A few mods with dynos

[sredish]

do the down pipes need make a need for more fuel or not? If so, is the SSTT going to support the downpipes / intercooler well? What kind of DP's and what are you doing to deal with the 02? I'd have rather seen the downpipes in LIEU of the intercooler.

[theanhdy]

How much was your intercooler and was it hard to install? My SSTT is coming in tomorrow but I only have ~700miles so I might wait until 1500miles to install it.

[Wraith]

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

He has a MT....

Thankyou :smile:

I've seen all the dyno info on the other thread for the 335i cars with the auto steptronic trans, also with very impressive results and I assume the auto trans is ok at those power levels ??

[Wraith]

Originally Posted by eunosracr

So where are the guys that claim the open element filter will reduce power because of heat soak? Anyone, anyone? Didnt think so.

From my own personal experience with previous cars with open pod filters, they do in fact result in less power output, once the temps under the bonnet heat up !

When you've got the car on the dyno, it's not the same as the bonnet is open and the hot air can escape and there's a fan set up in front of the car blowing air there as well...

I used to always notice a drop in power after driving for some time, especially during very hot summer days, compared with just after start up with an open pod- when fitted with a CAI the power was more consistant. :smile:

[Wraith]

Originally Posted by Kris

240kw @ the wheels are some very health numbers!

Hello Chris :smile:

Have you, or are you going to do any tuning to your 135i ??

Reason I ask is because your located in Aust - like myself - what are the options available for us ??

I've already heard of a couple of options, such as Xede and Haltech, but don't know of anyone with 135i or 335i here who has done it...

Cheers :smile:

[TunedM2C]

Originally Posted by tec548

We made it in the shop in about 30 minutes. I'm using 2.43" stainless steel pipe flanged to 3" with K&N X flow cones. I was most impressed with what it did.

Joel

This seems to be the newest trend and one I'll most likely follow.

[Kris]

Originally Posted by Wraith

Hello Chris :smile:

Have you, or are you going to do any tuning to your 135i ??

Reason I ask is because your located in Aust - like myself - what are the options available for us ??

I've already heard of a couple of options, such as Xede and Haltech, but don't know of anyone with 135i or 335i here who has done it...

Cheers :smile:

Gday Wraith

I'm Kris - Not Chris

I'll more than likely take up something with Proceed, Vishnu or SST as they seem to be popular with the Aussie 335 crowd. Maybe even the Shark Injector when it comes out.

Won't be going with any of the aussie crowd for chips.... Same with my S3, UK/US developed APR chip I had was great!

[Wraith]

Originally Posted by Kris

Gday Wraith

I'm Kris - Not Chris

I'll more than likely take up something with Proceed, Vishnu or SST as they seem to be popular with the Aussie 335 crowd. Maybe even the Shark Injector when it comes out.

Won't be going with any of the aussie crowd for chips.... Same with my S3, UK/US developed APR chip I had was great!

Oops, appologies 'Kris' :smile:

Thanks for the info, I'll probably do the same...

I also have O/S tuning software on my Astra, which is a turbo convertible :smile:

I look forward to seeing how you go :smile:

[Brandon26pdx]

Originally Posted by Wraith

From my own personal experience with previous cars with open pod filters, they do in fact result in less power output, once the temps under the bonnet heat up !

When you've got the car on the dyno, it's not the same as the bonnet is open and the hot air can escape and there's a fan set up in front of the car blowing air there as well...

I used to always notice a drop in power after driving for some time, especially during very hot summer days, compared with just after start up with an open pod- when fitted with a CAI the power was more consistant. :smile:

Finally someone attempts to intelligently explain this phenomenon.

I've found that installing open filters in the engine bay just causes the engine performance to get pukey when underhood temps soar on a hot day in traffic, but the stock airbox doesn't look as cool as two K&N's hanging there in the engine bay like a couple of exotic fruits.

[tec548]

Originally Posted by 5soko

nice numbers, what octane were you on... on long did you let each mod adapt, i.e. when u installed the SSTT, AA IC, and 2x cones?

again great numbers, those filter really let everything open up it seems.

We have approximately 1 week between all of the different runs. Three days is the shortest time between them. Mileage between dyno runs (different mods) varies but a couple hundred at the least. All pulls were Shell 93 and temps varied from 92F to 99F with high relative humidity (sticky hot here).

I was hopeing to have the RR catless DP's dynoed for you all today but that's not going to happen. Hopefully I will have them dynoed and posted mid next week.

Joel

[eunosracr]

Originally Posted by Brandon26pdx

Finally someone attempts to intelligently explain this phenomenon.

I've found that installing open filters in the engine bay just causes the engine performance to get pukey when underhood temps soar on a hot day in traffic, but the stock airbox doesn't look as cool as two K&N's hanging there in the engine bay like a couple of exotic fruits.

I am running the BMS and the car feels much better in traffic with heatsoak and all. That is why we have an intercooler. Have you ever seen Japan's most harcdore tuners? They simply stick the filter on the turbo and call it a day. The intercooler does the rest.

See below for reference. I would think these guys know a thing or two about tuning cars, yet they all have exotic fruit open filters. Guess they just do it for looks rigghtttttt.....

Furthermore, why would all the big power n54's run open filters if they are that bad and hurt performace so much?

[WAY]

Originally Posted by Wraith

Oops, appologies 'Kris' :smile:

Thanks for the info, I'll probably do the same...

