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      08-09-2009, 08:40 AM   #1
dalrx
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Winter tires Oh no but it is still summer!

I know , I know how dare he mention such a thing, I mean it is still dead of summer. Well I don't want to get stuck in a rush for stuff. Also I know there is lots posted on this topic so far, but I haven't found much for this setup.

I have the sport pack 18 inchers summer , but am thinking of going with 16 inch steels 205/55R16 tires. Michelin Pilot Alpin PA3. It seems like plenty of bmw are running on 16 inch size, as BMW offers a winter pack for $1695 in this size, and many older 3 series coupes sedans I have seen run on this size for many years no problems.

My question is there any problem running the 16's, has anyone Canadians used 16's last winter? Going with 17 alloy's + tire sends cost through the roof. Also for me choosing michelin I can deal somewhere all four tires + steels mounted balanced for $950 taxes incl.

what are peoples thoughts?
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      08-09-2009, 10:08 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dalrx View Post
I know , I know how dare he mention such a thing, I mean it is still dead of summer. Well I don't want to get stuck in a rush for stuff. Also I know there is lots posted on this topic so far, but I haven't found much for this setup.

I have the sport pack 18 inchers summer , but am thinking of going with 16 inch steels 205/55R16 tires. Michelin Pilot Alpin PA3. It seems like plenty of bmw are running on 16 inch size, as BMW offers a winter pack for $1695 in this size, and many older 3 series coupes sedans I have seen run on this size for many years no problems.

My question is there any problem running the 16's, has anyone Canadians used 16's last winter? Going with 17 alloy's + tire sends cost through the roof. Also for me choosing michelin I can deal somewhere all four tires + steels mounted balanced for $950 taxes incl.

what are peoples thoughts?

Hey I'm planning on doing the same setup. However I'm not getting mine through BMW likely from a separate dealer. Like you said sub $1000 is an alright price for winters.

I think 205 is the correct width, I wouldn't go any larger than 215 I think for our winters.
Don't let anyone tell you that they wont fit or stupid stuff like that. I got ripped apart for even suggesting Steelies on a BMW, like it was a crime :P

Fact is Alloys clump snow in the winter so hence the main reason I'm going with Steel. Second is the cost.

Good luck in your searches. (Just think of how bitchin' our cars will look with black steelies I'm insisting on not running hub caps also :P
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      08-09-2009, 11:06 AM   #3
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I'm going with 205 55 17s - I don't think I could make the jump from 18" down to 16", too much of an aesthetic trade-off for me (especially considering that I will have them on for 5-6 months per year). I've already priced it out on Tirerack.com, and it will be about $1500US shipped to Canada for tires and a set of nice alloy wheels.
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      08-09-2009, 11:15 AM   #4
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I would double check (perhaps with Gill) that the 16" steel wheels will fit. I bought the BMW steelies from Tire Rack and have used them with 205/55/R16 winter tires for nearly 10 years on my early E46. But my understanding was that not only will they not fit E82 and E90 vehicles, but that they won't clear the brakes on later E46 330i models.

If they will fit, then it seems to me to be your best solution - especially if your potholes are anything like ours!

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      08-09-2009, 11:53 AM   #5
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As far as esthetics I could careless in winter with all the junk we get here in southwestern ontario, salt, snow, sand, crap etc. I don't care what kind of car you got that time of year is not to show off your ride. Unfort this is my daily driver and I am not storing it. I want to remain on the road not in the ditch.

Besides I have seen plenty of "nice" rides in past years with steelies on. I priced out 16 inch alloys (sport A7) on tire rack and they would come $600 higher (exchange rate etc.) than the steel my local tire shop can do. If I didn't have the deal I am getting then alloy would be the route for me.
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      08-09-2009, 12:14 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by dalrx View Post
As far as esthetics I could careless in winter with all the junk we get here in southwestern ontario, salt, snow, sand, crap etc. I don't care what kind of car you got that time of year is not to show off your ride.
To each their own. For me, the price with alloys is barely more than a comparable steel wheel configuration.
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      08-09-2009, 02:42 PM   #7
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Not sure the correct tire size but is it safe to say you can buy the same size tire for all four wheels? With the sports pack you get different sized tires in the front and the rear which is something I wish to avoid with the winter tires. I'm pretty sure non-sport pack BMWs ride with the same four tires on all fours...as long as there isn't a safety issue I'm all for that in the winter. Anyone have experience with that?
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      08-09-2009, 06:53 PM   #8
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      08-09-2009, 07:12 PM   #9
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I'm also already thinking about winter tires even though it's only August and we just had a heat wave past through Vancouver. On my 135i, 16s will definitely not fit, so I'm forced to go for 17" alloys.

