede with map version 1.47 on my 335. It makes the car a beast. If you use at the crank numbers to compare then I am at about 370hp and 400tq. I'm on the waiting list for the v2 upgrade and maps and that will get me to about 420hp and 450 tq. There is a dyno (of v2) with average of about 370 wheel HP and 405 wheel TQ with map 2.0.1.

There is a person running his v2 at a track in NJ tomorrow to get us some better numbers for 1/4 mile runs since v2 is just now getting out in public hands.

When you think about it $1600 for procede v2 and you get those kind of increases, it is a bargain. I don't have anything bad to say about any of the other platforms, but I am happy with my choice and it has been an incredible product that made a fun car even more exciting. I hope a few 135's give it a try.
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      10-17-2007, 07:15 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottp999 View Post
Right now I have Procede with map version 1.47 on my 335. It makes the car a beast. If you use at the crank numbers to compare then I am at about 370hp and 400tq. I'm on the waiting list for the v2 upgrade and maps and that will get me to about 420hp and 450 tq. There is a dyno (of v2) with average of about 370 wheel HP and 405 wheel TQ with map 2.0.1.

There is a person running his v2 at a track in NJ tomorrow to get us some better numbers for 1/4 mile runs since v2 is just now getting out in public hands.

When you think about it $1600 for procede v2 and you get those kind of increases, it is a bargain. I don't have anything bad to say about any of the other platforms, but I am happy with my choice and it has been an incredible product that made a fun car even more exciting. I hope a few 135's give it a try.
I'm definitely considering it. I'm lurking around the e90post waiting to see if anyone's motor blows first. that is a lot of power(especially v2), makes me a little nervous.
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      10-17-2007, 09:27 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by BMWeber View Post
I'm definitely considering it. I'm lurking around the e90post waiting to see if anyone's motor blows first. that is a lot of power(especially v2), makes me a little nervous.
I honestly wouldn't worry too much about an off-the-shelf Vishnu (or any other reputable vendor) ECU product paired with a stock engine. I've been lurking on Subaru boards since before the Impreza 2.5RS came out (read: way too long) and, despite some people being bitter that Shiv seemed to "move on" to the Evo, and now BMW, noone ever had a problem with any of his ECU products.

In fact, as he moved to the Evo, noone there had any problems with him on a stock engine. The only problems that crept up were when people started replacing turbos, pushing the boost up around 30lbs, and pushing the block to its limits. Even the Procede V2 pushes less than 20lbs of boost on a very robust block.

The one thing that always got me about Shiv was his commitment to what he calls "margin of safety". If it's going to push the engine too far, he won't do it in an off-the-shelf product. It could be said that he will for a custom tune if pushed enough, since that's where any failures have occurred. But, if he sticks to his guns, I don't think you'll ever see a blown engine as a result of a simple ECU tune from Vishnu, or anyone else reputable for that matter.
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      10-17-2007, 09:30 PM   #50
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Gotta see some data logs with AFR's, boost curves, timing adjustments, knock corrections etc, epsecially from someone dynoing.

bleh, i need to search more.
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      10-17-2007, 09:53 PM   #51
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Procede V2+ FMIC+ Intake+ TBE= Tons of Fun! I cant wait !!!
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      10-18-2007, 07:22 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flanagan View Post
I honestly wouldn't worry too much about an off-the-shelf Vishnu (or any other reputable vendor) ECU product paired with a stock engine. I've been lurking on Subaru boards since before the Impreza 2.5RS came out (read: way too long) and, despite some people being bitter that Shiv seemed to "move on" to the Evo, and now BMW, noone ever had a problem with any of his ECU products.

In fact, as he moved to the Evo, noone there had any problems with him on a stock engine. The only problems that crept up were when people started replacing turbos, pushing the boost up around 30lbs, and pushing the block to its limits. Even the Procede V2 pushes less than 20lbs of boost on a very robust block.

The one thing that always got me about Shiv was his commitment to what he calls "margin of safety". If it's going to push the engine too far, he won't do it in an off-the-shelf product. It could be said that he will for a custom tune if pushed enough, since that's where any failures have occurred. But, if he sticks to his guns, I don't think you'll ever see a blown engine as a result of a simple ECU tune from Vishnu, or anyone else reputable for that matter.
thanks for the info that gives me a bit more confidence. I'm more reved up for a PROcede now. 370RWHP in a 3100lb car, that's corvette territory:biggrin:. and that weight is just my estimate for my car after I strip some things out and replace some things.
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      10-18-2007, 09:48 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flanagan View Post
Even the Procede V2 pushes less than 20lbs of boost on a very robust block.
The potential problems with high levels of power on the N54 engine may stem not necessarily from the tuning itself - which can be safe, reliable, predictable and all that. It may stem from what seems to me the engine's built-in Achilles' heel - high temps.

