Oil Pan Gasket Leak, Repair Advice

[unk045]

Hey folks, I'm pretty convinced I have an oil pan gasket leak based on the pics. My OFHG is dry and has been previously changed. The car has 95K miles with a N52 and is not a SULEV.

Seems like I have 2 options which is to remove the subframe and steering rack to drop the oil pan or do the cut gasket and use sealant method. I know the spacing is tight and I imagine if what I'm about to propose is an option, it would've already been performed/suggested but I'll ask because I'm curious.

Is it possible to remove all the oil pan bolts and try to wiggle it out? It's tight but from looking at it, it seems like it could be done...unless I'm missing something which it seems like I am since I maybe oversimplifying it.

Since the bolts seems to be accessible and the pan can seem to be removed (albeit with some difficulty), any insight as to why the steering rack and subframe need to be removed?

Thank you

[519.E82]

Having done this job a couple weeks ago, 100% do not attempt the cutting method, drop the subframe. I highly recommend just getting an engine brace and doing the oil pan gasket and engine mounts at the same time. The jobs not that bad, search a DIY N52 oil pan gasket, and follow the one on E90 post. The job has less steps for our cars than they describe so its easier than they mention. Its really not a lot of steps and will save a lot of headache. And if your wondering why do the engine mounts if the pan is leaking at that km its not much money for parts and you wont have to drop the subframe all over again.

For starters even with like the extra inches of room i had getting the pan in was still a fight (i had a jank solution). Replacing the engine mounts was super easy, and having them out on the driver side gives you an entire new angle/hole to access bolts from. If you have an automatic there is transmission cooler lines that run along the driver side of the pan, remove them from their brackets to get a ton of play and then you have 2 options. I went with have a second person pull on the lines enough that you can fit an extension with a u-joint in there to get a socket on the bolts. If you can't have a second person help it will be a struggle or you can remove the lines from the transmission and loose a bit of fluid (not sure how that goes as o opted not too). You don't have to do any work on the steering rack it just drops with the frame which is held on by 6 bolts.

I recommend ordering the BMW oil pan gasket, you'll need a new bolt set (its different if you have an auto vs manual), and if you do the mounts go with the Corteco on FCP its the OE (
22116760330KT). You can also do a new oil level sensor seal, i ordered one (not expensive) but chose not to do it since the one bolt looked a bit rusty and didn't want to risk it. Last note; if you normally do 6.5L of oil you'll want to do around 7L this time as you'll notice even after draining the car and leave it all night theres still a fair bit in the pan.

[Bimmer-Bob]

Originally Posted by unk045

Hey folks, I'm pretty convinced I have an oil pan gasket leak based on the pics. My OFHG is dry and has been previously changed. The car has 95K miles with a N52 and is not a SULEV.

Seems like I have 2 options which is to remove the subframe and steering rack to drop the oil pan or do the cut gasket and use sealant method. I know the spacing is tight and I imagine if what I'm about to propose is an option, it would've already been performed/suggested but I'll ask because I'm curious.

Is it possible to remove all the oil pan bolts and try to wiggle it out? It's tight but from looking at it, it seems like it could be done...unless I'm missing something which it seems like I am since I maybe oversimplifying it.

Since the bolts seems to be accessible and the pan can seem to be removed (albeit with some difficulty), any insight as to why the steering rack and subframe need to be removed?

Thank you

I guess it depends how handy you are, what tools you have at your disposal, how much money you have, etc.

If it were me, I would do it correctly. I would probably contact a good indie for a quote, because sometimes it's worth sparing yourself the headache, and dropping the subframe sounds like a headache. Then again, it is sometimes more satisfying to just do it yourself, even if you need to spend some of the money saved on new tools (would you need an engine support bar for this?). I do have the luxury of a second car to drive, so that means I can DIY stuff without the pressure of needing to hurry up and finish the job in order to get to work.

Under no circumstances would I attempt to reseal the oil pan with anything other than a proper gasket. Nor would I get rid of the car - I've actually heard of people buying a new car rather than deal with stuff like this. As far as I'm concerned, replacing gaskets, bushings, or anything else rubber on a car is a maintenance item, and in the long run it's way cheaper to fix it right than buy a new car.

