[UncleWede]

Me, the wife, and two kids whooped on an old Celica with three guys in cowboy hats and big belt buckles (I assume) I was at a stop light facing a merging hill. I took off at normal speed, but heard this WHINING next to me. Wife said "Those guys are trying to race you" at which point I put the pedal down. I was halfway over the overcrossig when they got to the merge point. Ain't no way I'm taking a back seat to an old Celica.

[abc]

Originally Posted by CC 330i

My friend down the street races his WRX in SCCA Solo II class, and it is also his daily driver. He is selling it because he bought a used Mini Cooper S that he loves (built by BMW). So he is dropping nearly 100 horsepower (his WRX is around 250 hp and highly modified in the suspension department). The resale on the WRX is really bad and it is falling apart now. I think he realizes that he has a much better investment in the Mini, and has a better overall car. The engineering is better to start with, so when fully tuned, the results will be much better.

That Mini is the closest I have had to the fun I used the get driving my 1983 and 1984 GTIs. Both these cars didn't have that much power, but that didn't stop me from beating rich dentists driving their Porsche 911s down steep and twisty Torrey Pines Road.

Anyway, back on topic... If you read long term reviews of the WRX or the Lancer Evolution, you will notice that the resale is pretty bad, and most testers have had reliability and durability issues. The thing is, those cars are tuned so much, that they will simply not last 100,000 miles like a normal car without serious repairs, and they are not easy to live with daily. I nearly bought a WRX STI, but I just couldn't stand how it looked, and I do about 10% performance driving, and 90% commuting and driving to the store and stuff. So I don't want a car that screams BOY RACER all day long.

So the 255 hp we have in the 330i, and the 215 hp in the 325i is very reliable, livable horsepower made without a turbo, in a package that performs well without beating you up. Plus it looks good and you aren't embarrased showing up at valet parking or parking at a fancy restaurant. But when you want to do performance driving, the BMW is well suited for that, and will do a very good job of helping you keep up with (if not beat) many other more high powered cars.

I didn't like how you have to rev the crap out of the Lancer and the WRX to get to the power band. It just doesn't suit my style of driving (anymore).

interesting.... which care handles better, e90 or a WRX... stock.

[northerncalguy]

Off topic, but the Evo 6 speed MSRP starts at $37k? Is it me or does that price seem nuts for a Mitsu??? No way I'd pay that much for a stock rice rocket.

[yujini]

heh, I saw that the EVO came in 6th or 7th behind the crazy super cars.
Though it seems like whenever EVO goes against a WRX STi in a tournament, the STi wins. But probably the difference comes from the driver's skill rather than the pure power.
But if you want just pure power with unlimited potential to unlock a beast, you should go with the EVO8 or STi.
You just have to live with the cheapest plastic interior ever though lol.

I was gonna get the EVO (loved the EVO7) when it came to the US, but didn't like the looks of the EVO8

[NaTuReB0Y]

Originally Posted by northerncalguy

Off topic, but the Evo 6 speed MSRP starts at $37k? Is it me or does that price seem nuts for a Mitsu??? No way I'd pay that much for a stock rice rocket.

It starts at $37K......but with the $6K dealer mark-up...

You're talking about $43K.....but it's not a stock rice rocket...
Crazy HP tune up car! 2.0L pumping out 280HP! And wicked fast!

[cntlaw]

2 car lengths ! Mostly you did a good launch and the Evo guy did a real bad one (e.g. rear tires lost traction), regardless of what power you two have got.
I recall the 325i 0-100 is 6.9s...( sorry, we shouldnt launch at all with people for this figure )

[NaTuReB0Y]

And....the EVO VIII has a 0-60mph in 4.8 seconds.....as I recall!

[Xens]

I'd love to have one, but I haven't heard of one happy owner with an EVO as far as reliability goes. It's a monster but can't be a daily driver, goes wrong too often.

[abc]

Originally Posted by northerncalguy

Off topic, but the Evo 6 speed MSRP starts at $37k? Is it me or does that price seem nuts for a Mitsu??? No way I'd pay that much for a stock rice rocket.

a little unfair to lump an evo and a subaru wrx into the 2fast2furious frankenstein civics/neons/celicas crowd.

in particular the evo has been around in Japan years before the aftermarket import car seen got so mainstream and cheesy.

the evo had been known only on Japan streets and its place in rallycar driving in dirt.

it went through yrs of 'rumors' before it was allowed to be sold in USA... readily absorbed by the 2F2F crowd.

But still, on avg. the owner of this car shouldn't readily be lumped into the 'by a used 5k car and add 8k of aftermarket upgrades and jet fighter wing over the span of 2 summers as i get paychecks', and the abilities of the EVO stock stands on its own.

[zdognaylor]

[CorporalCarrot]

Just to re-iterate what others have said above.

The guy driving the “Evo” was either an extremely bad driver, missed a gearchange or there was something wrong with his car (or it was a tarted up bog standard lancer). Because stock for stock, any current lancer beats any three series, E90 or E46, hands down. It isn’t even a contest. Even against an E46 it’s really only a drivers contest until you get to 100+ mph when the larger capacity M3 engine comes into its own.

