Has been done anything to fix N54 HPFP Issues on 2010?

[DVDA]

Originally Posted by DVDA

Isnt BMW offering an extended warranty on just the fuel pump?

I thought i read that somewhere...free extended warranty on HPFP

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by DVDA

I thought i read that somewhere...free extended warranty on HPFP

Yes. The warranty on the HPFP has been extended to 10 years or 100k miles.

The problem is, a lot of us will hit 100k miles within about 4 years, and then we're stuck replacing the pumps on our own or selling the car for a lot less than it would have otherwise been worth, because the pump issue is so well known in the enthusiast community.

The bottom line is BMW has had 3 years to come up with a fix, and they're still selling brand new cars to people KNOWING the pumps have a 20-30% failure rate.

[Nicky G]

What doesn't seem at all clear is if the problem is just the pump, or the entire system that feeds and integrates with the pump. The latter seems, well, not too alien an idea, when I see members talk about being on their third or fourth pump.

Has anyone here ever set up a poll asking about members' pump failure rates, and then gets more granular about whether they have modded cars, what their driving style and patterns are like, etc?

If I decide to accept my 1er when it arrives, I'd sure like to think I have a 70-80% chance of NEVER experiencing the problem if my initial pump is good, and that if I do have a bad pump, my next one is 70-80% likely to NEVER give me a problem. I may be a noob here, and certainly internet forums that are based on narrow interests have a way of emphasizing things that perhaps aren't quite so prevalent in the wider community, but all the talk here has me thinking that the problem goes beyond the pump, and is a problem with the system at large.

[oasis3582]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

Yes. The warranty on the HPFP has been extended to 10 years or 100k miles.

The problem is, a lot of us will hit 100k miles within about 4 years, and then we're stuck replacing the pumps on our own or selling the car for a lot less than it would have otherwise been worth, because the pump issue is so well known in the enthusiast community.

The bottom line is BMW has had 3 years to come up with a fix, and they're still selling brand new cars to people KNOWING the pumps have a 20-30% failure rate.

I think it is 10 yrs/120k.

I personally am going to buy the replacement that AMS/CP-E will be releasing around year's end.

[oasis3582]

For those that might not have seen it, read this thread for info on the third party upgrade/replacement for the HPFP:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=302592

[JohnL135I]

Originally Posted by Robert

Did they void your warranty? If so why not leave it as modified.

According to my service rep, if I bring the car to them in stock trim they will do warranty work. So my warranty is not voided.

My car is all stock now, I would never modify the car for fear of a voided warranty now

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by Nicky G

Has anyone here ever set up a poll asking about members' pump failure rates, and then gets more granular about whether they have modded cars, what their driving style and patterns are like, etc?

We've done several polls, and the non-modded vehicles seem to have about a 30% failure rate.

Here's an example:

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...ight=HPFP+poll

In that poll there were 86 votes with no modifications, and 25 failures. The sample size on the modified vehicles was too small to get a clear picture of what's going with them, but if you look at the results for the 2008 cars that were modified, you see about a 25% failure rate. The failure rate was higher on the modified 2009 car, but the sample size was way too small to make that meaningful.

The fact that completely stock vehicles have had multiple pump failures points to something else being wrong. My guess is that it's something in the engine itself (such as part of the drive mechanism) that's out of tolorence and is causing the failures.

If fuel were the issue, as many people have suspected, there would be a predictable pattern to the failures, but they're all over the place. If ethonal were the problem, I'd have certainly had a failure by now considering I'm in the heart of corn country, and we've got 10% ethonal in all our fuel.

[JasonCSU]

Have there been any polls on the 3 series, 5 series, X6, Z4, or 7 series (I believe the new 7 is sold in some markets with the 3.0tt engine) boards about the failure rate? It seems like people are overly worried by what they've read on the boards, but the majority of BMW owners aren't all enthusiasts like us who post on boards and seek out information. As stated before, it's usually the negative information that is more apt to be posted as well.

[imported_mega]

Originally Posted by JasonCSU

It seems like people are overly worried by what they've read on the boards

and auto news, magazines, hell they even talked about it in roundel

[Brix]

Originally Posted by TMR013

But dispite the fact that it is a real problem.
The majority of people have still have not been affected by it. It's not like they are breaking down left and right.
All to often I feel that the issue is blown out of proportion on the boards.

I felt the same way the first 15k miles. Then the car was taking a long time to turn over, so it was replaced. Last week it died out of no where at 20k miles, giving no warning and put me in a very dangerous road situation. BMW has not done anything to accommodate me.

I think if you are a victim of this HPFP problem you would certainly feel different. This board is the only way some of us have a chance to obtain some justice on a really bad and really unacceptable situation.