[asbrr]

As an alternate suggestion/delay tactic - if you tighten the bolts another quarter to half turn, that can stop initial leak/seepage.

I spent a ton on the car last year and had this leak, asked the mechanic to do this (he looked at me like I was crazy but tried it), and it stopped the leak. Now I'm under no illusion about how long this will last but it's been 6 months and the underbody is dry, oil level is holding. I know of another 1er locally that had success with the same method over a year ago with no leak so far.

Obviously you don't want to overtighten, hence you limit how much you crank down....

Just a thought...

[unk045]

Originally Posted by 519.E82

Having done this job a couple weeks ago, 100% do not attempt the cutting method, drop the subframe. I highly recommend just getting an engine brace and doing the oil pan gasket and engine mounts at the same time. The jobs not that bad, search a DIY N52 oil pan gasket, and follow the one on E90 post. The job has less steps for our cars than they describe so its easier than they mention. Its really not a lot of steps and will save a lot of headache. And if your wondering why do the engine mounts if the pan is leaking at that km its not much money for parts and you wont have to drop the subframe all over again.

For starters even with like the extra inches of room i had getting the pan in was still a fight (i had a jank solution). Replacing the engine mounts was super easy, and having them out on the driver side gives you an entire new angle/hole to access bolts from. If you have an automatic there is transmission cooler lines that run along the driver side of the pan, remove them from their brackets to get a ton of play and then you have 2 options. I went with have a second person pull on the lines enough that you can fit an extension with a u-joint in there to get a socket on the bolts. If you can't have a second person help it will be a struggle or you can remove the lines from the transmission and loose a bit of fluid (not sure how that goes as o opted not too). You don't have to do any work on the steering rack it just drops with the frame which is held on by 6 bolts.

I recommend ordering the BMW oil pan gasket, you'll need a new bolt set (its different if you have an auto vs manual), and if you do the mounts go with the Corteco on FCP its the OE (
22116760330KT). You can also do a new oil level sensor seal, i ordered one (not expensive) but chose not to do it since the one bolt looked a bit rusty and didn't want to risk it. Last note; if you normally do 6.5L of oil you'll want to do around 7L this time as you'll notice even after draining the car and leave it all night theres still a fair bit in the pan.

Appreciate the elaborate response 519.E82. This job is pretty advanced for me so I wouldn't be tackling it alone and I don't have all the tools for it either (or the room to store it for that matter). I have a manual and that was one of the things I was thinking of...what other jobs should I tackle outside of motor mounts if I decide to do the gasket?

Also, since you recently did this, can you share why the sub frame needs to be removed? Is it because the oil pan bolts need to be accessed or to be able to remove the pan? When I looked, it seemed that the pan could be removed without needing to remove the subframe. It wouldn't be easy, but it seemed doable.

Originally Posted by Bimmer-Bob

I guess it depends how handy you are, what tools you have at your disposal, how much money you have, etc.

If it were me, I would do it correctly. I would probably contact a good indie for a quote, because sometimes it's worth sparing yourself the headache, and dropping the subframe sounds like a headache. Then again, it is sometimes more satisfying to just do it yourself, even if you need to spend some of the money saved on new tools (would you need an engine support bar for this?). I do have the luxury of a second car to drive, so that means I can DIY stuff without the pressure of needing to hurry up and finish the job in order to get to work.

Under no circumstances would I attempt to reseal the oil pan with anything other than a proper gasket. Nor would I get rid of the car - I've actually heard of people buying a new car rather than deal with stuff like this. As far as I'm concerned, replacing gaskets, bushings, or anything else rubber on a car is a maintenance item, and in the long run it's way cheaper to fix it right than buy a new car.

Thanks for the reply Bimmer-Bob. I'm fortunate to have a second car as well so I won't be stranded. Indy is definitely an option, but I'm not there yet and preferably I'd rather not go the indy route. My philosophy is if I mess up, at least I'll know what I did and figure out a solution, rather than be in for a surprise problem at some point and have to chase down the source.

Originally Posted by asbrr

As an alternate suggestion/delay tactic - if you tighten the bolts another quarter to half turn, that can stop initial leak/seepage.

