BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)
 





 

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      09-19-2014, 12:10 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02rsxpilot View Post
To the OP, I'd start with bushings or inserts before I did anything in terms of damping. The bushings are the weakest part of the car, used by BMW to help offset the harshness of the RFTs for the lowest common denominator drivers. The problem with this forum is almost everyone that has done the bushings also does sway bars and coilovers and M3 arms, etc... at the same time, so there isn't much info out there that can definitively describe the impact each individual component has had on the driving experience (which would still be subjective but at least would have high correlation, unlike the multiple upgrade cases).

For the record, TC Kline's article on the 1er suspension recommends fixing the bushings issue before changing anything else. TC Kline article. See page 2 for the wisdom on bushings.
Agreed that the bushings are the worst part of the suspension, but struts on these cars are pretty garbage as well. Standard or MSport.

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Originally Posted by TwinTurboed View Post
+2

Honestly, forget the inserts. Do them once and do them right, go with M3 or poly bushings! I have the Whiteline inserts and I am not really impressed.
Be happy yours are just loosening, the Powerflex ones like to randomly disintegrate. Though I suppose in this particular application it just returns you to stock.
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      09-19-2014, 12:16 PM   #68
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Anyone have pics of a car on KW Street Comforts or V2's, V3's? As I've mentioned before, minimal lowering is preferred.
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      09-19-2014, 03:00 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hops128i View Post
When people talk about the bushings, are they referring to mostly the rear subframe bushings? I mean there are a lot of bushings on the suspension.
Most of the time yes, referring to subframe bushings
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      09-19-2014, 03:36 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSt|G View Post
Agreed that the bushings are the worst part of the suspension, but struts on these cars are pretty garbage as well. Standard or MSport.



Be happy yours are just loosening, the Powerflex ones like to randomly disintegrate. Though I suppose in this particular application it just returns you to stock.
Haha that's pathetic and they are not cheap either. The Powerflex black inserts cost about $180 from what I saw.
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      09-19-2014, 05:20 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinTurboed View Post
Haha that's pathetic and they are not cheap either. The Powerflex black inserts cost about $180 from what I saw.
<grin> I think TheStig has decided that, if I like it, it can't be any good. <grin>

The funny thing is that he and I agree on most things (examples are 17 inch wheels, the futility of air filter mods on otherwise stock engines...), and I think he's great on track setup and motor mods. I just think he dismisses mild but solid DD mods that go a long way toward fixing BMWs mandatory runflat setup, while improving the stock ride, but just aren't as high performance as his choices. Stock springs and ride height, FSDs, inserts...

They're not for track or autocross guys. And/or people who want to drive cars just like track cars, and/or want a lowered car, and/or think a firm ride is a desirable mark of a sportscar. Most folks who post here. But for noncompetitive DD folks who mostly want to change to conventional tires, and improve the ride/handling somewhat, I think they have real advantages over the more serious mods.

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      09-19-2014, 05:54 PM   #72
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@128Convertibleguy

Haha I saw you and Stig battle it out about the FSDs in the other thread.

I agree with both of you and would put myself in the middle of both your arguments. I also do not want a hard/harsh ride for a daily drive. I do not track either and my car is mostly used in stop and go Atlanta traffic. I just want the car to handle like how I imagined a proper BMW would and BMW honestly did an absolute terrible job with the 1's suspension. I am making modifications to make it feel like a proper factory BMW.

I do not agree that the inserts are enough, I have had them on for 3 months now and everytime I hit a bump midcorner or change lanes over a lane marker on the highway, the rear wiggles. The inserts did help, but only a mild improvement at best.
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      09-19-2014, 10:04 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 128Convertibleguy View Post
<grin> I think TheStig has decided that, if I like it, it can't be any good. <grin>

The funny thing is that he and I agree on most things (examples are 17 inch wheels, the futility of air filter mods on otherwise stock engines...), and I think he's great on track setup and motor mods. I just think he dismisses mild but solid DD mods that go a long way toward fixing BMWs mandatory runflat setup, while improving the stock ride, but just aren't as high performance as his choices. Stock springs and ride height, FSDs, inserts...

They're not for track or autocross guys. And/or people who want to drive cars just like track cars, and/or want a lowered car, and/or think a firm ride is a desirable mark of a sportscar. Most folks who post here. But for noncompetitive DD folks who mostly want to change to conventional tires, and improve the ride/handling somewhat, I think they have real advantages over the more serious mods.
I was wondering, are the factory bushings the same for all 1-series models? Do the 128i and 135i have the same bushings? Also, do all the model years have the same sub-frame bushings as well?

I guess they do all have the same bushings, but wondered if model/model year made a difference between people who choose to install inserts? Or it could be low mileage versus high mileage differences?

Just thinking out loud here.
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      09-19-2014, 11:40 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Man View Post
I was wondering, are the factory bushings the same for all 1-series models? Do the 128i and 135i have the same bushings? Also, do all the model years have the same sub-frame bushings as well?

I guess they do all have the same bushings, but wondered if model/model year made a difference between people who choose to install inserts? Or it could be low mileage versus high mileage differences?