But I do agree that steelies in the winter look pretty hot. My friend has a black Mazdaspeed 3 with steelies in the winter, and it looks really nice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky1 View Post
Not sure the correct tire size but is it safe to say you can buy the same size tire for all four wheels? With the sports pack you get different sized tires in the front and the rear which is something I wish to avoid with the winter tires. I'm pretty sure non-sport pack BMWs ride with the same four tires on all fours...as long as there isn't a safety issue I'm all for that in the winter. Anyone have experience with that?
You can definitely fit the same size wheels/tires to the 1. The staggering of the front/rear sizes are mostly for increased performance/handling in the dry/wet.
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      08-09-2009, 09:52 PM   #10
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Don't get steelies!!! I put some steelies on a friends VW GTI and they are stupid heavy. I know this isn't an issue for the car's performance as we are talking winter tires. However...think how many times you will move them, instal them, put them back in a few years. Trust me...go aluminum. Get them from Gill at Tire rack and you will get a way better price then the onces you saw at the BMW dealer.
I have 17 inch will 225's Blizzaks all around. I was really happy with my car in the snow. We had several dumps last year plus I have a place at Whistler so I drove it in some serious snow (and ugly potholes by spring). I was very happy.
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      08-09-2009, 10:00 PM   #11
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I'll attach a pic of my set up for winter...
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      08-10-2009, 12:12 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanbmw View Post
Don't get steelies!!! I put some steelies on a friends VW GTI and they are stupid heavy. I know this isn't an issue for the car's performance as we are talking winter tires. However...think how many times you will move them, instal them, put them back in a few years. Trust me...go aluminum. Get them from Gill at Tire rack and you will get a way better price then the onces you saw at the BMW dealer.
I have 17 inch will 225's Blizzaks all around. I was really happy with my car in the snow. We had several dumps last year plus I have a place at Whistler so I drove it in some serious snow (and ugly potholes by spring). I was very happy.
Steelies are heavier for sure, and they'll jack up the unsprung weight as well.

I LOVE the winter rims that you have (Sport Edition KM-11 right?), but they aren't available from the Tire Rack anymore. Right now I'm looking at Blizzaks LM-60 on Sport Edition A7, also in 225.
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      08-10-2009, 08:00 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanbmw View Post
Don't get steelies!!! I put some steelies on a friends VW GTI and they are stupid heavy. I know this isn't an issue for the car's performance as we are talking winter tires. However...think how many times you will move them, instal them, put them back in a few years. Trust me...go aluminum. Get them from Gill at Tire rack and you will get a way better price then the onces you saw at the BMW dealer.
I have 17 inch will 225's Blizzaks all around. I was really happy with my car in the snow. We had several dumps last year plus I have a place at Whistler so I drove it in some serious snow (and ugly potholes by spring). I was very happy.

I hate to say this but big FAIL to you for saying its tooo heavy to lift a steel rim onto the hub. And who really cares about extra unsprung weight on a winter car
Your winter rims looks good, but my experience with Alloys in the winter is it clumbs really bad and when it freezes in there it can throw the balance off the wheel.

A 16 inch steel with fit on a 128i (we only have 300mm discs) 135 will need a17 with their larger discs.

I'm going to get a price from BMW about a winter rim setup, I know they are too expensive though. Just as a maximum price.
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      08-10-2009, 06:08 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by EngPhys09 View Post
I hate to say this but big FAIL to you for saying its tooo heavy to lift a steel rim onto the hub. And who really cares about extra unsprung weight on a winter car
I can see your argument - but look at it another way. How long do you have your winter setup on? 5 months? 6 months? You could potentially be using that setup for half the year - half of the time you own your car. Why go for the bare minimum? It's a luxury car, not a Ford - it's a performance car, not just a run-of-the-mill daily driver. And I respectfully disagree about the "look" of steelies; yes, there are a small handful of cars where the steelies look good, but look at the SE KM-11s above - and tell me those don't look great.

And let's be honest - I see you're located in Toronto. So am I, and I can practically count the number of times last year that I drove in actual snow on one hand. We don't get a lot - and unless it's a major storm, it's always cleared fairly quickly. For the less than 10 days that you might be driving in actual snow, I'd be more inclined to go with a kick-ass alloy setup.
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      08-10-2009, 07:31 PM   #15
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Well I went by Gill and I found a guy that has 16 inchers sport a7's that I might get at this link



http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220863


I priced them out about $1300 USD all inclusive, that would be 400 more than the steel setup I can get. We will see where this goes.
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      08-10-2009, 07:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashtangi View Post
I can see your argument - but look at it another way. How long do you have your winter setup on? 5 months? 6 months? You could potentially be using that setup for half the year - half of the time you own your car. Why go for the bare minimum? It's a luxury car, not a Ford - it's a performance car, not just a run-of-the-mill daily driver. And I respectfully disagree about the "look" of steelies; yes, there are a small handful of cars where the steelies look good, but look at the SE KM-11s above - and tell me those don't look great.