I spent a ton on the car last year and had this leak, asked the mechanic to do this (he looked at me like I was crazy but tried it), and it stopped the leak. Now I'm under no illusion about how long this will last but it's been 6 months and the underbody is dry, oil level is holding. I know of another 1er locally that had success with the same method over a year ago with no leak so far.

Obviously you don't want to overtighten, hence you limit how much you crank down....

Just a thought...

Very good point asbrr and I appreciate you sharing that and I was actually thinking the same. I tried it with one of the corner bolts and it was tricky doing it with a regular socket or wrench. I got some e-sockets so I'll be trying that to hopefully see if it will hold.

I've read that the bolts are easy to snap so with that in mind and also wanting to tighten enough to hopefully stop the leak, you think a quarter to half a turn should be enough? Or perhaps torqued to spec is an option? Only problem is it seems that they have different bolt lengths and I think I came across different torque specs for the different bolt types used. This is a problem because you don't know which bolt is which with the pan still attached.

[519.E82]

Originally Posted by unk045

Appreciate the elaborate response 519.E82. This job is pretty advanced for me so I wouldn't be tackling it alone and I don't have all the tools for it either (or the room to store it for that matter). I have a manual and that was one of the things I was thinking of...what other jobs should I tackle outside of motor mounts if I decide to do the gasket?

Also, since you recently did this, can you share why the sub frame needs to be removed? Is it because the oil pan bolts need to be accessed or to be able to remove the pan? When I looked, it seemed that the pan could be removed without needing to remove the subframe. It wouldn't be easy, but it seemed doable.



Thanks for the reply Bimmer-Bob. I'm fortunate to have a second car as well so I won't be stranded. Indy is definitely an option, but I'm not there yet and preferably I'd rather not go the indy route. My philosophy is if I mess up, at least I'll know what I did and figure out a solution, rather than be in for a surprise problem at some point and have to chase down the source.



Very good point asbrr and I appreciate you sharing that and I was actually thinking the same. I tried it with one of the corner bolts and it was tricky doing it with a regular socket or wrench. I got some e-sockets so I'll be trying that to hopefully see if it will hold.

I've read that the bolts are easy to snap so with that in mind and also wanting to tighten enough to hopefully stop the leak, you think a quarter to half a turn should be enough? Or perhaps torqued to spec is an option? Only problem is it seems that they have different bolt lengths and I think I came across different torque specs for the different bolt types used. This is a problem because you don't know which bolt is which with the pan still attached.

The subframe needs to be dropped to be able to get the pan in and out (It may help accessing some of the bolts with it out too i never tried with the subframe up). All the passenger side bolts were a piece of cake its just the driver side that gets annoying. I think what you're forgetting is the portion where the transmission meets the oil pan and the internals of the engine. Off the bat you need to drop the pan at the back a couple inches to clear the transmission so you can pull the rest out. Theres also internals to the engine that sit lower than others so at the front you have to lower than raise then lower the pan while pulling it out. When you drop the subframe you can also move it around a fair bit so currently lets say theres X amount of room between where the pan would be (the lowest part where it meets the trans) and the subframe. If you push the subframe forward several inches, that give you a lot more playroom when trying to angle the pan in and out.

As for tightening the bolts I would not recommend trying that. Basically every bolt is the same torque spec for 90% of the bolts i believe its 8nm + 90 Degrees. The bolts where it meets the transmission are the different length bolts that for my automatic atleast were 8nm + 180 degrees. The 90/180 stretches the bolts so if you try tightening more past that or reusing the bolts you will brake them or not get a good long lasting seal.

[asbrr]

Originally Posted by unk045

Very good point asbrr and I appreciate you sharing that and I was actually thinking the same. I tried it with one of the corner bolts and it was tricky doing it with a regular socket or wrench. I got some e-sockets so I'll be trying that to hopefully see if it will hold.

I've read that the bolts are easy to snap so with that in mind and also wanting to tighten enough to hopefully stop the leak, you think a quarter to half a turn should be enough? Or perhaps torqued to spec is an option? Only problem is it seems that they have different bolt lengths and I think I came across different torque specs for the different bolt types used. This is a problem because you don't know which bolt is which with the pan still attached.

