Long cranks, all lights on - battery problem?

[Lucky1]

Thought I'd ask all the 1Addict detectives if they can help me diagnose this problem. Problem started yesterday as warning lights and has progressed to stalling and long cranks on startup. Here's a breakdown of whats happened so far:

1. Yesterday morning on the way to work 1 minute into the drive the yellow exclamation warning light came on and the DSC/DTC off and check engine light are all illuminated yellow. Also the tire pressure low light warning cme on (my tire pressure is not low, only 2psi off from factory recommendations due to colder weather). No change in the car's driveability. Pulled over, turned off the engine, turned it back on, lights went away and life was good.

2. Yesterday night after driving for 50 minutes on the highway I was creeping in a parking lot in 1st gear and the car stalled and all the above lights came on again when I restarted it. Okay, could be related to earlier issue or maybe I was driving too slow in 1st and stalled it? Seemed unlikely but fine lets keep an eye on it. Checked the battery "magic eye" and it was green ("sufficiently charged").

3. Today I'm reversing out of a parking spot, had just slipped the clutch a bit to give it power, put the clutch back in and the car outright stalls with the clutch IN. Okay, now I'm worried. Started her back up, LONG cranks of the engine ensue but it fires up but sure enough same lights come on again. I can also tell that hill assist is disabled because the car is rolling back a lot easier now, not sure about ABS but it sure thinks my tire pressure is low again. Magic eye on the battery is still green.

So what do you 1addicts think? The car drives totally fine and knock on wood it does start but I am getting consistent long cranks now on startup, at this rate of progression I'm sure eventually the car will not start at all. I have 159,089KMs on the car (99,375 miles) and the original 2008 factory battery still in and have only completely discharged it needing a boost once (at the end of last winter). Is this symptomatic of a weak battery not holding its charge or some other electrical fault/short? I talked to my SA and he doesn't think a battery replacement will resolve the issue because he's saying if the engine turns over then the battery is good. Also he did not get any codes when scanning my key fob. I kind of see where he's going with that but I've had cars before where long cranks on startup meant the battery was out of juice. Also would all the lights be on and the hill assist be off because the car detected a long crank and cut back on the electrical drain or if the battery is too low regardless the stuff goes off?

I searched the forum and found this post http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...hlight=battery which describes how some modules in the car can get submerged in water and short out the electrical.
I also searched on Google and found another forum where another BMW owner had suggested there was a fault with the ABS motor but I don't think thats it hear because all the lights are going wonkey and I have no hill assist. Short on the wheel sensors?

Hoping this is just a battery issue as BMW is now charging $175 CAD for the diagnostic fee (up from $140 CAD) so I might take my chance on my Indy if I can't figure this out on my own or with your help.

[NVHoo]

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[luv135i]

Weak battery will make all kinds of crazy lights go off. My wipers just started going off too then it just died.

[mackeroni]

Q: You have a seven year old battery in a car with nearly 100,000 miles on the clock and you want to know if the battery might be going bad?

A: If the battery is not bad now, it will be in a couple days. I suggest that you change out the battery and I am betting that this will solve all your stated problems. If you still have the stated problems, you would have needed the new battery anyway, so no harm done.

Other opinions are likely forthcoming.

[Ed P]

Stick a feather in your cap, you called it mackeroni.

[mackeroni]

Originally Posted by Ed P

Stick a feather in your cap, you called it mackeroni.

Uh...yeah. That's me. So what?

[Dackelone]

I would start at a new battery. Not sure IF Canadian models had the battery recall campaign... but that is a possibility. The ABS(DSC) Block is known to go bad in these cars. Have you been changing your brake fluid every two years?

[blue135]

Sorry to hijack, but is there a way to tell how old a battery is? I have a 2008 e88 (3/2008 build) and i am third owner. Can find no record of replacement and battery eye is dark (not green) so i am starting to worry about it, but there are no starting or electrical problems.

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by mackeroni

Q: You have a seven year old battery in a car with nearly 100,000 miles on the clock and you want to know if the battery might be going bad?

A: If the battery is not bad now, it will be in a couple days. I suggest that you change out the battery and I am betting that this will solve all your stated problems. If you still have the stated problems, you would have needed the new battery anyway, so no harm done.

Other opinions are likely forthcoming.

THIS. you gotta get your battery replaced. long overdue.

[JimD]

It is pretty simple to test a battery and see if it is good. You need a load tester, here is one for $22:

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalog...battery+tester

The two items in the upper left are what I am talking about. You can test your battery and alternator and even starter with it. The battery test is simple. You clip the leads to the battery and push a button and read the cold cranking amps. If they are really low, the battery is bad. If they look about right, it's a waste of money to replace it. When you push the button, you are putting a resistor in the circuit causing the battery to supply 100A. The gauge is telling you the voltage with this much current coming out. But the scale is set up to tell you cold cranking amps, not volts.

This won't work on a depleted battery, however. We had not driven my wifes old Jeep Cherokee and when she tried to start it we got clicks, no cranking. So I put it on the charger - and it read fully charged. I just ignored that and left it on there for awhile and it settled down and charged. And in a few hours it started the car fine and she used it.

The motto to this is I do not guess about batteries. If they start the car but it acts funny, I test the battery. If it won't start the car I try charging it. I don't assume. I would check for water in the back where you have some electrical connections if my dash was acting funny like this. There is also an electrical connector to the dash I would look at. You will see it if you pull a couple screws holding the gauges in and pry carefully with a soft pry bar.