[TMR013]

Originally Posted by Brix

I felt the same way the first 15k miles. Then the car was taking a long time to turn over, so it was replaced. Last week it died out of no where at 20k miles, giving no warning and put me in a very dangerous road situation. BMW has not done anything to accommodate me.

I think if you are a victim of this HPFP problem you would certainly feel different. This board is the only way some of us have a chance to obtain some justice on a really bad and really unacceptable situation.

No doubt. But that's what I mean. People complain if they have a problem, they don't say anything if they don't. All I'm saying is that sometimes the ferver on the boards about the HPFP makes it sound like 135's are exploding on the roadside everywhere.
And sorry, I don't buy the conspiracy theory that BMW knows what's wrong and they won't fix becuase it's too expensive.

[imported_mega]

Originally Posted by TMR013

And sorry, I don't buy the conspiracy theory that BMW knows what's wrong and they won't fix becuase it's too expensive.

you must be new here, they even extended our warranties, instead of fixing it

[TMR013]

Originally Posted by imported_mega

you must be new here, they even extended our warranties, instead of fixing it

And that's proof of the conspiracy how?

[imported_mega]

Originally Posted by TMR013

And that's proof of the conspiracy how?

you didnt get the letter? I sure did, we all got the same letter and it's been posted on here

last time I had my car in, they quizzed me about long starts, wtf?

[oasis3582]

I will say that looking at the latest SIB for the HPFP, it does sound like they might be collecting more data to help diagnose/correct the problem. It seems like a broader look into the fuel system rather than just the pump. Who knows, though.

I for one will be buying the CP-E/AMS pump when it is released.

[imported_mega]

only problem I have is vapor lock, just like my old honda motorcycle, and our beater work truck

if I shut off the car when it's hot, and wait 15-20 minutes before I start it, it'll start up and shut off, like it's out of gas, happens once a week, exactly like old cars with mechanical fuel pumps, and my old honda motorcycle (gas line too close to exhaust, gas with ethanol boils out of the line)

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by nordique14

I give BMW one defective HPFP per car (for a bad initial design). But people having the HPFP 2,3, 4 or more times is insane. Pimping a know defective engine is just bad. BMW cannot be making many new loyal 135/335/535/z35 customers. It should have been fixed soon after BMW found the issue or they should have stopped selling the 3.0TT engine. Sorry to say but the 135 should never have been offered given the problems BMW knew about with this engine. I have not had any issues so far but I will be very pissed if (when) I have to go back to the dealership multiple times for the same issue.

I've been leasing for my past 3 cars, and I like it!
Even more so with this HPFP issue.

Still, I've got 2.5yrs left on my 135i, and I'm HOPING BMW finds the problem and fixes it. This is one lease that I wouldn't mind buying when the lease is up due to how well it responds to tuning.
It would be fun to get back into an automobile that I can play/tune with.
The 100k warranty is nice and all, but for those that may consider buying after lease, 100k ain't so good.

Honestly though, 50% of BMW sales are lease. The 1 might be higher due to it's tuner appeal. Still, 100k miles is a lot of miles.
I don't know too many BMW owners that keep their BMW beyond 50-75k miles when bought new to them.
There are a lot of used BMW owners who buy these cars with higher mileage cause they like to tinker and can get a really good deal on a BMW, as most are kept pretty clean.

German cars have always been notorious for being quite expensive to maintain and/or fix when beyond 100k. I'm sure this will hurt BMW, but perhaps not as much as many would like to think it will, especially if you're one of the unfortunate that have a HPFP failure/s.
It is much easier to take when you know BMW will cover any problems for the lease period, and for the greater 5yr loan period, as most don't drive more than 15k per year. At 5 years you're still only at 75k miles.
If you drive 20k per year, then that 5yr mark will hurt.
But, that's not very common for most BMW owners.

How many of you actually expect to be driving/owning your 135/335/535, etc... beyond 100k miles?
Yes, the inconvenience of a breakdown sucks, but the reality is that BMW knows it's market pretty well. No, it's not excuse what so ever that this has not been fixed. However, it will probably not hurt BMW as much as some think it will. Heck, the 1 series has been selling really well for such a poor economy. Outside of these types of owner communities, most BMW consumers have no idea that there might be a 20% chance of their HPFP failing, more than once even.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

This is the only bright spot. It's not as bad as you'd think. The pump itself is around $300, and it's not all that difficult to change. I'd like to see the repair order from someone who's had one under warranty to be sure, but I'm thinking this is around $450 if you were paying the dealership.

That's not chump change, but at least it's not $1500 every time the POS craps out.

The part that really pisses me off about it isn't the hassel of changing it, or even the expense. It's the fact that I've got a $42k car that's got 35k miles on it that I think twice about taking on long road trips.