Furthermore, on the twisty stuff (which is all people really care about over here in Europe), the Evo is probably the fastest point-to-point x-country car money can buy. Anyone who has driven one in anger will know that to dismiss it as merely a rice rocket is asking to be embarrassed. The evo is not just a lancer with a souped up engine. The differential in that car is amazing. I know it has a host of acronyms attached but the cornering capability of that car is just incredible (and I speak as one who has first hand experience of some pant-wettingly sickening moments where I thought I was close to death in an Evo…..but the car just kept on gripping). I think its an aspect of the Evo that gets lost in the USA, where the focus is more on drag racing and straightline speed.

Having said all that I wouldn’t own one. The styling is too loud; it screams BOY RACER. Its also clear Mitsu put so much into the chassis development and all the hidden stuff that allows it to grip like a limpet in corners that there was nothing left to spend on the interior which is extremely low-rent. The ride quality is also extremely harsh, I have always struggled for some reason to find a comfortable driving position and the service intervals are something like every 5,000 miles. All sorts of compromises I am not prepared to make in my daily driver.

But I respect that car and its owners tremendously because of it.

As for the Subaru WRX/STI, its an easier car to live with on a daily basis than the EVO…..the interior is somewhat better, the ride is more comfortable and Subaru has always scored well over here in the reliability stakes. It does not grip as well as the Lancer however (that’s not to say its bad, its extremely capable just relative to the EVO it ain’t there), but certain people prefer that………its easier to get 4-wheel drifts in the Subaru where the lancer grips, grips and grips. It is possible to provoke oversteer in the lancer, but I never could master it nor get comfortable with driving it in that way. It just wants to hug the road so much.

C

[CorporalCarrot]

Actually just by way of footnote, after I wrote that I thought I would read up on the EVO’s diff again which I always thought was a great piece of kit; but I discovered that when it was introduced for the EVO VIII over here, the new centre differential with the Active Yaw Control etc (which gives the EVO its incredible cornering capability) did not make it to the US Spec version, which retained the old diff from the EVO VII. !! Talk about tailoring cars to different markets.

C

[shimshimhada]

Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y

It starts at $37K......but with the $6K dealer mark-up...

You're talking about $43K.....but it's not a stock rice rocket...
Crazy HP tune up car! 2.0L pumping out 280HP! And wicked fast!

You guys are talking about the MR. The RS starts at $29K and my friend got his for about $28K.

[jmcphillips1]

Um, I would get a BMW over a Mitsu

[r3amir]

Mitsubishis are cheap unreliable cars, My advice: Never buy one

[r3amir]

May be the Mitsubishi doesn't have good torque at low end RPMs for an up hill race.

[shimshimhada]

Originally Posted by r3amir

Mitsubishis are cheap unreliable cars, My advice: Never buy one

Tell that to Jackie Chan

[r3amir]

Originally Posted by shimshimhada

Tell that to Jackie Chan

In movies you would rather destroy a cheap unrelaible car than an expensive and dependable car

[r3amir]

Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y

And....the EVO VIII has a 0-60mph in 4.8 seconds.....as I recall!

How much is it going uphill?

[cntlaw]

Should see the Hong Kong movie called "Initial D" ( a real character imitation of the original Japanese cartoons ) and you will then love Japanese super cars street racing.

[ksfrogman]

My two cents: Our 3 series is a bit pricey with all its options, but what we get in return is well-roundedness, a bit of luxury, sport and a lot of prestige. When we go to expensive restaurants, why do the valets always park the BMWs and Mercedes in the front, and the rest of the cars in the back? This is not about 0-60 times, quarter-mile times, and sheer horsepower. A WRX STi, Mitsubishi EVOL, Mustang GT, IS 350, 350Z, G35, used Supra, Camaro, Firebird may all out accelerate the 3 series in a straight line. How many of them get 20 mpg and 30 mpg respectively? Fast and class are two different things.

The materials, fit and finish of our e90 interior are really incredible. The features like DSC, C.A., directional Xenon lights, active steering, etc. are things that you can't find in many of the cars mentioned above. When you touch the plastic on that nice Mustang (I like Mustangs btw), is it cushy, or does it feel rock hard and hollow? Do the seats hug you like the sport package BMW seats do? What about the weight distribution on the 6MT 330i? 50.6% front and 49.4% rear. What about slalom times and speed? Those numbers should mean something. Sit in the back seats of all those cars I have mentioned, and most of them will be uncomfortable. Want 4 doors? Well many of them don't even have that. As for the G35, I like the looks of the coupe, but the sedan looks like something my grandma would drive, and she never drove. The IS350 still looks like a small Japanese economy car IMHO, and the 350Z has a big X in the trunk space that prevents me from putting anything big back there.

I'm not sure why some of you bought or are thinking of buying the e90, but the bottom line is that our money is NOT aimed at giving us the ultimate drag racer--we are buying a classy driving machine that does a lot of things better than most vehicles out there. And it does so in style with understated elegance. If this car were a guy, it could be James Bond--not the strongest, not the fastest, but smart and gets the job done with wit and style. I love it!

[cntlaw]

ksfrog

In short. We pay for a E90 because we want a good balance of evrything!