[Lucky1]

Originally Posted by mackeroni

Q: You have a seven year old battery in a car with nearly 100,000 miles on the clock and you want to know if the battery might be going bad?

A: If the battery is not bad now, it will be in a couple days. I suggest that you change out the battery and I am betting that this will solve all your stated problems. If you still have the stated problems, you would have needed the new battery anyway, so no harm done.

Other opinions are likely forthcoming.

Thank you for your response. The question I was really trying to convey was not really just whether the battery was bad or not but whether a bad battery would cause the following:

-tire pressure monitoring, hill assist, dsc/dtc to become disabled
-stalling while driving at low speeds in 1st gear
-stalling with the clutch in while in reverse gear
-long cranks at startup prior to all of the above

I was expecting to replace the battery this year but not for these symptoms. I did some searching on the forum and online and could not map these events to an impending battery failure. Particularly was confused about the stalling issues as I've never experienced that in a car with a weak battery before. The SA I talked with did not believe it to be a battery issue. I wanted to get an idea on whether a battery replacement would even resolve these issues. I also noticed the problems seemed to occur more frequently in cold weather.

To eliminate it as the causal factor I have replaced the battery with a new BMW OEM and will monitor the results as the weather gets cold again over the next few days. So far I've noticed the car starts quite strongly and quicker than before but the weather is also warmer. I did have the battery cable recall done years ago and this battery was not subject to the battery recall. Will keep the forum advised.

[Lucky1]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

I would start at a new battery. Not sure IF Canadian models had the battery recall campaign... but that is a possibility. The ABS(DSC) Block is known to go bad in these cars. Have you been changing your brake fluid every two years?

Battery recall happened in later years after 2008. Have been good with fluids in general but will have to check when my brake fluid was done last. This can cause the symptoms I'm seeing?

[sixburgh]

Okay. I have a 2010 128i. The original battery is still live. How much longer will it last? Should I just take it to the "stealership" and get it's "prognosis"? Thanks in advance for your comments.

[twinboost_MD]

Check the alternator before you deplete this battery too... changes in belt tension can affect proper function of the alternator

[JimD]

Age is at best a very crude indicator of battery life. I've had them fail in a couple weeks from purchase and also had one last over 10 years. That's why I test. My 2009 is on the original battery but I see no need to start planning the replacement. It functions fine. If the car won't start or starts cranking really slow, I will test it. The replacement will come from a normal source of car batteries and the programming will come from me.

[Ed P]

Originally Posted by mackeroni

Uh...yeah. That's me. So what?

I'm saying you're right, but was using a play on words by paraphrasing the old Yankee Doodle song...

[Lucky1]

Hi, update. I have changed the battery but some of the problems persist. I was driving at low speed in 1st gear and felt a shudder and the DTC/DSC disabled light came on. Turned the car off, back on and its reset. No more long cranks but the weather also is not cold. Drove around in the work parking lot as slow as I could in both 1st and reverse gear but could not duplicate the problem. I'm not sure this is a battery dead issue or at least there may have been multiple problems with only some of them being resolved by changing the battery.

Going away for a week and thinking of leaving it with my indy to have him check it out. It isn't a severe problem right now as the car is totally drivable I just don't want it to develop into something much worse.

[PA135i]

Originally Posted by mackeroni

Q: You have a seven year old battery in a car with nearly 100,000 miles on the clock and you want to know if the battery might be going bad?

A: If the battery is not bad now, it will be in a couple days. I suggest that you change out the battery and I am betting that this will solve all your stated problems. If you still have the stated problems, you would have needed the new battery anyway, so no harm done.

Other opinions are likely forthcoming.

^^^^^ He's right..spot on.... do the bat.

[Lucky1]

Originally Posted by PA135i

^^^^^ He's right..spot on.... do the bat.

I've changed the battery and I'm still experiencing some of the same symptoms. Only happened once since so maybe its a fluke but I'm not so sure.

[chris82]

Just had all sorts of STRANGE electrical issues in my car. Battery was 7 years old with 50k miles and I got it replaced and registered. My troubles have all gone kow

[mackeroni]

Originally Posted by Lucky1

I've changed the battery and I'm still experiencing some of the same symptoms. Only happened once since so maybe its a fluke but I'm not so sure.

Should be fine now. Keep us posted. Enquiring minds want to know.

[Dackelone]

...using a VOM(Volt Ohm Meter)...

A fully charged battery should read "at least" +12.8 DCvolts when the car is off and sitting over night. When the engine is running... the battery voltage across the plus and minus terminals should read "at least" +13.5 DCvolts. Also... if you measure AC voltage across the battery with the engine running... you should have NO MORE than +1 ACvolt. Anything more and your alternator is going bad.

Car batteries seem to last about five years. But IF you have ever had a dead battery... this will ruin it... so it only takes one or two good "discharges" to kill a battery. That's pretty hard to do on a BMW bc the headlights will not stay on when you shut the engine off. Also the efficient dynamics will extend the battery life. I think I've seen some guys here with 2008's on the original battery. But I think I would replace the battery after five or six years to be on the safe side. I guess it depends on how far you travel from "home base" and risk getting stuck somewhere with a dead battery.

Our cars have so many computers in them... and they do not like low voltage... IF you are having weird electrical problems... the first thing you should do is replace the battery. Then trouble shoot from there. On my old e39 the guy thought that automatic trans was bad... it was just that the battery was toast. I replaced the battery and the A/T trans shifted fine.