A stock N54 runs 250 oil temperatures when driving around town, and on road courses it can easily see 280, or even 300 when the engine goes into limp-home mode. There are also rumours coming out of BMW about cylinders #5 and #6 running significantly hotter than the rest, especially at sustained high speed highway driving - which may not be a concern to US drivers, but something to think about nevertheless.

I know that the vast majority of people buying these products will never go to a driving school (which is really a shame, but not the topic here) - so they will most likely be ok. But if I were buying the V2 Procede, I would actually decrease the default power and attempt to reshape the torque curve for a flatter and more predictable output.


Just as with most things in life, I think a little caution and common sense is of essence when tuning your car. There are many people running engine modifications (including me) that right now swear what they have is safe - but if something were to happen to an engine, we'd all be running like chicken.
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      10-18-2007, 10:16 AM   #54
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How does this tuning work? I know in the VW/AUDI world the performance software is installed via the ECU Port. Is it done the same way in BMWs? or is this the old method that requires replacing the ECU for the Vishnu one?

Thanks in advance
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      10-18-2007, 10:27 AM   #55
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Neither. Procede is a piggy back computer that intercepts and alters the signals coming in and out of the ecu if I am not mistaken.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BtheMoneW View Post
How does this tuning work? I know in the VW/AUDI world the performance software is installed via the ECU Port. Is it done the same way in BMWs? or is this the old method that requires replacing the ECU for the Vishnu one?

Thanks in advance
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      10-18-2007, 11:28 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
The potential problems with high levels of power on the N54 engine may stem not necessarily from the tuning itself - which can be safe, reliable, predictable and all that. It may stem from what seems to me the engine's built-in Achilles' heel - high temps.

A stock N54 runs 250 oil temperatures when driving around town, and on road courses it can easily see 280, or even 300 when the engine goes into limp-home mode. There are also rumours coming out of BMW about cylinders #5 and #6 running significantly hotter than the rest, especially at sustained high speed highway driving - which may not be a concern to US drivers, but something to think about nevertheless.

I know that the vast majority of people buying these products will never go to a driving school (which is really a shame, but not the topic here) - so they will most likely be ok. But if I were buying the V2 Procede, I would actually decrease the default power and attempt to reshape the torque curve for a flatter and more predictable output.


Just as with most things in life, I think a little caution and common sense is of essence when tuning your car. There are many people running engine modifications (including me) that right now swear what they have is safe - but if something were to happen to an engine, we'd all be running like chicken.
hmmm I think a larger more efficient oil cooler may be something to look in to.
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      10-18-2007, 11:42 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eunosracr View Post
Neither. Procede is a piggy back computer that intercepts and alters the signals coming in and out of the ecu if I am not mistaken.

Correct - it "fools" the ECU into thinking the turbos are producing less boost than they actually are.
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      10-18-2007, 12:29 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by BMWeber View Post
hmmm I think a larger more efficient oil cooler may be something to look in to.
It is my understanding that the oil-cooling circuit, just like the water-cooling circuit, is thermostat-controlled.

If that is indeed the case, all that may be needed is just a lower temp thermostat.:iono: I think one year from now some of these things may be settled...
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      10-18-2007, 12:29 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
if I were buying the V2 Procede, I would actually decrease the default power and attempt to reshape the torque curve for a flatter and more predictable output.

Just as with most things in life, I think a little caution and common sense is of essence when tuning your car. There are many people running engine modifications (including me) that right now swear what they have is safe - but if something were to happen to an engine, we'd all be running like chicken.
Well said. Though I can't comment on the high temps currently in the N54, I do know that is precisely why BMW added the oil cooler to the 335i. I'm actually surprised to see no one actually listing a larger oil cooler to his fantasy list of engine mods. Kudos to BMWeber in that regard. It'll be a V2 only for me, thanks. Keep it looking (mostly) stock, with ~380 crank hp and I'll be one happy camper with nearly double the peak hp and more than double the torque throughout the entire rev range compared to my current car.

The user-tunable torque curve on the V2 is definitely a big bonus, and I have the same thinking as you. My common sense tells me that flattening out the torque curve so there isn't as much dropoff after 5000rpm would make the car much more drivable, with linear acceleration through redline.

Quote:
Originally Posted by adc
It is my understanding that the oil-cooling circuit, just like the water-cooling circuit, is thermostat-controlled.

If that is indeed the case, all that may be needed is just a lower temp thermostat.:iono: I think one year from now some of these things may be settled...
Even still, if there are a large number of engine modifications being done, keeping things cool should be a top priority. A lower-temp thremostat coupled with a larger oil cooler will certainly benefit the car in high-boost situations.
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