1M vs M2 by carfection

[Shooto82]

[Stoney80]

We'll that pretty much sums up what has been written here all along.

[Dackelone]

Nice video!

[Iceman21]

I think that's a fair comparison.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Iceman21

I think that's a fair comparison.

Yes. I thinks so too. The m2 is
Awesome but there
Are
Some things I prefer on the original

[mrphil]

50 1m delivered in my country and 7 has been listed for sale in the last 2weeks with prices dropping and sellers getting desperate

M2 is selling well!!

[COChris]

Funny how these comparisons keep coming up.

You'll never see the new M2 compared to the next generation M3 or M4 in the future.

... That's what makes the 1M great forever.

[champignon]

Originally Posted by mrphil

50 1m delivered in my country and 7 has been listed for sale in the last 2weeks with prices dropping and sellers getting desperate

M2 is selling well!!

Data is questionable (tiny market, 2 isolated and small islands) and at best unrepresentative.

From what I have read in N. America, the exact opposite is occurring here.

Personally speaking, I'm not selling, and I have no interest in buying an M2, although from what I have read it is a competent car. I just bought a 6MT Golf R as my "utility car," replacing a Subaru STi. Comparing the R to most anything else that BMW is now selling in N. America (not including the M2), the R will give a lot of former BMW buyers pause. It is fun to drive, of semi-luxury class, more practical, and cheaper than most everything that BMW is now peddling in MY country.

[mrphil]

Originally Posted by champignon

Data is questionable (tiny market, 2 isolated and small islands) and at best unrepresentative.

From what I have read in N. America, the exact opposite is occurring here.

Personally speaking, I'm not selling, and I have no interest in buying an M2, although from what I have read it is a competent car. I just bought a 6MT Golf R as my "utility car," replacing a Subaru STi. Comparing the R to most anything else that BMW is now selling in N. America (not including the M2), the R will give a lot of former BMW buyers pause. It is fun to drive, of semi-luxury class, more practical, and cheaper than most everything that BMW is now peddling in MY country.

Yip that's right, our market is super small just hoping they get shipped off so my car would be worth more later on lol

[1'M Blue]

Nice video and I think its an expected outcome.

[tommyb13662]

I feel this argument will rage on... and you cant really say one car is better than the other (personally Im a 1er). They are both brilliant. And to each their own. Ill take a drive for drinks with either owner and we can enjoy our car talk and spirited driving. There needs to be less focus on which is better and more on how to make each the best. Some want the raw twitchy and at the edge of control experience and others want to feel that their car can keep them secure and still pull them out if they drive past their experience. Ive learned (hopefully) on my cheaper less capable cars what my limits are and so i live driving the 1 nice and hard.

[champignon]

If the M2 was in fact better than the 1M, it would not diminish the 1M in any way; the 1M would still be what the 1M was before the first M2 rolled off the assembly line.

Cars are going to evolve and change over time for several reasons. These reasons are that the world around us is changing, car owners' expectations are changing, government regulations are changing, and unless the car companies want to close up shop and go under, they are going to have to keep producing new product and try to convince people to buy it.

The truth is that there are damned few cars still available that would meet the requirements for being a "drivers' car." We should celebrate the fact that any manufacturer is still trying to make them. And unless someone is looking for a mega-hundred thousand dollar rich person's toy, the number of currently available drivers' cars available with a manual transmission can be counted on less than the total number of fingers in both hands (one could argue, one hand).

[Stoney80]

Originally Posted by champignon

If the M2 was in fact better than the 1M, it would not diminish the 1M in any way; the 1M would still be what the 1M was before the first M2 rolled off the assembly line.

Cars are going to evolve and change over time for several reasons. These reasons are that the world around us is changing, car owners' expectations are changing, government regulations are changing, and unless the car companies want to close up shop and go under, they are going to have to keep producing new product and try to convince people to buy it.

The truth is that there are damned few cars still available that would meet the requirements for being a "drivers' car." We should celebrate the fact that any manufacturer is still trying to make them. And unless someone is looking for a mega-hundred thousand dollar rich person's toy, the number of currently available drivers' cars available with a manual transmission can be counted on less than the total number of fingers in both hands (one could argue, one hand).

It might be fun to name these remaining "driver's cars". I propose a few parameters:

1. base price below $60k
2. available manual transmission (manual only would be too restrictive in today's market)
3. 2016 or later later model year

The M2 of course, beyond that I'll start things off by suggesting the Mazda Miata and Golf R.

[champignon]

Originally Posted by Stoney80

It might be fun to name these remaining "driver's cars". I propose a few parameters:

1. base price below $60k
2. available manual transmission (manual only would be too restrictive in today's market)
3. 2016 or later later model year

The M2 of course, beyond that I'll start things off by suggesting the Mazda Miata and Golf R.