I go back to FL twice a year and stay for about 10 days with some friends. I usually get up early on Sunday morning and make the 15 hour drive home. If this thing dies on me somewhere around the half way mark, it would completely screw me up. I travel for work, and often have a business trip backed right up to my vacation, so it's likely I'd miss a Monday morning flight, and then there's the time to go back and get the car where ever it ends up, and the whole thing would just be a huge PITA. There's just no excuse for a modern BMW having this kind or reliability issue with no fix for it.
Sorry for the rant.

I believe our warranty covers "trip interuption" if a warrantied part fails.
I don't know if the extended HPFP warranty includes that portion as well.
But, if this happens to you it'd be good to know what costs BMW will cover, so that your can take them to task on it.

I don't worry at all about a pump failure as far as trips go. Yeah, it would suck and it would be a hassle, but honestly, there are a number of things can go wrong on the car with any other part. A blow out on an RFT could even cause a serious trip interuption considering how much they cost, and more so, how unlikely you are to find a place that stocks it.
To me, it's just not necessary to worry about.

Yeah, we've done forum surveys', but honestly, outside of these forums I just don't find the HPFP issue to be as common as it appears on here.
I just don't accept our numbers are being truly representative of the greater market.
These types of forums attract those that have had a problem or THE problem, as owners start to use the internet resource to gather information. Thus, our survey numbers are stacked in favor of having a problem. We're just not representative of the greater market for obvious reasons. One example, look at how many 1 owners have manuals on here. Yet, in the greater market most can't even find a manual to even test drive while there will be 5 or more 1's with automatics. If you used our survey results, you'd think a HUGE number of 1's are built with manual transmissions. We know that's not the case.
This place attracts those with similar tastes and similar problems.
It's like the old adage, "misery loves company."


T

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by Nicky G

I hate to say it but all this talk is making me think twice about buying my on-order car. I have a refundable $500 down payment that I've made, and hearing this, it's like... WTF. I'm buying this car BECAUSE of the engine, not despite it, or at least that was my intent.

Well, either you have a passion for this type of automobile or you don't.
I knew about the chance that my 135i might have a pump failure before I ordered mine. There really wasn't anything else out there that really turned me on. I did like the 328ci sport and the 328i sedan sport, manual of course.
But, I decided that my wants exceeded the chance of trouble, and that I'd rather take the chance of a pump failure than getting what was my second choice.

Of course, leasing helps my decision, as did the option of a 5yr loan option.
I'd be getting a new car in either 3yrs or 5yrs, with the warranty, either way was fine for me.

Do you plan on owning your 135i for more than 100k miles?
If so, you'll still have 100k miles to decide.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by Brix

I felt the same way the first 15k miles. Then the car was taking a long time to turn over, so it was replaced. Last week it died out of no where at 20k miles, giving no warning and put me in a very dangerous road situation. BMW has not done anything to accommodate me.

I think if you are a victim of this HPFP problem you would certainly feel different. This board is the only way some of us have a chance to obtain some justice on a really bad and really unacceptable situation.

Have filed a complaint with the NHTSA?

If not, then DO IT!
It can only help.

[Nicky G]

Heheh, I've made up my mind that unless my test drive really sucks (hah!), I'm going to go for it. I agree with you, I think the forum is skewing the stats -- I mean, for example, how many users here push their 135i harder than the "average driver"? To be honest, I am not planning on taking this car to the track, this will be my daily driver. I'm not going to go mod-crazy, I can MAYBE see putting in some of the OEM mods, so my warranty stays active.

I'll cross my fingers, use good gas, with detergents when possible (this can only help my odds, my gut tells me), and enjoy the freaking hell out of this thing... when it finally arrives!

Admittedly, the deal I'm getting on it really sealed the deal. The $1500 holiday rebate just puts it into "too good to say no to" territory.

Originally Posted by RPM90

Well, either you have a passion for this type of automobile or you don't.
I knew about the chance that my 135i might have a pump failure before I ordered mine. There really wasn't anything else out there that really turned me on. I did like the 328ci sport and the 328i sedan sport, manual of course.
But, I decided that my wants exceeded the chance of trouble, and that I'd rather take the chance of a pump failure than getting what was my second choice.

Of course, leasing helps my decision, as did the option of a 5yr loan option.
I'd be getting a new car in either 3yrs or 5yrs, with the warranty, either way was fine for me.

Do you plan on owning your 135i for more than 100k miles?
If so, you'll still have 100k miles to decide.

[Brix]

Originally Posted by RPM90

Have filed a complaint with the NHTSA?

If not, then DO IT!
It can only help.

Thanks for the advice. I will.