[statelax3]

I am not sure what to title my thread but bear with me.

Goals: 400whp, Mods easy to remove for service, daily driving dependability.

Currently Running: DP's and Cobb. Also always run 93.

This is my first turbo car that has tons of aftermarket parts and goodies. I have never run a piggy tune before. The flash tune is a no brain'er because of the simplicity of taking it on and off the car.

Now to my thinking about doing 2 things. I would like some opinions on both.

1. Add fmic and a panel filter then run Cobb 2+. This method seems the easiest to me because I am familiar and confident in the cobb and putting the fmic on is not a big deal. With that said I am looking at an easy 4 hours to remove these items and go back to stock. I do like how quick the turbos spool now with my DP's. So I am comfortable with the idea of this set up.

2. Sell my DP's and Cobb. Add a WW meth setup and a Procede. I am not familiar with meth as I have never used it before. I understand the concept behind it. I think this route would be easier to take on and off then the other scenario. This seems like it would need pretty constant attention where the other way does not. One plus here is my DP's and Cobb would almost pay for going this route instead of buying a fmic.

So what would you do. Do you meth guys drive yours everyday? Is it a pain to keep putting meth in? I end up filling up about 1.75 to 2 times a week.

Thanks for the answers.

[Ilma]

I fill the WW resovoir once a week whether it's low or not.

Mine seems to last a little more than a week.

Hellblazer posted an excellent way of safely mixing your meth and dosing it into the WW container here: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...5&postcount=51

I use it and it works like a charm.

That guy is full of great ideas on the PWM kit.

I have had my kit for 3 weeks now and like any other meth kit, you are going to see dramatic drops in your intake temperatures and can run higher boost pressures without resorting to using race gas octanes.

So far the only weakness in this WW concept is losing prime in the line.

The WW pickup hose is lower than the meth pump, so gravity siphons the fluid backwards into the WW tank leaving an air pocket in the line. The resulting air gap makes it difficult to get good meth flow sometimes and many have found that spraying the wipers purges the air pocket and you are back in business.

I have found that this procedure overcomes the problem......but unfortunately I also found that it stained my paint.

Fortunately I was able to polish out the stains but have since rerouted the washer hose to vent into the wheel well so that none sprays onto the car's paint.

Other than that, the kit marries seamlessly to the tune and the built-in failsafe system works when it should and the performance map flips on only when a safe percentage of meth is already flowing.

The hardest part of the install was the charge pipe but the rest was a walk in the park.

That said.....some of the Cobb testers who have tried both....indicate that the Stage 2+ may not be quite as fast as a high boost +meth setup, but it approaches the same performance level without having the maintenance and headaches of a meth setup.

And Cobb intends to release a meth map too!

[statelax3]

Thanks for all the information. This is the exact kind of info I am after.

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

You can always get a jb4 and use that to add boost with your ww meth kit. Pm dzenno as he is running Cobb and using the jb4 to control his meth system.

Mike

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

You know there is no right answer. You just gotta go with your gut instinct.

I do daily drive my BMW with methanol for atleast 2 years now. I only have a heavy foot now and then otherwise i drive like a grandma.

Give me a ring if you decide to change your route or have any questions.

[statelax3]

Originally Posted by Jeff@topgearsolutions

You know there is no right answer. You just gotta go with your gut instinct.

I do daily drive my BMW with methanol for atleast 2 years now. I only have a heavy foot now and then otherwise i drive like a grandma.

Give me a ring if you decide to change your route or have any questions.

this is all your fault! if i had not talked to you a week ago i would not have even known this was an option. but when i figure it out you will be the only one i call.

[EastBayE90]

Meth used to scare a lot of people thinking it is a huge hassle. I came from tuning Hondas for years and always looked at meth as something I would never use.

After buying the 335 I even told myself I would wait until my warranty is up (2013) until I even started modding it. Yea right that's lasted 1 day and I was knocking on Shivs door. I will admit cars are my profession and I am a mechanic so the meth system makes sense to me and I understand what is required to maintain the system.

I honestly thought it was going to be harder. The PWM meth kit has been so easy that I have never once worried about it. I go out back mix up some meth only takes 3 min or so then go out to the car and fill her up once every week or two. I commute 50 miles a day during the week so I don't spray meth much unless there are some punks looking to play. Other wise I'm a straight meth addict on the weekends. I spray everywhere I go. It's all up to you on how you use the system.

I think anyone can easily use this system once installed. If your not mechanically inclined I recommend taking it some where to be installed. Once installed meth is very low maintenance. You just have to learn to respect it as a very flammable substance. No spills, no open flame near it, no leaks. Once you respect it and understand the system a little it is actually very simple and easy to use. I highly recommend meth to anyone that has a head on there shoulders and is ready to tinker a little bit with the car. You can learn a lot from just using a meth system.

If you don't want any extra worries and the idea of meth completely scares you and you do not want to learn a new concept than maybe the cobb route is a safer choice. It's ultimately up to you but no choice is wrong.

[Jeff@TopGearSolutions]

Originally Posted by statelax3

this is all your fault! if i had not talked to you a week ago i would not have even known this was an option. but when i figure it out you will be the only one i call.

Can't beat it for HP/Dollar and ease of install.

[Ilma]

I will add one more thing to the list here......

Whichever tune you go with, add meth.