I also have O/S tuning software on my Astra, which is a turbo convertible :smile:

I look forward to seeing how you go :smile:

Wrath, you need to go to the Australian section of the forum. Very active there! I am going to go with AA Xede and intercooler smply because we have a local distributor (who is on the forum) who can support any issues. I am just waiting for them to sort out the v81 issue. Not sure about filters yet but not a massive fan of cone type filters. I don't know why the AA chip isn't more popular on this forum. They have fantastic reputation and race record!

[~ILLEST 1~]

tec548,

have you noticed any decrease in mpg with the sstt? maybe it's too early considering it was put in yesterday, but still?

[rcracer_tx]

Originally Posted by Brandon26pdx

Finally someone attempts to intelligently explain this phenomenon.

I've found that installing open filters in the engine bay just causes the engine performance to get pukey when underhood temps soar on a hot day in traffic, but the stock airbox doesn't look as cool as two K&N's hanging there in the engine bay like a couple of exotic fruits.

Have you ever even used a quality open cone filter?:iono:
There is a reason why all highly modified cars have open filters, and it is not to hurt performance and raise intake temps.

[scottp999]

Original Poster - excellent info and great gains.

To the people worried about the heat and the air filters. That would be more of a worry for a naturally aspirated car. On our turbo cars there is a negligible difference because of how the airflow works. The air goes through the turbos before the inter-cooler and that is where it picks up the majority of the heat.

"Regarding heatsoak:
What people need to remember is that with an intercooled turbo car, approx 80% of all the heat introduced into the system through sucking in warm underhood air, compressing air in the turbo and sending it through pipe bends will be removed.

So that means if ambient temp is 80F
And air being sucked in by the air filter is 100F
And compressor outlet temp is 250F

... total heat rise is 250-80 or 180 deg F. The intercooler will remove at last 80% of that (or 144 deg F). That means actual manifold air temp (what actually matters) drops to 106 deg F.

Even if we were to create a fully sealed airbox that breathed in 80F air, using the same calculations, manifold air temp would be 102 deg F. A 4 deg change isn't going to amount to anything significant.

However, if you run a restrictive air box/intake set-up, you will effectively run a higher pressure ratio which can easily increase turbo outlet temps by 50 deg F. Even cold air ducted, this will lead to higher manifold air temps (do the math!) and more exhaust backpressure. Yuck. The temp rise caused by the factory airbox trying to support 14psi has been documented through datalogs that I posted up a few weeks ago.

If you're car was naturally aspirated (and therefore didn't have an intercooler, it is 100% true that you want to breathe the coldest air possible from your intake. I think people are used to this model and tend to think it applies the same for turbo engines.

Shiv"

from: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=120

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by scottp999

So that means if ambient temp is 80F
And air being sucked in by the air filter is 100F
And compressor outlet temp is 250F

0

And that's where the whole calculations is screwed up. The temps under the hood in the area where these filters are located are WAY over 100F. It's probably more like 170F.

I would regularly see IAT measurements on my GTO that were over 160F and the air filter wasn't anywhere near as close to the engine.

I'm not saying these things don't work, I'm just saying that a setup with equal restriction and cooler air would work better.

[ScottyGams]

nice jpb, and thanks for the numbers.

a BMW exhaust, SSTT, and a BMW intake sounds like a modest tune with good #s

[tec548]

I am using the catless DP's with the SIMs.

Does anyone know of an A-piller 52mm guage pod that will fit the 135? I want to put a boost/vac gauge in the cabin but I can't find anything to fit it. I currently have it under the hood... good for testing but not for monitoring while driving.

To try to settle the intake debate I will try to log IAT's with the cone filters and then put the stock AB on and log the IAT at the inlet side. All temps will be street driving. I'll try to get that done by the end of next week as well.

Joel

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by tec548

I am using the catless DP's with the SIMs.

Does anyone know of an A-piller 52mm guage pod that will fit the 135? I want to put a boost/vac gauge in the cabin but I can't find anything to fit it. I currently have it under the hood... good for testing but not for monitoring while driving.

To try to settle the intake debate I will try to log IAT's with the cone filters and then put the stock AB on and log the IAT at the inlet side. All temps will be street driving. I'll try to get that done by the end of next week as well.

Joel

Joel, you cant mount a boost gauge on the A-pillars of these cars because there is an airbag inside of them. If/when the airbag goes off the boost gauge would become a dangerous projectile....

[e90AW335i]

As far as the filter setup is concerned please do some research and see what all of the high HP 335i's are running. The fastest trap speed, and the fastest ET were both achieved by cars using open element intakes in the engine bay.

The highest hp put down by a 335i, 430rwhp, was done using cone filters.

There is a reason why you have an intercooler guys, if you are really worried about IAT then get an upgraded one....

[tec548]

Originally Posted by e90AW335i

Joel, you cant mount a boost gauge on the A-pillars of these cars because there is an airbag inside of them. If/when the airbag goes off the boost gauge would become a dangerous projectile....

I'm an NRA member... that doesn't worry me.

Joel

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by tec548

I'm an NRA member... that doesn't worry me.

Joel

Hey, sorry we couldn't get the timing worked out today I completely forgot about that other thing I had to do. I am going to get it done next weekend for sure if you will have me.

I am also gonna want to do some dyno testing after the install as well. I will call you mid-week to set everything up.

Thanks Joel....