And let's be honest - I see you're located in Toronto. So am I, and I can practically count the number of times last year that I drove in actual snow on one hand. We don't get a lot - and unless it's a major storm, it's always cleared fairly quickly. For the less than 10 days that you might be driving in actual snow, I'd be more inclined to go with a kick-ass alloy setup.
Your exactly right that a Alloy looks better than a Steel, I'll completely agree with you every day. The argument wasn't based on looks of Steels vs Alloy it was based on the fact that having an open alloy rims allows snow to clump, pure and simply that was my argument.
Technically I don't live in Toronto, just put it on there because its easy. I live on the Shores of Lake Huron, we good tonnes of lake affect snow.

Never the less I ordered my snow tires today. Bought them from BMW Toronto, stamped steels with hubcaps (really ugly but better looking than plan steel), Good Year Eagle Grip GW-3 (RFTS)
I got a good price ($1400 range)
I had to go with RFTs because BMW assist (towing etc) wont Tow your car if you don't have RFTs..this was news to me but I decided fine, saves me if I get a flat ever.

I hear these tires are fairly good in snow, and I'm running 205/55/16.
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      08-10-2009, 07:43 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dalrx View Post
Well I went by Gill and I found a guy that has 16 inchers sport a7's that I might get at this link



http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220863


I priced them out about $1300 USD all inclusive, that would be 400 more than the steel setup I can get. We will see where this goes.

I notice here you said you bought TPMS....why did you put these in your rims?
We have TPW work based on different wheel speeds using the ABS sensor.
I just learned this today actually reading in the wheel and tire section.
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      08-10-2009, 08:43 PM   #18
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I also happened to be pricing up snow tires & wheels today on tirerack. I just plan to get halfway decent looking 16's around $100. As for tires, sticking with runflats, I am between the blizzak LM-25s and michelin primacy alpin PA3...any opinions on the two?

And is it true that TPMS is not required? I thought it was only for certain countries, US cars would keep the flat tire light on without them. $50 per wheel from tirerack isn't too bad.
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      08-10-2009, 08:45 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EngPhys09 View Post
And who really cares about extra unsprung weight on a winter car
I agree that for the majority of people, unsprung weight doesn't really matter for their winter setup.

Vancouver has relatively mild winters; once in a while we get quite a bit of snow (like this past winter), a lot of winters we get just the occasional light snowfall. Chances are I'll be on my winter setup for 5 or so months, the vast majority of which will be on dry/wet roads, with many of those days having relatively warm temperatures. So even in the winter, I'd prefer to keep the unsprung weight reasonably low if possible. I totally see how unsprung weight is likely of no relevance in an area like where you live, with significant snowfall most of the winter.
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      08-10-2009, 08:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwardell View Post
I also happened to be pricing up snow tires & wheels today on tirerack. I just plan to get halfway decent looking 16's around $100. As for tires, sticking with runflats, I am between the blizzak LM-25s and michelin primacy alpin PA3...any opinions on the two?

And is it true that TPMS is not required? I thought it was only for certain countries, US cars would keep the flat tire light on without them. $50 per wheel from tirerack isn't too bad.
I've heard from a few forums that the LM-25 and the Dunlop Winter Sport 3D are both good winter tires. Haven't heard much about the PA3s though. Note that the LM-60 will soon be replacing the LM series of tires:
http://www.bridgestonetire.com/Index...ticle=c_90721a

Check out this thread on TPMS:
http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=211450
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      08-10-2009, 10:29 PM   #21
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I was planning on using the 17" OEM rims that came with my wife's 128i as the winter rim and replacing the summer tires with winters. The dealer old me that the OEM rims do not support regular tires and ONLY run-flat tires?!? Is this even possible or are they feeding me crap?
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      08-11-2009, 12:13 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GT2QQ0 View Post
I was planning on using the 17" OEM rims that came with my wife's 128i as the winter rim and replacing the summer tires with winters. The dealer old me that the OEM rims do not support regular tires and ONLY run-flat tires?!? Is this even possible or are they feeding me crap?
No problem in fitting regular tyres on the BMW rims, you just can't put run-flats on normal rims. The only difference between the rims is a slightly taller "bump" behind where the bead seats, needed to retain the run-flat with no air, but not a problem for regular tyres.

225/45-17 Pirelli Sottozero 210 tyres are what we are putting on our 135i (although we've got them on Rial Flair rims, from TireRack). I have had the Sottozero 240 tyres on our Z4M in 225/45-18 size, for 2 winters, the best winter tyres I've ever used.
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