I mean you definitely have to be careful as you're right, bolts can snap as you and other posters have mentioned. I was at the point where I didn't want to drop more money into the car and if a bolt snapped the subframe etc would have to drop anyway so I told the mechanic to try it. Obviously you don't want to attack them like a gorilla, go around the entire pan doing very minor increments (do a criss cross pattern to keep things even, not sequential) and don't go beyond 1/4 turn in your first run. I would stop there and clean things up and re-evaluate.

Now note that I wasn't there when my mechanic did the tightening, he was using judgement and "feel" to see how much resistance there was, so definiteley use discretion if you go this route. It's not something BMW would condone I'm sure, so it's really a judgement call for you to make on your own car....

Basically take anything said here (especially this method) as "internet advisement"

Good luck!

[nmit]

I have a leak as well in my oil pan for my 128i. Would Bluedevil oil stop leak work for this?

[unk045]

I personally wouldn't use these sort of things on any car particularly bimmers or any German car for that matter...but that's just me.

[desertman123]

Originally Posted by nmit

I have a leak as well in my oil pan for my 128i. Would Bluedevil oil stop leak work for this?

Never ever. It's not "fix a leak in a can", it's "pour this in if you want to buy a new motor, in a can".

Don't overtighten the oil pan bolts, don't even bother. The gasket is dried up, cracked and shrunk. You'll just prolong the inevitable. Or you'll get a quick lesson on how to remove broken bolts from the block.

There are good DIY tutorials on E90Post's side of things that show a detailed step-by-step on how to replace this gasket. It does require a few techniques that you may not be totally comfortable doing, but that's all a part of learning.

Get the $90 Harbor Freight engine brace, use your tow hook and screw it into the block under the plastic engine cover, nearby the oil filter housing. Place the engine stand nearby the shock towers and use the hook to juuust barely lift up the front of the engine. Then you can safely remove the subframe and oil pan. And do not reuse any of those bolts.

Or just pay someone to do it. There are independent BMW mechanics all over. Yes it'll be pricey, but this is an aging German "luxury" brand car, and you really gotta pay to play. Aren't we all keeping a little cash aside for repairs?

[///Makis]

Originally Posted by desertman123

Never ever. It's not "fix a leak in a can", it's "pour this in if you want to buy a new motor, in a can".

Don't overtighten the oil pan bolts, don't even bother. The gasket is dried up, cracked and shrunk. You'll just prolong the inevitable. Or you'll get a quick lesson on how to remove broken bolts from the block.

There are good DIY tutorials on E90Post's side of things that show a detailed step-by-step on how to replace this gasket. It does require a few techniques that you may not be totally comfortable doing, but that's all a part of learning.

Get the $90 Harbor Freight engine brace, use your tow hook and screw it into the block under the plastic engine cover, nearby the oil filter housing. Place the engine stand nearby the shock towers and use the hook to juuust barely lift up the front of the engine. Then you can safely remove the subframe and oil pan. And do not reuse any of those bolts.

Or just pay someone to do it. There are independent BMW mechanics all over. Yes it'll be pricey, but this is an aging German "luxury" brand car, and you really gotta pay to play. Aren't we all keeping a little cash aside for repairs?

When you say it like, it doesn't seem so bad.

But what's the 1x4 for?

[Almuliman]

Originally Posted by ///Makis

When you say it like, it doesn't seem so bad.

But what's the 1x4 for?

Making d*** sure the hood doesn't drop on you or the engine brace if the struts fail?

[desertman123]

Originally Posted by Almuliman

Making d*** sure the hood doesn't drop on you or the engine brace if the struts fail?

Yeah my hood struts were shot at the time, and it hadn't fallen on my head yet so I wasn't urged to order new ones.

The job wasn't as difficult as I though it'd be. Just time consuming. But I think I had some friends over having beers in the garage, sooo it probably could've gone faster!

[///Makis]

Originally Posted by Almuliman

Making d*** sure the hood doesn't drop on you or the engine brace if the struts fail?

Hahahahaha yeah that makes sense 😂