Just thinking out loud here.
Could be, easily. The inserts obviously would work best on new bushings, and would be unsatisfactory if your bushings were worn out.

The other thing.... You said the inserts originally gave you a "tight" feel, that went away over time. Do you want to go beyond that initial feel? If they're satisfactory right after you tighten the bolts (which are "one use"), your problem is not the inserts.

On mine I haven't noticed any degradation over time, but it's only been a couple of thousand miles, and I have new bolts. And my idea of planted, or my bumps, may not be like yours. I will say I am totally satisfied with the behavior in a bumpy turn. But that's with the compliance of stock springs and FSDs.
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      09-22-2014, 10:57 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 128Convertibleguy View Post
<grin> I think TheStig has decided that, if I like it, it can't be any good. <grin>

The funny thing is that he and I agree on most things (examples are 17 inch wheels, the futility of air filter mods on otherwise stock engines...), and I think he's great on track setup and motor mods. I just think he dismisses mild but solid DD mods that go a long way toward fixing BMWs mandatory runflat setup, while improving the stock ride, but just aren't as high performance as his choices. Stock springs and ride height, FSDs, inserts...

They're not for track or autocross guys. And/or people who want to drive cars just like track cars, and/or want a lowered car, and/or think a firm ride is a desirable mark of a sportscar. Most folks who post here. But for noncompetitive DD folks who mostly want to change to conventional tires, and improve the ride/handling somewhat, I think they have real advantages over the more serious mods.
Not really.

I used to be a fairly big fan of Powerflex, but the long term reliability of their products hasn't been the best.

And none of my car is focused on a track setup. It is purely a comfortable/capable daily driver.
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      09-22-2014, 11:17 AM   #76
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I took the plunge and ordered the full m3 rear subframe bushings from Turner. Will install within a week or two and let everyone know what i think. My main concern is bounciness and play of the chassis... nearly everyone claims this should help.
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      09-22-2014, 12:21 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
I took the plunge and ordered the full m3 rear subframe bushings from Turner. Will install within a week or two and let everyone know what i think. My main concern is bounciness and play of the chassis... nearly everyone claims this should help.
You doing the install or having a shop do it?
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      09-22-2014, 12:31 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
I took the plunge and ordered the full m3 rear subframe bushings from Turner. Will install within a week or two and let everyone know what i think. My main concern is bounciness and play of the chassis... nearly everyone claims this should help.
M3 subframe bushings greatly reduce the amount of variance between what the subframe/suspension are doing and the chassis of the car.
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      09-22-2014, 12:37 PM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkkyyMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
I took the plunge and ordered the full m3 rear subframe bushings from Turner. Will install within a week or two and let everyone know what i think. My main concern is bounciness and play of the chassis... nearly everyone claims this should help.
You doing the install or having a shop do it?
A friend who has done it a few times. Then immediately after that, alignment rack.

That will probably leave me a set of coils or dampers as my last mod.
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      09-22-2014, 12:51 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
A friend who has done it a few times. Then immediately after that, alignment rack.

That will probably leave me a set of coils or dampers as my last mod.
Any idea what tool he uses to remove the old ones? Or just a press?
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      09-22-2014, 01:03 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkkyyMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by ASAP View Post
A friend who has done it a few times. Then immediately after that, alignment rack.

That will probably leave me a set of coils or dampers as my last mod.
Any idea what tool he uses to remove the old ones? Or just a press?
I honestly don't know... he has a ton of tools though in his shop, he can do anything including turbo replacements so as you can see he is quite a resourcful guy.
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      09-22-2014, 02:05 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSt|G View Post
Agreed that the bushings are the worst part of the suspension, but struts on these cars are pretty garbage as well. Standard or MSport.
I have no dog in the race other than to say I have no significant complaints about my M-Sport dampers for daily or track use. Given the impossible job of performing under such wildly different conditions, I'd say they do an admirable job the majority of the time.

That being said, if I were offered a custom set of Ohlins, Bilsteins or TCKs, I'd obviously jump all over that.
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      09-22-2014, 02:12 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02rsxpilot View Post
I have no dog in the race other than to say I have no significant complaints about my M-Sport dampers for daily or track use. Given the impossible job of performing under such wildly different conditions, I'd say they do an admirable job the majority of the time.

That being said, if I were offered a custom set of Ohlins, Bilsteins or TCKs, I'd obviously jump all over that.
It doesn't take a custom set to get considerable improvement.

You will be really shocked when you swap them. Pun intended.
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      09-22-2014, 07:47 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by TheSt|G View Post
It doesn't take a custom set to get considerable improvement.

You will be really shocked when you swap them. Pun intended.
+1.
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      09-23-2014, 12:22 PM   #85
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@128Convertibleguy

You are right, I bought new subframe bolts and replaced the old ones. The car is tight again, very slight wiggle in the rear and not annoying anymore.

For everyone replacing the bushings or inserts, I really recommend replacing the subframe bolts (PN: 33 32 6 760 340). They are aluminum and no one stated that they are stretch bolts, but when you torque the new ones, you can feel them stretch.
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