Not just for the fun factor, but because the engine is safer and happier on it with more headroom towards knock resistance.

You don't have to crank up the power much more if you don't want to, but even on moderate power levels, the cooling benefit to your intake charge and your combustion chamber cannot be understated.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by Ilma

I will add one more thing to the list here......

Whichever tune you go with, add meth.

Not just for the fun factor, but because the engine is safer and happier on it with more headroom towards knock resistance.

You don't have to crank up the power much more if you don't want to, but even on moderate power levels, the cooling benefit to your intake charge and your combustion chamber cannot be understated.

+10

From a tuner's perspective, I'm far more comfortable handing over the keys to a 430whp FBO car running meth than a 400whp FBO running on pump gas. The meth car will feel better, run smoother and much cooler. Today, we did 60 dyno runs on 6AT without even factory oil cooler. When meth was enabled and the car made 430+whp, oil temps didn't even creep up 240F. When meth was disabled (and the car made 30-40whp less), oil temps would rise to 260-270F without much effort. And on the road, no comparison.

[AU335i]

Originally Posted by Ilma

You don't have to crank up the power much more if you don't want to, but even on moderate power levels, the cooling benefit to your intake charge and your combustion chamber cannot be understated.

in this case, for using meth just for the cooling effects and not extra power potential... what would be a good starting point for psi to start spraying? someone told me for using meth as just a cooling solution, you might be better off just setting it to either peak boost or close to it. any truth to this?

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by AU335i

in this case, for using meth just for the cooling effects and not extra power potential... what would be a good starting point for psi to start spraying? someone told me for using meth as just a cooling solution, you might be better off just setting it to either peak boost or close to it. any truth to this?

The Vishnu kit starts spraying meth around 6 to 7 psi, but ramps it up to full flow with a progressive slope by 13-14 psi.

I would think you should cool on as continous of a basis as possible.....not just for a brief squirt.

Only hookers are good for that.

I don't think spraying only close to peak boost is a good strategy....but that's just an uninformed opinion.

[statelax3]

ok so i am talked into it. i want to look at some dyno's that are meth and tune only now.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by statelax3

ok so i am talked into it. i want to look at some dyno's that are meth and tune only now.

We'll have many to post up later today. Currently on a the dyno with a Procede+DCI+PWM meth. Making 410whp and 445lbft of torque. With boost tapering off to 15psi by 6200rpm and 13psi by 6500rpm. Boost Control DC ramps up to 60% by 5500rpm and falls down to ~45% up top. IATs on a 35C day stay below 36C. By all measures, this car (Hellblazer420's) is has happy as a clam.

[rismo]

I run the Shiv PMW kit now for two weeks... on a daily business car... (I think i'm the fastest consultant in our country LOL) but it's no hassle.. sometimes I use map1 mostly map4 doing about 500km a week... fill it up in the weekend and all is fine... next best thing after tune and suspension mod.

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by rismo123

I run the Shiv PMW kit now for two weeks... on a daily business car... (I think i'm the fastest consultant in our country LOL) but it's no hassle.. sometimes I use map1 mostly map4 doing about 500km a week... fill it up in the weekend and all is fine... next best thing after tune and suspension mod.

Awesome. But I think you will drop a deuce on yourself once you try the aggressive meth maps we are testing now. Imagine another 25-30whp all through the entire low end and midrange.

Shiv

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

We'll have many to post up later today. Currently on a the dyno with a Procede+DCI+PWM meth. Making 410whp and 445lbft of torque. With boost tapering off to 15psi by 6200rpm and 13psi by 6500rpm. Boost Control DC ramps up to 60% by 5500rpm and falls down to ~45% up top. IATs on a 35C day stay below 36C. By all measures, this car (Hellblazer420's) is has happy as a clam.

Intersesting comparison of boost.

The 7-29 map I run at UT=55 also hits 15 psi at 6200......but is still up there at 14.8 psi @ 6500 rpm. So almost 1.8 psi more than your current testing.

Curious what you are peaking the boost at with the stock exhaust. Can it still get up to 18psi in the midrange on Hellblazers car?

I know Cobb already went on record saying the stock turbos are within efficiency up to 18 psi below 5K rpm.

[rismo]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Awesome. But I think you will drop a deuce on yourself once you try the aggressive meth maps we are testing now. Imagine another 25-30whp all through the entire low end and midrange.

Shiv

Looking forward... you have my mail account... :-D

[EastBayE90]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

We'll have many to post up later today. Currently on a the dyno with a Procede+DCI+PWM meth. Making 410whp and 445lbft of torque. With boost tapering off to 15psi by 6200rpm and 13psi by 6500rpm. Boost Control DC ramps up to 60% by 5500rpm and falls down to ~45% up top. IATs on a 35C day stay below 36C. By all measures, this car (Hellblazer420's) is has happy as a clam.

Shiv you rock the party that rocks the party. I cannot wait.

[Ilma]

Originally Posted by (-(ellblazer420

Shiv you rock the party that rocks the party. I cannot wait.

GET READY FOR THRUST.......

(in a good way though)

[3coupe]

i didn't know there were so many things to consider when running meth.

i just bought a cooling mist kit for my procede v5....is this a bad combo, should i consider replacing the meth kit?

[OpenFlash]

Quick Tune+Meth+DCI update:

409whp/444lbft