Subaru WRX and Subaru STi are easy;

$60K is maybe a little low, however then I don't know where you would logically stop, perhaps $75K all in. With a BMW, the base price is never even close to the end price, whereas some other automakers only have maybe $5K more that you can add on top of the base as you run out of options. So I'd choose an "all-in price," using typical options.

The most expensive car I have ever personally paid for is my 1M, which cost me $47.5K delivered, with 26K miles and 3.5 years on the clock. But then, I'm cheap.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Stoney80

It might be fun to name these remaining "driver's cars". I propose a few parameters:

1. base price below $60k
2. available manual transmission (manual only would be too restrictive in today's market)
3. 2016 or later later model year

The M2 of course, beyond that I'll start things off by suggesting the Mazda Miata and Golf R.

FRS/BRZ too

[champignon]

Originally Posted by nachob

FRS/BRZ too

Yes and no. It is so gutless, that it's painful. But then you could probably say that about the Miata also. I could not wait to get rid of mine, after only 1 year. Part of that was because it is very much a "made to a price" type of car, and there is only so long that a base econobox interior can be tolerated (at least by me). Small 2 door sports cars with near zero cargo room would not be uncommon, even in today's marketplace. So that niche class of car is alive and well.

What is uncommon is a fun to drive car that is at least somewhat practical. The now-departed 1 series fit that description, as do the Subaru WRX and STi duo, the Golf R, and the Ford Focus RS, and the Chevy SS. And of course I am leaving out the common American made muscle cars, which are probably not going to meet anyone's definition of being "practical."

Of these, the only ones that are at least fairly common are the Subarus, although it is impossible to know how many of the Focus RS will be produced, being as it has just been released. The SS is in its last year of production (being made in a soon-to-be-shuttered plant in Australia), unless GM decides to produce it elsewhere in the future.

[GimmeanM]

I had always thought the BRZ/FRS would be as well, although I've never driven. I knew they weren't powerful by comparison but always heard they were fun to drive.

Out of the price range you mention, but I'm looking forward to seeing the new Lotus Evora when it lands. And obviously most Porsches would tick that box. Specifically I'd love to drive a Cayman variant to see how it compares to the 1M.

People criticize the 1M for being too twitchy/ unstable but honestly I think it feels outstanding! I love that I can feel everything that is going on. Every glitch in the road or slip of a tire gets translated. I love that purposefully raw presence the car has, nothing is muted or electronically 'dealt away with'. Granted I'm not pushing the car to the absolute limit where this can bite back, but for a canyon carver (which I believe is the intended home for this car) I don't know how it could get better.

[Amnizu]

I actually think there are more great drivers cars under 60 to 70 grand than ever.

Off the top of my head other than what has already been posted:

Mustang fatback Shelby, focus rs, lotus evora / Elise, Alfa 4c, panoz roadster, caterham 7, Cayman / Boxter, lancer evo, s60 polestar, Ariel atom, 370z, rs3 (no official price yet).

[CarJunkie]

I'll keep what I have.

[champignon]

The pertinent question, since we are discussing an article, is how much impact the "press" has on vintage/used car desirability and pricing, vs. the obvious impact they have on new car sales.

When it comes to buying a new car, buyers tend to segment themselves, to "educate" themselves, and then to go try to get the best deal they can find on whatever it is that they have decided to buy. At the outset, any new particular car, comparably equipped, is going to be more or less like any other identical or similar car.

Used and vintage cars are an entirely different thing. Although this article, and many others, attempts to compare a "used" 1M to a new M2, the reality is that every used 1M is unique, as a result of how old it is, how many miles it has been driven, what kind of miles, what kind of treatment (by the driver) and what kind of maintenance and repair history it has. As one who has bought a number of used and vintage BMWs, I can tell you from personal experience that each one is different, more or less akin to comparing bottles of a fine wine separated from the case on initial sale, with some being stored in a proper cellar, some going into a closet, and some sitting in a box next to the water heater or furnace

And you can't always tell which one has been stored next to the furnace vs. the one perfectly cellared based on the sales description or even an inspection of the bottle. It is the same with used cars.

The 1M will always have its fans. It will, however, be viewed as a used or vintage car going forward, and any comparisons with current production cars will be as much based on romanticism with the past as it will be based on the actual reality of the 1M vs. whatever car it is compared to that is currently in production.

[Dee Pee]

Focus RS bruh
And yeah...I agree with Carfection's review.
I might change my mind when/if the M2 CSL or GTS drops.

[Shooto82]

https://youtu.be/SRzHWv15AlU

Acceleration up to 200km. Strangely 1M is faster . It could be tuned